Perdestoli Sharps..field grade 'professional hunter' ?

[Marshal Deadwood]

http://www.buffaloarms.com/browse.cfm/4,4424.htm

That paticular model,,,without the 'extras'...what could one expect...'decent' walnut ? Functional quality ? And, for a 'working hunter' type person,,how would this fit ? Were Sharps then,,,more extravagent with extras ? or would a field grade such as this one be typical of the working buffalo hunter ?

As far as 'shooting performance' this would serve double duty 1st as a hunting rifle and 2nd perhaps for 'some' blackpowder cartridge competition. Should this basic model be a consideration, or should one move up the shelf ?

Just seeking 'good ol' boy' advice,,not trying to put anyone on the spot.

Thank you gents,

Marshal Deadwood

[Ransom Gaer]

Marshall Deadwood,

My guess is that that Pedersoli rifle probably has the same barrel as the fancy rifles from Persoli intended for long range competition.  So accuracy should be good.  I think it would fit perfectly with the working hide hunter of the 1870's.  I have a copy of Frank Seller's book on the Sharps Firearms and in the chapter on the 1874 models, those the can be attributed to the buffalo hunters all tend to be plain rifles.  If they have anything special it is heavy barrels.  We're talking 16 pound or more rifles here.  Sharps rifles were expensive for their day(still are) and I think the average hide hunter really didn't want to spend the money on do-dads that didn't help with their job.

I have an Armisport 1874 Sharps that is a basic rifle also.  With heavy bullets and charges it does recoil some.  Mine has a rifle buttstock, not the shotgun butt like the one you're looking at.  I have heard the shotgun buttstock helps with the recoil.

Certainly from a functional standpoint that rifle should be fine for hunting.  For competition a heavier rifle is prefered from what I hear.  No reason you couldn't use it for competition though.  I am thinking about getting the 1874 No. 1 Silhouette Rifle 32" 45-70 from Pedersoli.  It is also a plain rifle(which I prefer) and it has a pistol grip which is highly recommended by other folks.  I am also looking at either a Sharps or a rolling block that is significantly heavier as a competition rifle.  Not NRA BPCR however.  All of the heavy rifles I'm looking at are over weight for NRA BPCR.  I'm thinking gong and buffalo matches which tend to be longer range.  In fact one rolling block that I am looking at will tip the scales at over 14 pounds.  Oughta be nice and steady.  Of course I may get a hernia totin' the thing around if I get it.

Ransom Gaer

[Marshal Deadwood]

Ransom, thanks pard. That was basically what I was wanting opinions on,,just a good base Sharps..working class rifle....for hunting and 'getting into' perhaps some cartridge long range or whatever....but, to begin with,,a working rifle typical of the buffalo hunters of old.

I'v shot flinters all my life,,,this however is wee bit new...all the considerations of what you need for what you plan to do...and advice is appreciated.

I think..for myself,,a plain rifle in 45-70...would fit the bill. To hunt with some, to just shoot some. and to maybe visit and get to know how the 'ins and outs' of competition shooting a bit.

Thanks for you most excellent reply.

Marshal Deadwood

[Advertising]

[Flinch Morningwood]

Great question Marshall...I was just looking at that one myself this morning.

Speaking of pistol grips - How common were they on original rifles?  They are more comfortable but I am looking for something historically correct as well...I haven't run across any photos of pistol grip models but I have just started to look.

I have seen the "bolt on" pistol grip that Shiloh makes - is this a new invention or were they around back when?

[Marshal Deadwood]

Little Al,,,,I got a reply from Perdistoli this morning stateing that the 'professional hunter' was exactly the same mechanically  and was of percision accuracy as any model, just that it was 'field grade' on options.

I think this rifle would suit my intentions more than one with the extras...they all look good,,but this'un might be more in keeping with my 'character' and it will be a 'hunting gun' for sure.

Sooo many gunsss ,,sooo little wampummm.

