US Fire Arms Co. Collectability in the future?

[Capt. John Fitzgerald]

Finally, some enlightening information from GaryG (and we can only hope)!  Prior to that I think Doc said it best; "On the whole discussion of where people get their raw goods, is silly.  Every manufacturer today is getting something outsourced, they have to to be profitable."  It is silly!
If you build a house in Arizona using lumber that came from British Columbia, was your house made in Canada?

[Major 2]

Finally, some enlightening information from GaryG (and we can only hope)!  Prior to that I think Doc said it best; "On the whole discussion of where people get their raw goods, is silly.  Every manufacturer today is getting something outsourced, they have to to be profitable."  It is silly!
If you build a house in Arizona from lumber that came from British Columbia, was your house made in Canada?

exactly ! 

[Virginia Gentleman]

Maybe the Italian makers had USFA "rubbed out" of the market.....OK, OK I'll take the boos.

[Advertising]

[Deadeye Don]

If GaryG is actually Gary Granger I wonder what took him so long to finally respond to questions on this Forum.  Customers have been asking questions for years and nobody from USFA ever bothered to come here to dispell rumors an provide factual information.  Now that the company is apparently going under we hear from Gary??!  Wonderful.

[Gen. Jackson]

If GaryG is actually Gary Granger I wonder what took him so long to finally respond to questions on this Forum.  Customers have been asking questions for years and nobody from USFA ever bothered to come here to dispell rumors an provide factual information.  Now that the company is apparently going under we hear from Gary??!  Wonderful.

Well, he probably signed a non-disclosure agreement. That's why I asked if he was at liberty to give any info. - but I doubt he can for said reason.

[Doc Sunrise]

I find myself totally amazed. 

If I was a manager of a company, working like a mad man trying to make a company run smoothly, which is not being run as a typical business, my time is extremely limited, and being efficient really counts.  Making the time, let alone finding the desire, to speak out on this forum and expose myself to major criticism as well as the potential business liability, not to mention pissing off the boss, wouldn't be prudent or wise.  Do the numbers.  There are 75,000 SASS members, 7396 total CAS Forum members, 75 people actively on all CAS forums at the time I checked, and only 218 USFA members who have probably already secured a USFA gun.  Is the potential risk of saying something that may put my job at jeopardy an efficient way of spending my time for potentially reaching the 218 people that have more than likely already made a USFA purchase out of the possible 75,000 people with a better chance than John Q Public to do so but that probably haven't.  Let's see, that's less than 3/10ths of 1% of that potential market.  Oh for sure.  Putting aside everything else on my plate for this very high priority would be my very daily thought.

Not to mention as members, we finally have a door open to us that may shed some light on some of our questions as USFA forum members, but we start off by interrogating and placing the door opener on guard, who could just close the door.

I am a big USFA firearms fan, the gun not the company, and I have spoke to Gary G. several times over the past several years when ordering guns.  I welcome him to the forum and thank him for any info he may give to us to solidify our passion for these fine guns, as it surely appears they are going into the history books.  The more clarity we can obtain now will clear up any misinformation for the future, which ultimately will help us answer the question the original poster asked.

[Pettifogger]

Doc, you can actually cut your numbers in half.  SASS has no where near 75,000 members.

[Capt. John Fitzgerald]

Are we all aware of the fact that Gary Granger is no longer employed at USFA? 

[Gen. Jackson]

Are we all aware of the fact that Gary Granger is no longer employed at USFA?  

Yes, but DocSunrise was largely responding to Deadeye Don's statement regarding why Mr. Granger never said anything on this forum during his tenure at USFA. DocSunrise was speaking in a past-tense to get his point across.

Also, just because Gary Granger is a former employee does not mean that he did not sign a non-diclosure form before his departure. This is often a requirement when someone quits a high profile company or organization, which he did, and the company wishes to keep certain trade secrets, intellectual rights, avoid negative publicity, etc...

I certainly hope that he will post here again soon.

[Capt. John Fitzgerald]

Actually, Gary did, at one time, contribute to this forum on a fairly regular basis.  When USFA started a forum on their own web site he stopped.  When the USFA web site forum was shut down he never returned.  Gary signed on using the name "Banjoman."  I have also found him using the name "5string" on other sites (such as Gun Broker). 

[Gen. Jackson]

Actually, Gary did, at one time, contribute to this forum on a fairly regular basis.  When USFA started a forum on their own web site he stopped.  When the USFA web site forum was shut down he never returned.  Gary signed on using the name "Banjoman."  I have also found him using the name "5string" on other sites (such as Gun Broker). 

I see. I did not know that.

