.44 Russian in 44-40?

[greyhawk]

He's just usin primers and wax. No powdah.
wM1
PS works great

Thats takin pipsqueak loads just too far - I wanna make yr ears ring n fill the joint wid smoke

seriously - might be I gotta figure somethin out - its + 42 degrees celcius out there right now (thats like 108 your numbers) - a decent charge of blackpowder would like to set the place alight

[Professor Marvel]

Thats takin pipsqueak loads just too far - I wanna make yr ears ring n fill the joint wid smoke

seriously - might be I gotta figure somethin out - its + 42 degrees celcius out there right now (thats like 108 your numbers) - a decent charge of blackpowder would like to set the place alight

Oh I am jonesing for a CAS match. I currently am running a recovery ward for 2 sick cats and a Lovely Spousal Unit still
recovering from back surgery...

old time indoor gallery load: drill out the primer hole (make sure there's enough left...) use the hottest large pistol primer you can find, and a wax or Hot Glue bullet. shoot into a cardboard box of rags at the end of the room. If She Who Must Be Obeyed is home, shoot in the garage. Hot glue bullets are remarkably accurate, easy to cast, and re-usable.

Also going to fire up the gas-blowback airsoft 1911 in the garage.

I set up a mini CAS range with round knock-downs:
steel soup can lids held upright with tiny magnets on a piece of angle iron.

airsoft pellets knock em right down, Glue bullets knock em across the garage.
Walmart has airsoft 1873 SAA and airsoft S&W Schofields .....

I also Drilled out ONE set of OEM italien nipples. I am polishing them bright for ID. They fit all my .36's and .44's
both remmies and colts. a hot percussion cap drives a hot glue round ball or hot glue bullet right thru a 3/4 inch piece
of rigid insulation foam.
 
THAT's bored....

If I could afford a suppressor I would rnt a Bobcat and move some dirt to set up a range on the secluded downhill part of our little spread. I already have an 1873  trapdoor  "parts rifle" that the prior owner threaded the barrel ( and I keep wondering why...
a suppressed 45-70?)

yhs
prof marvel

[wildman1]

Thats takin pipsqueak loads just too far - I wanna make yr ears ring n fill the joint wid smoke

seriously - might be I gotta figure somethin out - its + 42 degrees celcius out there right now (thats like 108 your numbers) - a decent charge of blackpowder would like to set the place alight

Ya just gotta make your self some lube cookies about 1/4" to 1/3" thick press em into the case then prime em if you prime first the darn things won't stay seated. A medium soft lube cookie will go thru both sides of a cardboard box at 15' using a regular primer.
wM1

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[major]

Back when I was shooting NSSA besides shooting Musket I also shot in the Henry catagory.  I tried using 44 Russian cartridges in my 1860 Henry, with a modified carrier block because I could get and extra 2 rounds in the magazine of my 44-40.  This would provide a competive advantage because I could shoot faster and longer they the others. They worked but were more trouble than I needed.  Every thing was in good old Black powder.  I don't know if accuracy was effected becaise I tried them in a gun that had not been sighted in yet.  I was just trying to see if they would cycle and how much blow back I would get.

[Scattered Thumbs]

Ya know, Venturino is just a gun writer. That doesn't make him an authority. Heck I was a gun writer for 7 years and I'm nobody's authority. I believe the correct designation is "45 Colt" because that's how it started out. This "Long" business didn't come along until sometime after the Schofield round was adopted. Since the original designation was "45 Colt" why isn't "45 Short" more correct for the Schofield???

Dave

Because it's called .45 Smith & Wesson.

[PJ Hardtack]

So, how much blow back did you get with BP using .44 Russian in your 44-40 Henry? How were they more trouble?

Eventually I will try some in the 44-40 revolver - just because I can. On a scale of 1 to 10, that would be about a 1.5 for things I just had to try because .....

Back when I was shooting NSSA besides shooting Musket I also shot in the Henry catagory.  I tried using 44 Russian cartridges in my 1860 Henry, with a modified carrier block because I could get and extra 2 rounds in the magazine of my 44-40.  This would provide a competive advantage because I could shoot faster and longer they the others. They worked but were more trouble than I needed.  Every thing was in good old Black powder.  I don't know if accuracy was effected becaise I tried them in a gun that had not been sighted in yet.  I was just trying to see if they would cycle and how much blow back I would get.

