Another Solomon Butcher photo

[Delmonico]

EDIT

This was in another thread in the NCOWS Chambers and Lonegunman split it and moved it out here for us all to ponder.

OK, I have been going to toss another one in the pot, but have been waiting for the right time and it has arrived.   

I am surprised no one has noticed the fella in the background of my new signiture photo.  Yes another Butcher photo, one of his "staged" ones yes, they are clearing marked as such.  Date given as 1889, I do notice the one fellas gun is a DA, haven't pinned down exactly which one yet, so the date might be not exact but rather the date of a real event.  (Most of his staged ones were around 1901-1902)  But no newer than 1912. 

Now since it is staged, maybe this guy ain't really a cowboy, but on the other hand I doubt they would have made a pair of chaps for him just for the photo and they are big enough for him.

I toss it out for fun and comments, is this our first photo of a shall we say a "rotund" cowboy.



I will add there are two similar but different pictures.

12636 is the one I cropped for my sig picture.



And 12635 is the other one.




http://memory.loc.gov/ammem/award98/nbhihtml/pshome.html and typing either # into the search will allow you to bring up the full resaloution picture of either, both are about 2 meg and can't be put up here at the level.

BTW it's all Riders In The Sky's fault I went back to this picture, you know the Cowboy ABC song, V is for Varmint Dance.   It gave me the idea for my Sig picture.

[Ol Gabe]

Not to hijack the thread but Del 'opened the Ball' already...
Interesting comments Del, did you also notice the four men standing and wearing light-colored hats, all the hats have 4 dimples in them? And the feller in the dark hat leaning against the wall/door looks to have a square-blocked hat. Do you suppose this is one of his Cowboy Show pics?
Best regards and "...it ain't over til the fat Cowboy sings!"
'Ol Gabe

[Irish Dave]

I may be mistaken, but the DA revolver appears to have a swing-out cylinder.

[Advertising]

[RRio]

I may be mistaken, but the DA revolver appears to have a swing-out cylinder.

Is the photo reversed? I do not see a latch. Sure would like to know what it is.

[Delmonico]

I checked, the photo isn't reversed and is hard to do on a glass plate negative if you know what you are doing and John Carter is good.  I also saw another strange in it, but will wait to see of anyone else sees it.

Photo 12636 if anyone wants to check it out all the way.

[Quick Fire]

The old boy holdin the gun has a left back pocket on his britches.

[Quick Fire]

Looking at an enlarged photo the dude second from the left has the strangest looking pair of overalls I've ever seen, and the guy laying down has a womans hat on.

[Books OToole]

The old boy holdin the gun has a left back pocket on his britches.

But no belt loops.



Books

[Delmonico]

I'm going to move the photo to the open forum in just a bit, didn't think it would hijack it this much.

[Lone Gunman]

The double action revolver appears to be an Iver Johnson model 1900, which was first produced in (guess what ) 1900. This model required that the cylinder pin be removed and the cylinder taken out for loading/unloading...hence no latch. That date might explain some of the other items in the photo that likely wouldn't appear in 1889.

[Delmonico]

I was going to guess IV or H&R, Butcher did not keep good notes on his "renactment" pictures and I would hazard a guess it was an event that happened somewhere in 1889.

[Ottawa Creek Bill]

Looking at the close up photo that LG posted...that pistol has had some use....I would hazard to say that the photo was taken well after 1889 or 1900.....You mean Butcher may have made a mistake in the date of the photo?

OCB

[Delmonico]

Read my post above on his notes.

[Quick Fire]

I don't know if this makes a difference but the two hammers of your comparison guns are completely different George.

[Major 2]

Just looking in here ...anybody notice the revolver on the ground ?

looks like a top break H&R or Iver Johnson

[Ol Gabe]

Yeah, M2, I did!
And something else...the barrel in the first 'dancing' pic appears to have a line around it indicating an extension of some sort? Of course, this may be just a way of having a short-bbl'd revolver similar to the one L.G. suggested but modified to look like the 'real deal' for shooting blanks in a 'Cowboy Show', hmmm? Well, maybe, maybe not, but I don't recall ever seeing any with that type of 'ring' around the bbl, it'll be interesting to see if anyone has seen one like that.
Also, the guy in the first pic that is shooting and then is standing in the back in the second pic is a dead ringer for NCOWS own, the 'Bristow Kid'! GO get'em B.K.!
Best regards and good researching !
'Ol Gabe

[Delmonico]

My take on the pistol and need to enhance it some when I get home is it has a part octogon part round barrel.

BTW a friend noticed when I first put the photo in my sig, the guy on the ground, the same one dancing in the second photo, kind of looks like the late Dale Earnhart of NASCAR fame.

[Delmonico]

Just looking in here ...anybody notice the revolver on the ground ?

looks like a top break H&R or Iver Johnson

[Major 2]

OK Now I think it's a S&W DA 38 5 shot w/ either a 3 1/2 or 4" barrel...1909 -1920
still it could be a  I. J or H&R in 32 or 38 ...

The close up of the one in his hand resembles a Colt 1905 Marine Corp 38 DA with those long bolt ramps 

I know that throws the date Kabluie 

[Delmonico]

Anything up to 1912 is possible, like I said his "renactment" pictures he didn't keep good notes on.  He was looking to illistrate a rumored second book that was never produced.  Since many real events were not photographed he was trying to come up with pictures to depict it, a common practice.

How ever as to it being the Colt 1905 it don't have a thumb latch.