[GaryG]

Yes, GaryG is me late of USFA.  Not to much to tell except the days of the USFA SA are gone.  They may come back (just a speculation on my part) but with all of the parts subbed out which to me is not a bad idea and something that should have done years ago.  USFA figured out the most expensive way to make the SA and stuck with it.  Most notably would probably the machine and labor costs.  All the blueprints and computer programs are ready to go should Doug decide to bring back the SA in a production run that’s more suited with current and future demand.  As someone pointed out in an earlier post, there isn’t many people left.  I’m surprised he counted 5 cars.    I know there’s probably some questions and I’ll answer them.  Some backed up with facts and some just a gut answer.
Gary

[Harley Starr]

Yes, GaryG is me late of USFA.  Not to much to tell except the days of the USFA SA are gone.  They may come back (just a speculation on my part) but with all of the parts subbed out which to me is not a bad idea and something that should have done years ago.  USFA figured out the most expensive way to make the SA and stuck with it.  Most notably would probably the machine and labor costs.  All the blueprints and computer programs are ready to go should Doug decide to bring back the SA in a production run that’s more suited with current and future demand.  As someone pointed out in an earlier post, there isn’t many people left.  I’m surprised he counted 5 cars.    I know there’s probably some questions and I’ll answer them.  Some backed up with facts and some just a gut answer.
Gary

Nice to hear from you Gary.

[Capt. John Fitzgerald]

Gary,
Welcome back to the forum!  Hopefully you won't get buried under too many questions.
Hope you are doing well.
CJF

[Deadeye Don]

Yes, GaryG is me late of USFA.  Not to much to tell except the days of the USFA SA are gone.  They may come back (just a speculation on my part) but with all of the parts subbed out which to me is not a bad idea and something that should have done years ago.  USFA figured out the most expensive way to make the SA and stuck with it.  Most notably would probably the machine and labor costs.  All the blueprints and computer programs are ready to go should Doug decide to bring back the SA in a production run that’s more suited with current and future demand.  As someone pointed out in an earlier post, there isn’t many people left.  I’m surprised he counted 5 cars.    I know there’s probably some questions and I’ll answer them.  Some backed up with facts and some just a gut answer.
Gary

1.  Why did the Remington project fall apart and why didn't USFA ever come out and tell loyal customers what happened?


2. Why did USFA venture into all those crazy projects such as the rainbow color SAA?

3.  How much input did you have regarding how things were run at USFA since you were basically the one that most of us had contact with?

[GaryG]

1. Why did the Remington project fall apart and why didn't USFA ever come out and tell loyal customers what happened?  Ans: ALL decisions on product came from the owner.  We were all surprised that the project didn’t move forward but were no apprised as to the reason.  I suspect it was a money issue between Rem & USFA.  I lobbied (unsuccessfully) to build the guns under the USFA banner.

2. Why did USFA venture into all those crazy projects such as the rainbow color SAA?  Ans:  The “rainbow” guns were built but in a full dome blue.  They were the Shooting master (357 mag) and the Sparrow Hawk (8 shot 327 Fed).  The “colors” came from the very top and none of the other employees had a say in the design.  Suffice it to say the only colored guns built were those in the announcement (4 or 5 total).

3. How much input did you have regarding how things were run at USFA since you were basically the one that most of us had contact with?  Ans: Zero

[Pettifogger]

Thanks for being so candid Gary.

[sack peterson]

Mr. Granger, you were an invaluable help to me on the phone last summer when I had a question about fitting black grips.  Many thanks.

About how many USFAs were made over 10 years?

BATF mfg report for 2010 shows kind of a lot of production, like 10k (maybe that references 2009).  Nonetheless, I never sensed all that product was out there.  Where’d it go?

About how many 12/22s got built?  I shoulda ordered one at the time…

[GaryG]

About how many USFAs were made over 10 years?  Ans.   I really don’t know but would guess annual production up until 2010 was 250-300/month.

BATF mfg report for 2010 shows kind of a lot of production, like 10k (maybe that references 2009). Nonetheless, I never sensed all that product was out there. Where’d it go?   Ans:  There was a period of time when non USFA product (non western type firearms) was moving thru USFA’s books.  Don’t know what the actual number was but that would account for the big bump in reporting.

About how many 12/22s got built? I shoulda ordered one at the time…   Ans:  The 12/22 shared the same serial number ranges as the the SA, Pre War, Plinker, Bisley, Omni etc.  For example 26222 could have a a SA, 26223, a Pre War, 26224 a 12/22, etc.  A separate book was not kept for the 12/22 so I wouldn’t even venture a guess.  OK, I’ll guess and say less than 10% of production over the time span of the 12/22 were 12/22s.

[Invinoveritas]

I have some Kies  engraved USFAs, and some of what I guess we're the last made including the 2  USS Shooting Team guns, and 2 of the ten 20th Anniversary guns . Seemed to my layman eye these late ones were still great quality .

Is it true there were supposed to be 20 , 20 th Anniversary guns but they ran out of parts?  Thanks, Gary