[major]

So, how much blow back did you get with BP using .44 Russian in your 44-40 Henry? How were they more trouble?

It was 10 to 15 years ago but as I recall there wasn't any more blowback than with my 44-40 BP loads.   I never folowed up on the idea because there was some question with the small armes chairman about the legality of the modifacation.

[PJ Hardtack]

Shot some .44 Russian loads in my wife's 44-40 Uberti revolver today with two different powders.

One load was 3.5 Tite Group, t'other 3.5 700X. Same bullet - Lyman 427666 200 RNFP. The Tite Group felt a little gentler.

Accuracy with both was excellent at 10 yds. Both printed 2" groups about 4" above point of aim.

There was minimal case deformation. You have to feel with your fingers to notice it on some cases. Others appeared unaffected. Blow by (case smudging) was next to nothing, about as much as I get with 4.0 grs Tite Group in my .45 ACP loads out of my Commanders.

The hits on the primers were off centre by the amount of the case dimension difference - few thousands of an inch.

From what I see, it's a non-issue.

[greyhawk]

Shot some .44 Russian loads in my wife's 44-40 Uberti revolver today with two different powders.

One load was 3.5 Tite Group, t'other 3.5 700X. Same bullet - Lyman 427666 200 RNFP. The Tite Group felt a little gentler.

Accuracy with both was excellent at 10 yds. Both printed 2" groups about 4" above point of aim.

There was minimal case deformation. You have to feel with your fingers to notice it on some cases. Others appeared unaffected. Blow by (case smudging) was next to nothing, about as much as I get with 4.0 grs Tite Group in my .45 ACP loads out of my Commanders.

The hits on the primers were off centre by the amount of the case dimension difference - few thousands of an inch.

44/40 brass is plentiful and cheap - I am mystified why u would wanna stuff around with misfitting shells
cuz ya can ? I guess thats a reason ...................?

From what I see, it's a non-issue.

[Sir Charles deMouton-Black]

'Cause, with a modified carrier block you can "Load on Sunday and shoot all week"!

I have plenty of .44-40 cases, but also some .44 Russ that I use in my Reichsrevolver. Here in The Great White North, I have never seen a .44 Spl levergun!? and it seems like a good idea to try. I have the technology.

[PJ Hardtack]

Why would I want to use "misfitting shells" other than because I can? Fair question to which I reply - "Why not?"

My wife shoots a pair of Ruger Blackhawks in .44 Spl. and we quickly learned that she was intimidated by .44 Spl. loads. At the time I owned a Uberti .44 Russian revolver, so she tried them and decided they were better.

Then she bought herself a Uberti SAA in 44-40 that was tarted up with some factory gold filled engraving. My 44-40 carbine loads would not even chamber until I discovered that the gun required .427 bullets. She found it a little intimidating with 6 grs of Red Dot under a 200 gr RNFP and I was reluctant to reduce the powder charge in such a long cartridge. I've read that doing so in .45 Colt causes erratic ignition.

So, having a supply of .44 Russian brass on hand and the dimensions being reasonably close, it seemed logical to give them a go in her 44-40. The worst thing that could happen would be a few bulged cases smeared with blow by powder residue.

It also bothered me that the dire warnings about doing it came from people with no actual experience in doing so, the fact that another poster modified his 44-40 Henry to accept .44 Russian brass notwithstanding.

I refer you to "Hatcher's Notebook" where Gen. Julian Hatcher relates firing .380 ACP rds in a Luger P-08 and a P-38. Allegedly, according to the 'sperts', ideally, the 9mm headspaces on the case mouth like the .45 ACP. Hartcher proved that the extractor held the 9mm rds in place for ignition. The low powered .380 rds required manual operation of the slide to eject, but he said they were fun to plink with and no harm came to him or the guns.

As for the cheapness of 44-40 brass, I just paid $229.97 (taxes and S&H included, + 4% for using my Mastercard) for 500 44-40 cases. I don't regard that as particularly cheap.

