Winchester May Reintroduce The 1873

[Cliff Fendley]

If I were you, I'd hold off on the rifle until I talked to someone in the know at Win. as 1 in 26" won't shoot for sour apples with a short 200 gr. bullet IMO.

I'm not getting a Miroku, I ordered a Cimarron so I'm sure it will be 1 in 20 according to my other rifles. If it doesn't shoot long range I'll use it for other side matches or main match CAS and stick with my Henry or original 73 for long range.

It appears unless someone want's to have one lined or a custom barrel any new 73 rifle is going to have a fast rate of twist.

[Hill Beachy]

I used to think that, however I don't think they have sold that many in .357 Mag. to be frank. CAS is dying & not growing. It peaked circa. 2000. In the past with the reintro of the '86 & '95 they always made the fancy models first. I'd wager money they haven't sold 1,000 of the .357 model.

I have a friend who was at this year's SHOT Show and saw a limited edition high-grade 1873 that Winchester / Miroku will be introducing.  He was able to handle one of them, with fancy wood, very nice engraving, and extremely smooth action.  It is going to be a limited edition of about 250 Sporting Rifles in .44WCF.  He was very impressed and wanted to place an order on the spot, but was told that the entire production run had already been sold in advance. 

While certainly not as popular as the "plastic tactical" guns, there may well be a market for the 1873.  Time will tell. 

[Rowdy Fulcher]

Howdy
Has anyone got a 1873 in 44wcf yet .

[Advertising]

[Doug.38PR]

my NRA magazine came a few months back with this gun in it.  I lost interest when it said it was only in .38 and .357 Magnum.   That gun is mean't to be big bore.  .38 and .357 Magnum is for handguns

[Major 2]

my NRA magazine came a few months back with this gun in it.  I lost interest when it said it was only in .38 and .357 Magnum.   That gun is mean't to be big bore.  .38 and .357 Magnum is for handguns

Considering the lead time for the magazine , and the fact you said several Months back... That would be old Information.
44/40's are out now as well, though early run is sold out...

[Rowdy Fulcher]

Howdy
So the 44wcf are sold out . Sounds like they need to make MORE . I bet the Vintage Hunters are buying them . That 44wcf is a Excellent round .

[Rebel Dave]

I have been waiting to here from my LGS if they are available yet, in .44-40, so far I've heard nothing. I like the the 73s, but .38/.357 doesn't interest me, gotta be .44-40. Any body hears anything let us all know.

Rebel Dave

[Major 2]

Howdy
So the 44wcf are sold out .....

that's what was said at SHOT 

[Fox Creek Kid]

I'd wager that not ten of the first 250 44-40's will even be shot. Winchester collectors nabbed 'em.

[Cliff Fendley]

I'd wager that not ten of the first 250 44-40's will even be shot. Winchester collectors nabbed 'em.

I don't know about those numbers but there may be a lot of them not shot sense a lot of people seem to buy up commemorative models and such when they come out.

I never could understand that myself, you can buy a shootable original for about the same money if you just want a collectable and it will for sure hold it's value and go up in value over time.

For investing purposes, most of the time commemorative models don't appreciate all that much because there are too many of them kept in pristine condition, things that are true collectors items were never meant to be when they were made.

[PJ Hardtack]

Commemorative coins, commemorative guns, whatever ..... they have some intrinsic value, but once put into use, become just another used item.

The Winchester NWMP commemoratives and the Canadian Centennial models are cases in point. Interesting wall hangers, but ..... once fired, less valuable than my VG+ pre-64 '94, particularly if they don't come with the original factory box.

I had the same decision to make when I acquired my Uberti 1 0f 1,000 - keep it as a wall hanger or shoot it and enjoy it. I'm not able to own guns that I cannot shoot. Not sure I'd really want to.

An acquaintance 'invested' in a top quality British Mauser sporting rifle in .275 H&H (7mm Mauser). He couldn't bring himself to shoot it and even when he posted it for sale at considerably less than he paid for it, he couldn't move it. Basically, he's stuck with it, so he might as well enjoy it, IMHO.

Life is too short to shoot ugly guns, date homely women, eat domestic MILK chocolate, drink cheap beer, wine or whisky. Lord knows I've done a lot of those, but now I know better .... ;>)

[Cliff Fendley]

Keep in mind these are not commerative, they are not reproduction, they are a second generation of the 1873 model and will be in limited numbers. They will have extreme value at some point later in time.

We will never live to see that value. If they never make more than the 250 44wcf guns then they may have SOME collector value but if they keep offering them then the collector value is not going to be worth investing in other than to just say you have one. It's not going to hurt the value of it to shoot it

It can be disputed whether they are a reproduction, the company making them is not the same company that made the original 73 Winchester, in fact the company making them today does not even own the Winchester name, they just have the right's to use it.

