Millington/ ArmSport LLC Remington Conversions

[Jake MacReedy]

I just traded into a pair of Bob Millington's Remington New Model Army Conversions.  They're the ones with the thin conversion plates, no loading gate, but with the loading channels, and with the Remington-style ejector rod (like the original .44 Colt, 6-shot converions).  
Jake

[Fox Creek Kid]

Man I envy you!!    It`s too bad that Kirst can`t offer an authentic conversion like this.

[Raven]

Kirst Konverter LLC /Kirst & Strite/ Ravens Roost can build virtually any historical conversion you desire.
We build Remington New Model Armies and Navies, Colt First Model Richards, LeMat and will soon be able to offer Colt Thuer revolvers.

Raven AKA Jay Strite
Kirst & Strite/ Kirst Konverter LLC

[Advertising]

[Harley Starr]

Kirst Konverter LLC /Kirst & Strite/ Ravens Roost can build virtually any historical conversion you desire.
We build Remington New Model Armies and Navies, Colt First Model Richards, LeMat and will soon be able to offer Colt Thuer revolvers.

Raven AKA Jay Strite
Kirst & Strite/ Kirst Konverter LLC

Would be cool to see the Long Cylinder Conversion featured in Dennis Adler's Guns of the American West.

[Jake MacReedy]

Fox Creek, I sent you a PM, pard!

Jake

[Fox Creek Kid]

Kirst Konverter LLC /Kirst & Strite/ Ravens Roost can build virtually any historical conversion you desire.
We build Remington New Model Armies and Navies, Colt First Model Richards, LeMat and will soon be able to offer Colt Thuer revolvers.

Raven AKA Jay Strite
Kirst & Strite/ Kirst Konverter LLC

Jay, can you quote a price & ETA as to what an authentic ``thin plate`` .44 conversion would run on a supplied Uberti?

[Jake MacReedy]

Decided to stick with .45 Colt revolvers, so I put these up for sale in the Classifieds.

Jake

[Raven]

Fox Creek Kid,

Sent you a PM

Raven

[Kent Hitnuttin]

I know this is an old subject, but:  Raven,  How come the PM instead of a post so the rest of us can see.  I have a Pietta 58' .44 w/8" barrel, date coded 2006 that I'd like to convert to .44-40.   

[Raven]

Hi Kent,

For a Thin Plate conversion in .44Colt the base price is $1500 built on your gun.
To build one in .44-40 will require building a 5 shot cylinder which will add an additional $700 and require a new barrel.
To make a .420 bore barrel is an additional $400
So just as a starting point the base price for a .44-40 built on your Uberti would be $2600

I know some people will suggest that you have the barrel lined, But this is not an option as the barrel walls and the liner walls will be to thin to be safe IMO

Turn around time for this type project is currently running between a year and a half and two years. The gun in the shop and a 50% deposit starts the clock.

Give me a call if you have any other questions 254-248-0663 ask for Jay
Raven

[Kent Hitnuttin]

Raven, Thanks for the response ,  Kent

[jplower]

I think for the work involved that the Kirst conversions are about double what they should be.  No cylinder should be priced at 700 in  today's CNC world.

JP

[Goody]

I think for the work involved that the Kirst conversions are about double what they should be.  No cylinder should be priced at 700 in  today's CNC world.

JP

Be sure and let us know when you get to market with those.

[Raven]

I think for the work involved that the Kirst conversions are about double what they should be.  No cylinder should be priced at 700 in  today's CNC world.

JP

JP you must not work in the CNC world.

The problem is there is not enough demand to run the quantities that would get the price down. The standard Kirst product is priced where it is  because we run svereral hundered cylinders in a batch.
We just dont sell that kind of quantity in Historical converters and I would have to sit on them for 20 years. The price is set by demand not by the work involved... the work involved is in the installation.....LOTS and LOTS of work these are not drop ins by any stretch of the imagination, you must be a machinist or have a machinist do the work.
Our starting price for a Historical coversion is allmost identical to Bob Millingtons and most of Bob's converter parts are bought from us.
There are many things that conspire against inexpensive "Historical recreations" .......
1 even if we could sell you inexpensive parts you must be a machinist to install them
2 your machinist is going to charge way more than I do because he will need to make tooling and fixtures.
3 You will need to send the gun out for refinish if it's a Colt and you want Colorcase......expect about $200 -$300
4 The Italiand are never going to do it if they don't think they can sell thousands
5 I am in the business of building historical conversions if you cut me out of the building part you pay RETAIL for the parts

 So realistically on a 1st Richards if the converter was $350, Ejector $250, recolorcase $250, Labor $500, fixtures and tooling $500, refinish $200, correct markings $600 (includes the cost of stamps) The cost for you would be $2550 and this is just a base gun. For the same price if I do the work you could have Ivory grips and a little engraving.

