38/40 -- 38WCF Reloading dies?????

[Black River Smith]

What do you use to resize the 38/40 correctly?

I read all the search results for 38/40 and I am aware of the shoulder issue with most of the dies.  I am waiting on a 38/40 Uberti SAA but have bought brass and dies early on.  The brass is starline.  The first set was Lee off of ebay.  When they arrived the sizer was shortened and I did not understand the issue at that time. The die still did not correct set the shoulder back enough.  I then got lucky and won a set of nice RCBS off of ebay.  Playing with these RCBS the neck still was not resizing to original (used shot 44/40 as test).  I then acquired a old lyman hammer die that works perfect but it scratches the brass, so need to polish, if possible.  I would rather have a standard press sizing die that works.

Saw the comment about the RCBS Scovill die but could not find any info on the RCBS site for custom dies.  Anyone know the price for this die?

Any helpful comments are appreciated.

[Trailrider]

You say the RCBS resizing die wasn't resizing "back to the original". The question is whether the die is sizing the brass enough to chamber in the gun. The cartridge dimensions in the WCF cartridges often were quite different from the chambers. If the old Lyman "hammer" die is resizing the brass so it fits in the chamber, then the question is, after resizing in the Lyman die, does the round chamber and what happens after the round is fired the next time. Does the case require sizing that only the Lyman die will do? If not, then it may only be necessary to run the brass through the Lyman die initially. As far as the scratches are concerned, you may need to polish the inside of the Lyman die. An alternative is to fire three or four round in you particular gun, and send the fired cases to RCBS and have them make a sizing die. They may only need to modify you existing sizing die.

[Mike]

I have a set of RCBS cowboy dies for my loading of 38WCF. The work fine in a ASM SAA and my Uberti 73, they never look like the factory ammo i bought but slied into both guns. I use winchester and Starline brass and 44WCF brass when i could not get 38WCF.

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[Sir Charles deMouton-Black]

Don't worry about this. It becomes a non-issue, based on a mysterious  cause.

My guess is that the gun designers wanted to have a crimp under the bullet to prevent bullets being driven into cases in the magazine tube, while gunmakers wanted maximum case capacity.  The die makers tried to keep both camps content, if not happy, and the dies make cases that fit all firearms chambered for this caliber.

So what if a fired case looks different from a a factory loaded round.  Just load up those muscle-necked beauties and have fun.

[Mike]

I agree, more importantly get the correct bullet with the crimp grove in the correct place.

[August]

I've used Redding, RCBS, and Hornady dies in 38 W.C.F. caliber.  The RCBS were wholly unsatisfactory for me.  The Redding sized more to the pistol chamber configuration, but not compatible with the rifle for me.  The Hornady size to the "old" factory cartridge standard of long-gentle taper.  The Hornady work in all the guns without issues.  I do have to lubricate sufficiently with the Hornady dies and have settled on One Shot as the solution to (for) the problem (pun intended).

The best bullet I've found is the Bear Creek as it has the crimp groove very far forward and makes a round that runs quickly and smoothly through the rifle. 

Bullet manufacturer seem more concerned about case volume than correct OAL as their lawyers tell them to avoid taking up room inside the cartridge.  I've tried several 38 W.C.F. bullets of this sort that could not be made to work consistently.  YMMV, I suppose.

[Ranch 13]

I have a set of the Hornady dies, and they work very well. Doesn't matter if it's the Marlin 89, the Colt model P, or the bisley clone.
I like the rcbs 180 gr bullet cast from 16-1 alloy.

[Black River Smith]

Thanks for all the comments.  Since it will be the only 38/40 the brass has to work in, I will just wait and see how they size out in the chambers.

[Navy Six]

I've got seven guns chambered for the 38-40--two Colt SAAs of recent vintage, two Uberti Cattlemen and three Uberti lever actions(two 66s and a 73). Using a standard set of RCBS 38-40 dies along with a Lyman #401043 bullet sized .401, these rounds chambered in every gun listed above EXCEPT the two Uberti single actions. They weren't even close to chambering because the shoulder had not been set back far enough when going through the resizing die. After ordering the Scovill die, everything went smoothly. Following Mike Venturino's writing over the years proved I wasn't the only one to run into this anomaly, and the chambering issue appeared across the board regardless of manufacturer of dies and guns.
Black River Smith, all I did was call the regular RCBS phone number(don't have it handy) and told them I wanted to order a custom die. If still interested, the part number is 55010 "38-40 SCOVILL FL SIZER"

[Montana Slim]

I load 44-40 & my Dad loads 38-40, both of us use Lee Die sets. Worked fine with our rifles, but as usual, the revolvers tend to have tighter chambers & the dies would not push the shoulder down quite far enough. Contacted Lee customer service who is familiar with these issues....& shipped the sizing dies to them, they trimmed around .015-.020 off the bottom of the die. No charge except for our cost to ship them to Lee. I have other dies that needed similar modification since then..I now just use a coarse stone & remove material manually to the same effect.

Factory smokeless ammunition is sized to the smallest size so as to fit the smallest sized chambers, and they pay extra atention to be sure the bullet can't set-back, sometimes by using an additional crimp at the base of the bullet.


Slim