Short ejector rod on Richards Type II

[Abilene]

Regarding the short ejector rod on the Cimarron Type II Richards.  I mentioned before that Mike Harvey's original that Uberti copied had the short ejector.  Here is an update from Mr. Harvey. 

For a short term fix to help eject empties, not really a fix, but it helps a bit, you can cut a few coils off of the ejector spring.  This will let the rod extend through the cylinder just a tad more and might help a little.

For the long term fix, Uberti is making a batch of full length ejector rods for Cimarron.  Anyone who has already bought a Richards II with the short ejector rod will be able to contact Cimarron and will be sent a longer rod.

My suggestion:  Right now Kirk (parts guy) is on vacation and Marcy just took off for maternity leave, and Robert and Chris are both leaving tomorrow for two weeks on the road, so I'd suggest not calling right away to be put "on the list" for a new rod since staffing is very short handed for a few weeks.  When the rods show up I'll post an update to this post.

thanks,
Abilene (who will someday buy a 44 Spcl Type II  )

[Fox Creek Kid]

Great idea as they are definitely too short. I am looking into having a buddy make me some for mine. Per my calculations they need to be approx. 0.60" - 0.65" longer. As a note, if it took them almost TWO YEARS to make the guns then how long for new ejector rods? 

[Abilene]

I'm told they are putting a rush on this, should be pretty quickly and then fed-exing them instead of adding them to a gun shipment.  Or so they say, anyway   

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[Pettifogger]

Thanks for the information.  I measured the rods and they have an 8-36 thread pitch.  I was going to get some drill rod and order the die and make some for mine, but I'll wait for your post.

[Fox Creek Kid]

Pettifogger, I took an ejector rod to Lowe's and it did not match any of their metric test nuts.    What is the exact nomenclature for the threads & pitch as I may have to buy a metric tap or just tap out the ejector for the next largest SAE thread.

[Pettifogger]

It's not metric.  It's a number 8 NF thread.  8-36.  Look at Brownell's catalog, they have them.

[Fox Creek Kid]

Thanks. 

[Fox Creek Kid]

Petifogger, I decided to be more authentic and drilled out the breech end of the ejector tube with a 1/4" bit and polished the area. I am having a machinist buddy make new rods from 1/4" stock as that was what the originals were. The Uberti rod is 0.215 approx. I had to get some new springs from an online vendor that are approx. 0.312 OD and permit a 1/4" rod to run through it. He will thread the rods 8-36 NF tomorrow. If you want to do this to yours let me know as I can sell you a spring. I had to buy a box of 12 (minimum order  ). There is approx. 0.035 of "shoulder" inside the ejector tube on either side at the breech end so there is still plenty of room for the bigger spring to seat. 

[Pettifogger]

Mines a .45.  There is barely any clearance between the cylinder wall and rod with the factory rod.  If I increased the diameter I don't think it would clear.  In fact, I milled a flat on the part of the rod nearest the cylinder wall to make it easier to line everything up to eject.

[Fox Creek Kid]

Well, the new rods are a success!! Petifogger, I have to eject differently than normal. I rotate the cylinder but before it engages (clicks) start the ejector rod into the chamber & then punch out. Works for me as I really like these replacement rods. I have no camera so I cannot post photos. Granted, if a person is used to a SAA and emptying like they're being attacked by Comanches then it takes getting used to. 

[Pettifogger]

YeeHaa.  Wish you had a camera so I could have a look see.  I've got to finish some other projects and get mine out and give them complete action jobs, fix the arbor length and get everything else adjusted for competition.  I spent almost an hour just deburring one ejector housing and getting everything smooth and polished so it didn't feel like the ejector had sand in it when ejecting shells.  I'll make new rods if Cimarron doesn't get replacements pretty soon.  One of mine was acting funny.  Got a small light out and a probe and found a "burr" 1/4" wide and 5/8" long in one of them!!!  Was curled up like a party whistle inside the frame.

[Abilene]

Cimarron has received the new longer rods from Uberti.

Those who own a transition Richards with the short rod and want the longer one can call Cimarron and request the long rod. 