While I know it would be cool to be able to buy these fire arms at Italian prices, you got to remember that these are American Handmade Art pieces. And I have to make a living just like you.
We are NEVER I repeat NEVER going to produce guns to compete with Italian prices. If you guys want inexpensive "Historical Recreations" get your friends together and start bugging the Italians. If enough of you ask for it they will make it. When they do I will switch to making very expensive HandMade Guitars

One final thing I would be happy to work at Italian prices when I get the same benifits Italian wokers....Paid vacation, Health insurance, and a living wage. Some of you guys want me to be working at third world wages and I'm sure some of the same people bitch when US Jobs go to India. Grow Up! If you want it buy it, if you can't afford it save up, and if it's completely out of your leauge dream on ...just like I do.
 It's Not My Fault If You Can't Afford My Work.

Raven

P.S. It's none of you guys business but We live in a 400 Sq.Ft. House work in a 1200 Sq. Ft. shop and live like monks so that we can do this kind of work. How many of you are living in Mc mansions watching BIG flat screen TV's.....I'm still watching a 15 year old 25" so I can afford the toys I want. So, ultimatly the issue is not the price of my work it is your priorities.

[Captain John Jarrett]

Well put Raven, very succinct!

[Hoof Hearted]

JP you must not work in the CNC world.

The problem is there is not enough demand to run the quantities that would get the price down. The standard Kirst product is priced where it is  because we run svereral hundered cylinders in a batch.
We just dont sell that kind of quantity in Historical converters and I would have to sit on them for 20 years. The price is set by demand not by the work involved... the work involved is in the installation.....LOTS and LOTS of work these are not drop ins by any stretch of the imagination, you must be a machinist or have a machinist do the work.
Our starting price for a Historical coversion is allmost identical to Bob Millingtons and most of Bob's converter parts are bought from us.
There are many things that conspire against inexpensive "Historical recreations" .......
1 even if we could sell you inexpensive parts you must be a machinist to install them
2 your machinist is going to charge way more than I do because he will need to make tooling and fixtures.
3 You will need to send the gun out for refinish if it's a Colt and you want Colorcase......expect about $200 -$300
4 The Italiand are never going to do it if they don't think they can sell thousands
5 I am in the business of building historical conversions if you cut me out of the building part you pay RETAIL for the parts

 So realistically on a 1st Richards if the converter was $350, Ejector $250, recolorcase $250, Labor $500, fixtures and tooling $500, refinish $200, correct markings $600 (includes the cost of stamps) The cost for you would be $2550 and this is just a base gun. For the same price if I do the work you could have Ivory grips and a little engraving.

While I know it would be cool to be able to buy these fire arms at Italian prices, you got to remember that these are American Handmade Art pieces. And I have to make a living just like you.
We are NEVER I repeat NEVER going to produce guns to compete with Italian prices. If you guys want inexpensive "Historical Recreations" get your friends together and start bugging the Italians. If enough of you ask for it they will make it. When they do I will switch to making very expensive HandMade Guitars

One final thing I would be happy to work at Italian prices when I get the same benifits Italian wokers....Paid vacation, Health insurance, and a living wage. Some of you guys want me to be working at third world wages and I'm sure some of the same people bitch when US Jobs go to India. Grow Up! If you want it buy it, if you can't afford it save up, and if it's completely out of your leauge dream on ...just like I do.
 It's Not My Fault If You Can't Afford My Work.

Raven

P.S. It's none of you guys business but We live in a 400 Sq.Ft. House work in a 1200 Sq. Ft. shop and live like monks so that we can do this kind of work. How many of you are living in Mc mansions watching BIG flat screen TV's.....I'm still watching a 15 year old 25" so I can afford the toys I want. So, ultimatly the issue is not the price of my work it is your priorities.

And I work for Raven

[Cal Fornia]

And I work for Raven

Why the embarrassed/sad face?... I'd love to work for Raven.  Actually, at present, I'd love to be able to work for anyone.  Better than being jobless... which means even "cheap" Italian clone guns are too expensive for me.  But I can dream!  Like... that Rogers and Spencer I handled some time back.  Neat gun, loved the trigger on it, have heard how accurate they are.  Also couldn't help thinking how neat a cartridge conversion would be on such a gun.  Even at the prices Raven quotes, I'd be willing to save for something so special.  If I had a job.   

[Hoof Hearted]

Why the embarrassed/sad face?... I'd love to work for Raven.  Actually, at present, I'd love to be able to work for anyone.  Better than being jobless... which means even "cheap" Italian clone guns are too expensive for me.  But I can dream!  Like... that Rogers and Spencer I handled some time back.  Neat gun, loved the trigger on it, have heard how accurate they are.  Also couldn't help thinking how neat a cartridge conversion would be on such a gun.  Even at the prices Raven quotes, I'd be willing to save for something so special.  If I had a job.   

I guess I am not as transparent as my wife say's I am!

He has to pay me out of what little he makes..................

[Raven]

Thats one of the problems with small businesses like ours.......a lot of the time the employees make more in take home pay than the owners.

Raven

[cavsgt]

Thats one of the problems with small businesses like ours.......a lot of the time the employees make more in take home pay than the owners.

Raven

Been there done that!!!!!!   
  Sounds like trying to run a saddle/leather shop while being honest with your customers.