Will I continue to do this? Not if I suffer severe case loss. If all goes well and my wife shoots them well, perhaps.

Thanks for asking.

[major]

As for the cheapness of 44-40 brass, I just paid $229.97 (taxes and S&H included, + 4% for using my Mastercard) for 500 44-40 cases. I don't regard that as particularly cheap.

I don't know where you are buying you 44-40 brass from but I just purchased 1000 44-40 new brass from Starline for $199 shipped to my door.

[PJ Hardtack]

First I'm challenged on the validity of my ammo experiment, now I'm challenged on my brass purchase.

The base price for 500 44-40 cases was $175.99, plus 12% PST and GST, plus 4% for using a credit card, plus S&H. It adds up, doesn't it?
The dealer was Rusty Wood Trading Company, one of our main CAS suppliers.

I like in Kanuckistan. Your country does not allow the exporting of brass across the DMZ. Even if it was allowed, I'd have the dollar difference, S&H plus duty when it arrived. If you want to shoot in the "True North, strong and free ..." you have to be willing to pay for it.

My options are limited and you take what you can get.

[major]

PJ
Sorry I didn't realize that you were not in the US.  There is no location shown on your posts info.  I can see now how shipping out of the US could make the brass much more expensive.

[PJ Hardtack]

There are a handful of Kanuckistanis on the Cas City forum, one of them a mod. Maybe we need to flaunt the Maple Leaf as our logo.

We envy our US compadres the availability of cheaper outlets that we can only dream of. Wholesale Sports, one of our major outdoor/shooting sports stores recently folded. We are hoping that Bass Pro, Cabelas or some other US chain moves in to fill the void.

[greyhawk]

First I'm challenged on the validity of my ammo experiment, now I'm challenged on my brass purchase.

The base price for 500 44-40 cases was $175.99, plus 12% PST and GST, plus 4% for using a credit card, plus S&H. It adds up, doesn't it?
The dealer was Rusty Wood Trading Company, one of our main CAS suppliers.

I like in Kanuckistan. Your country does not allow the exporting of brass across the DMZ. Even if it was allowed, I'd have the dollar difference, S&H plus duty when it arrived. If you want to shoot in the "True North, strong and free ..." you have to be willing to pay for it.

My options are limited and you take what you can get.

Aint that the truth !! (take wot ya can get)
Seems like we are not as hard done by downunder as we might first think - our exchange is 78 cents to US - Kanuckistan is aboot 83? - I think I could get 44/40 off my local dealer for under 50cents per - like you we not allowed direct import - dunno whose law that is but at our end an empty unprimed brass case is classed as ammunition and authorities assume it may erupt at any moment - worse again we are banned by US law (one of only two countries on earth I wuz told) from exporting a firearm to the US - what would that be about I dont know - I have an LC Smith shotgun and a couple old winchesters I thought might be a good way to pay for a trip - but its no go. Could sell em to a dealer in Kanuckistan and he could put em below the border - but all the profit goes up in red tape smoke

Will yr modified carrier still feed a 44/40 case ? I keep fergettin about you fellers that wanna shoot short barrel guns and then stash 10 where 8 is sposed ta fit - if this all works - ya could go whole hog n pull tha barrel -take a half inch off it and rechamber -

[PJ Hardtack]

T'ain't me whats got the Henry modified to feed .44 Russian. Doesn't sound like a bad idea in any case. Beats the hell out of one in .45 Colt.

Will yr modified carrier still feed a 44/40 case ? I keep fergettin about you fellers that wanna shoot short barrel guns and then stash 10 where 8 is sposed ta fit - if this all works - ya could go whole hog n pull tha barrel -take a half inch off it and rechamber -

[greyhawk]

T'ain't me whats got the Henry modified to feed .44 Russian. Doesn't sound like a bad idea in any case. Beats the hell out of one in .45 Colt.

ahhhhh got me wires crossed  - you were playin with a pistol werent ya ?

45 colt in a lever - yeah I am philopsophically opposed to the idea - (that means got no good reason but dont like it?) - the skinny rim is a potential problem - heavy case mouth another - I think Coffinmaker was blowin out 44/40 cases to fit a a '73 in 45 colt
lots of fun stuff goin on here .