I know some of you folks who have owned OT's and conversions already know how to change the rod, but some pards may not know that the finger tab at the end is screwed onto the rod.  In case you don't know how to change the part, it can be little more involved than an SAA.  First, take off the barrel.  Then remove the forward-most screw on the barrel which secures the ejector housing.  To remove the ejector housing, you will probably need to use a brass punch or wooden dowel and drive the housing out from the rear, putting force on the cylindrical portion of the bracket that is seated in the rammer hole directly below the bore.  Don't strike or use any force on the tubular ejectyor housing itself as it can be deformed.  If the bracket is really tight in the rammer hole, it might help to soak it overnight in penetrating oil.  Once the ejector assembly is free of the barrel, the nut (the tab that you push with your finger to eject rounds) must be unscrewed from the end of the rod.  The threads can be very tight, so you will likely have to push the ejector rod out until the end of the rod is free from the housing and then secure the end of the rod in a padded vice.  Then unscrew the nut (finger tab)  from the end of the rod (you will be rotating the entire ejector assembly around the axis of the rod as you turn the nut).  After doing this, the nut can be removed siideways from the ejector housing at the forward end of the slot.  Once the nut is out, the spring will try to fly out of the open forward end of the housing.  Release the rear end of the rod from the vice and slide it out of the housing; place the longer rod into the housing, then the spring.  then put the nut back in and screw it back onto the rod.  You will need to compress the spring with a small screwdriver or similar throigh the slot to keep it out of the way while you start the rod to thread into the nut.  Screw it in tight and then replace the bracket into the rammer slot.  Again, don't put any force on the ejector housing itself.  Use a rubber hammer on the front of the bracket if needed at the point where it slides into the rammer hole.

That's pretty wordy, would have been better to have pictures  .  To tell the truth, you could probably  change the rod without removing the ejector assembly from the barrel.

EDIT 2/14/08:  After replacing about a half dozen or so rods, I can say that you definitely don't have to remove the ejector assembly from the barrel.  All you have to do is remove the barrel, push on the ejector until the end of the rod is an inch or so past the back of the barrel, clamp the end of the rod in a vice or just grab it with pliers and start to unscrew it from the "nut" or finger button.  Once the threads break lose you can unscrew it by hand.  Pull it out and slip in the new rod and screw it back in to the finger button.  Takes only a few seconds.  If you ask for the new longer rod you will probably be sent a new spring as well, since Uberti sent those with the new rods, but you really don't need to replace the spring unless you want to, the original spring works fine.

If your ejector feels rougn like Pettifogger mentioned (a lot of them feel that way at first), you might want to smooth the edges of the slot while you have the rod and spring removed.

Hope that helps!

[Pappy Hayes]

What is the issue with the short rod? I know when I try to eject the empties, it puchase it out put pulls it back in when I release the ejector rod. I am sending mine back right now to Cimarron as it has other issues. It seemed to jam on the cartridge rims and the cylinder drags on the water table of the frame when you rotate the cylinder and it also drags on it when sliding it back on after cleaning. Fox Creek Kid in another post I put on talking about my issues said to get in contact with you.

[Fox Creek Kid]

Check your mail, Pappy. 

[Pappy Hayes]

Fox Creek Kid, how do I get a hold of Abilene? I saw your post on mine. I was putting my post on Abilene's on the short rods to see he would answer me.

[Fox Creek Kid]

He'll be along here in a day or so I'm sure.    Send him a PM if you like.

[Abilene]

Pappy, the issue with the short rods is that they don't work very well    If your loads stick a bit in the chamber the rod won't punch them out.

I've changed out a few rods in the past few days and did not have to remove the ejector housing from the barrel.  I was also able to unscrew the rod from the nut by hand on a couple of them without holding the end of the rod in a vice.

[Pettifogger]

Yee Haa!.  My new rods came in today's mail from Cimarron.  I called them earlier this week.  All they need to know is the model number and serial number and they will send you the new rods.  I was surprised that they also sent new springs.  The new rod is about perfect, it goes right to the end of the barrel where the forcing cone section of the barrel starts.  The new springs seem to be thinner wire with wider coil spacing so the rod will come out even further.  Ought to work great when I get them installed.

[Pappy Hayes]

Abilene I sent you a PM. Did you get it?

[Fox Creek Kid]

Pettifogger, can you post a photo of the new rod on the gun?