My New-Old Webley.

[Captain John Jarrett]

Gents,

  Floating someplace around here is my post looking for a double action for the shoots. Well here is the Webley I found and if I do say so myself she is a keeper. It also had the original(?) holster with it. Enjoy!

[Will Ketchum]

Very Nice Captain John!   Where did you find that Gem?

Will Ketchum

[French Jack]

You ARE intending to BRING it to our shoot next month, I hope!  You are intending on using it aren't you?  If it is not for using, I know where it can find a new home.
  ///

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[Irish Dave]

That's a daisy.

[O.T. Buchannan]

Very nice gun!  I have a Mark 1, which is the same gun, just the first model of it.  I can't tell from the photo, but yours is either a Mark 2,3,4, or 5.  The Mark Six (VI) is the definite WWI model.  I'm currently working on an article on the Webley revolvers for 'The Shootist.'

Is yours in the original .455 calibre, or has it been altered for .45 ACP/Auto Rim?  My Mark I is altered, so I will use .45 Auto Rim cartridges in it.

There is also ANOTHER Mark IV, which was manufactured by both Enfield and Webley, and it is the definitive WWII model, in .38 calibre....not to be confused with the earlier Mark IV which was in .455 calibre.....

The British can be confusing like that, don't you know....

Anyway, enough of my rambling, you've got a nice gun!  You are also fortunate in having an original holster!  Good show chap, bloody good show!!!! 

[Captain John Jarrett]

Gents,

    First off the new addition would like to thank you all for your kind words, at 91 she still feels like a spring chicken.   

  But seriously, I found it on the web at  http://www.joesalter.com/index.html   , called them up the next day and told them I would take it. Faxed my dealers FFL and my credit info and had it in my grubby little hands this Wednesday. The bore is in pristine condition almost looks like it was made last week,top strap and cylinder lockup like a bank vault and the holster is in great condition also with the exception of the original toe plug is missing.

   Heck ya I'm going to bring it and shoot it at the upcoming match (and wearin my new hat also), going to have to get a couple of boxes of ammo for it first.

  It is an unaltered  Mk.V .455 , and the ammo is quite pricey, but until I set up for reloading I will have to "bite the bullet" so to speak. This site  http://www.aimsurplus.com/acatalog/455_Webley.html  has about the best price I have found for the factory ammo. Will most likely order from them so that I have in time for the next shoot.

 O.T  I look forward to reading your upcoming article on the Webley's.

Capt. John

[Sir Charles deMouton-Black]

Captain John;   My son & I both have Mark VI's.  lots of fun.  FIOCCHI makes ammo, but pricey.  You can use .455 Webley, or .450 Corto, (means "short" - same as the original .450 Adams)  If yours is an older Mark, stick with Black!

To make your own cases, you can go from .45 Colt, or .45 Auto Rim.  The new .45 Cowboy Special would save the shortening.  Thin the rims to .035.  Best to use a lathe, but i have done some with a three corner file with one side ground safe.  Shorten the Colt case with a small tube cutter, and trim to .45 Acp length.  The mark I case is a touch shorter than .45 Acp, but Webley chambers are tapered and will take the extra .02 of length. 

Load with 45 Acp dies, but the .45 Colt sizer is best for the sizing operation.  See PET LOADS for data.  Best results are with a hollowbase bullet.  NEI makes one for the Webley, but my Lyman 450229 shoots amazing groups. I use 21 Grains of Goex FFF with the lyman bullet.   Don't bother with Mil Surplus Mark II jacketted ammo, except the rarely seen Canadian issue.  Accuracy is dismal, and the cases are berdan primed.

[Captain John Jarrett]

Sir Charles,

  Thank you for the loading information, I will write this down for further use. If I am not mistaken (and if I am someone please let me know) the Mk. V was the first Webley proofed specific for smokeless powder. Mine has a patent date of 1915 so I am fairly certain it will handle the smokeless load.

  Browsing around I found Buffalo Arms and they carry correct headstamp .455:
 
         http://www.buffaloarms.com/browse.cfm/4,3862.htm

  I may order some of this when I am ready to reload and thought you might like to give it a try also.


Capt. John

[Captain John Jarrett]

A couple more pics......

[French Jack]

Buffalo Arms has everything you need to reload the .455--- brass, bullets, dies.  I am not surprised that they also have loaded ammo.  They are first class people to deal with.

[Sir Charles deMouton-Black]

I just searched Buffalo Arms.  Their cases are the shorter Mark II cases of .755 length, designed for smokeless.  For a good load in The Holy Black the Mark I case, with the .87 case length will allow a 18 - 20 Grain load of FFF.  Do a topic search and you will find other references to the Webley.

There is a thread in the BOSS special interest site on the Wbley.

CAUTION;  Don't use .45 ACP loads in a Webley.  There is too much pressure.  Go low, to about 600 - 650 fps.

[O.T. Buchannan]

Captain Jarrett, they were also rated for various smokeless loads a little earlier, and I will include the information in the upcoming article.  Still, my Mark I was prior to Webley upgrading the guns for smokeless (that is what the various marks are for, those upgrades), so I will stick with blackpowder in mine.

I also have a Webley RIC (an earlier, solid frame gun) in .450 Adams, and I fire blackpowder in that.  However, my Webley-Green Target is of later manufacturer, in the smokeless era (with smokeless era proof marks on it) so I fire a smokeless load in it.  However, the WG-Target (called by some a Webley-Government) was converted to .45 Colt, so I load a .45 Schofield case, but downloaded to .455 Webley ballistics.....     

[Captain John Jarrett]

O.T.,

     Man,  I sure would like to see your collection of Webley's in person.  I found a RIC in .450 about the time I saw this Mk. V and had to make a choice, figured that quite a few of the .455's had been converted to .45acp so the chances of finding another as nice as this might be slim, so here we are. The next revolver I purchase will be a RIC in .450, as soon as the money will allow, hope to find one in as nice a mechanical condition as my Webley.

Capt. John

[Montana Slim]

Capt. John,

Very nice find, congratulations!

Slim

[French Jack]

Buffalo Arms also has the .890 length brass.  Actually, there are three cases that can be used:  the 45 Webley at .820, and the 455 Webley at .755 and .890.  In a pinch 45 Auto Rim cases or 45 Schofield brass can be reworked to fit.

[Books OToole]

I was out antiquing this weekend and stumbled into a Webley flare pistol.  It looked just about the same a Capt. Jarrett's execpt it is brass framed and barrelled.  I passed as I didn't need a flare gun and I figuared it was 20th century.  Is $ 125.00 a fair price?

Books

[O.T. Buchannan]

Well Books, I don't know if $125 is a fair price or not on a flare pistol.  However, you realize that if you ever do really NEED a flare gun, you are going to need it real bad?....

[Will Ketchum]

Besides Books you know those things are deadly accurate.  Have you ever noticed how easy it is for the hero in the movies to knock a helicopter out of the air or hit a speeding plane/boat/car!  It is truly amazing!

Will Ketchum

[Books OToole]

One of the unwritten rules at the KVC range is;  If you bring a new toy to show off, you have to bring ammo.

Where would you get ammo for a Webly flare pistol?

Books



("Some stupid, with a flare-gun, burned the place to the ground.")

[Grizzle Bear]

The 25 mm stuff isn't too hard to find.  You can also get an adaptor to shoot 12 guage stuff in your flare gun.

Maybe I'll bring my M8 37mm down and shoot a flare or two.  The flares are about $5 each.

Grizzle Bear

And yes, I do like unusual firearms!

Sometime I'll tell you about reloading a LAW tube.............