Somewhat like the Colt second generation but even though the guns were Uberti assemble under contract and marketed by Colt. My uncle bought some of those back in the 70's thinking they would be a great investment. Even those guns to most serious Colt collectors are of no interest today. I have those guns now and all but one has been shot and get shot right along side my other Italian made revolvers. The only difference is they say Colt on the barrel instead of Uberti, Cimarron, etc.

Of the Winchester collectors I know including myself, very little from 1964 on is of interest to them for anything other than a firearm to take out and shoot. No real collector value is considered.

[Cliff Fendley]

Ranch 13, your talking old guns there, not modern production. A lot of old guns were sold off years ago in large lot cheap that are worth much more today.

20 years from now these new guns will go up in value about as much as it takes to replace them with a new current production one 20 years from now. No more.

No different than the current made Colt firearms, they don't immediately become some extreme value once you walk out of the gun store with it.

How much are the second generation percussion Colt firearms worth today? My uncle and a lot of folks bought them as an investment in the 70's. To a few people they are worth something if they are unfired with all the fancy box but they also cost way more than a Uberti did in the 70's. I bought a perfect condition Colt second generation 1861 at a gun show recently for about the same price as a Uberti. Bottom line is after 40 years they haven't become worth some EXTREME value as you mentioned above.

Don't expect to get rich investing in a modern production firearm.

[Mean Bob Mean]

I have never seen a Winchester Commerative that I would purchase.  Marring high grade wood with stamped medallions is, in my opinion only, assinine.  Often the "engraving" is somewhat amateurishly rendered (rolled) and they look cartoonish, not cool.  If they had made model 1894s in .38-55s and .32-40s with case coloring and those beautiful stocks without other crap, they'd be worth more today than the garish commerative versions. 

[Mean Bob Mean]

Guess I wasn't aware of anybody but Winchester making the model 1873 in Japan..

Perhaps it is the new standard arm of the Japanese military?

[Cliff Fendley]

I was referring the the 1917 and 1903's that you mentioned.

Regarding these NEW guns you speak of, a pre 64 Winchester is a real Winchester, not like the new made in Japan ones with permission to put the Winchester name on it. All these Guns you just mentioned were made by THE company whos name they display on their markings.

This new gun is NOT made by the same company, they could stamp Browning on a few if they want.

I have tractors that are worth more today than they sold for brand new, do they sell for more than a new one today, NO. The real reason they are worth more is one, because new ones cost more (inflation), and second, they are old and have nostalgia to them. That didn't make them a good investment when they were new. They were a tool, plain and simple.

Your missing the point, those old model Blackhawks don't sell for much more than a brand new one today, sure things go up in value because of inflation. You said EXTREME value, a dollar holding it's own is just a solid investment but not a money maker. All but the cheapest made guns are generally considered a solid investment.

Most things that are collectable were never meant to be when they were made.

[PJ Hardtack]

If you guys want a shock re: the cost of 'antiques;, check out the antiques forum on Canadian GunNutz. Yes, you can buy and sell there as an American, depending upon the category. Certainly 'antiques'. The rules are 'splained on the site.

Due to the quirkiness of Canadian law, a Canuck can own a certified pre-1898 'antique' pistol without holding a firearms licence. It can also be discharged anywhere we can legally discharge a long gun. This makes them very popular and has driven the price of 'antique' Colt's Webleys, Adams, etc. right through the roof, and I mean sky high!

Speculators are capitalizing on this. Even shaved Webleys that chamber .45 ACP or .45 AR, as these calibres are not exempt on a gun with a pre-1898 frame.

I didn't say that this made any sense, it's just the way it is.

[Abilene]

... These 73's are still Winchester, they are marked so on the barrel and they are the only ones that can legally use the the Winchester marks currently being built.

Well, speaking of markings, regardless of whether this is considered a "real" Winchester '73 or not, it is just a shame that they didn't put any effort at all into marking the rifles like the originals on the barrel and tang.  Just my opinion.

[Cliff Fendley]

So you say the guns made in New Haven after John Olin took over are not a Winchester but the ones made in Japan by Miroku are.

OK

I guess we'll have to agree to disagree.

If having the name Winchester on it mean that much, even though it says in huge block letters right on the side Made by Miroku-Japan, Winchester is a registered trademark, yada, yada, yada.

Abilene is absolutely correct, if they had bothered to at least try to mark the rifle somewhat like an original and dumb down the huge made in Japan-Miroku it would have helped.

Original 1873 rifles are marked in such small letters you have to look to read them and they are marked on the top of the barrel like the Cimarron. Not in a huge block letter on the side of the barrel.

At least the Cimarron rifles are marked in the same place and style of lettering the originals were and the tang stamp is also very close to the way originals are marked.

If a person is buying one because of the way they are marked and think it makes it more historically accurate needs to take a look at an original 73 rifle, from three three feet away the Cimarron/Uberti rifle is much more accurate looking than the Miroku.

[Major 2]

Settle down , I will not tolerate the name calling ... nice n it up !