Marshal Deadwood

[Ransom Gaer]

Little Al,

Regarding pistol grips there are some shown in Sellers book on Sharps.  They are typically seen on the higher grades of rifle like the Creedmore and the Long Range models.  There are some sporting rifles with them too, but I think by and large most sporting rifles had straight stocks.  So called business rifles according Sellers didn't have pistol grips.  Dixie Gun Works has Frank Sellers book "Sharps Firearms" available and it is supposed to be the bible on Sharps.  I have found it very interesting.

Ransom Gaer

[Marshal Deadwood]

Ransom,,,Perdersoli said the 'professional hunter' that Cimarron and Buffalo Arms list,,,is what Perdersoli  list as their 'business rifle' on their site....in keepiing with the business rifles of the buffalo era.

I need to really accquire some of the good books you have spoken of.

Thanks a heap.

Marshal Deadwood

[Ransom Gaer]

Marshall,

Sellers' book has been around for years.  I think I 've had my copy for probably 20 years or more.  I've long since forgotten where I got it.

That business rifle of Pedersoli's sounds more and more interesting.  It is not too badly priced and realistically would fit my needs just fine.  I could pull the sights off of my Armisport and install them on that business rifle.  Speaking of sights when I was looking at Sellers' book last night when I was crafting my first response I saw that many of the rifles that were known to be used by buffalo hunters had pretty standard sights.  A blade front and buckhorn rear sight.  I read somewhere that during the early years of the buffalo hunt the professional hunters were able to get relatively close to their targets and only later when the buffalo got more wary did they have to shoot from longer range.  Which may explain the lack of long range sights.

Ransom Gaer

[Cyrille]

I got me a Pedersoli 45/70 target grade Sharps model rifle from Dixie Gun Works Talk about a tack driver @ 75-80 yards and that's with factory ammo. I am in the process of working up loads for 100 yards and beyond with a 515 grain bullet.

[Noz]

Just for information. You can go to Gunbroker.com and search for Rolling Block.
They have numerous 1870 era Remington rolling blocks in various calibers for less than a new Pedersoli.
I've been watching a 43 Spanish over there.

[Pitspitr]

I have seen the "bolt on" pistol grip that Shiloh makes - is this a new invention or were they around back when?

I can't say about Sharps, But the Springfield armory put a bolt on pistol grip on their long range rifle in the late 1870's and made a few bolt ons for their standard rifles and carbines in the 1880's, some were wood some were iron.

[Will Ketchum]

I have seen the "bolt on" pistol grip that Shiloh makes - is this a new invention or were they around back when?

The Officer's Model trapdoor had a screw on pistol grip.  Dixie Gun Works sells them and I put one on my wife's IAB Sharps.  I used the longer screw that came with the grip and screwed it in place of the trigger guard screw.  It could use some dressing up but it made a world of difference to her shooting.

[Sir Charles deMouton-Black]

Nozzlerag; 

The .43 Spanish is no piece of cake to load for.  Bullet choice is limited, and it has a VERY long throat.  Mine is now a candidate for rebarreling, once this war is over and Green Mountain barrels are available again.

Follow the links to the SCORRS website.  There is at least one article on the trials & tribulations of the Spanish.

PS;  I think I will look up an add-on pistolgrip for a number of my singleshots!

[James Hunt]

Marshall Deadwood: Knowing of you from some other boards I am left with the impression that you run with the PC crowd - not that there is anything wrong with that . Amen to that. Subsequently and for your information...

I have a Pedersoli Sharps and it is a nice gun, accurate as far as I can tell, and well made. However, there are some differences between it and the American made guns (beyond quality). The hammer on the Pedersoli functions more like a transitional or early cartridge Sharps than the traditional 1874 models, that is to place the gun on half cock you must pull the hammer father back. It is very similar to my conversion carbine. So... from a persona standpoint you may claim to have a conversion rifle or 1869 model if you wish. The Buffalo Arms gun is fine with regard to general appearance as there is a look alike on page 235 (bottom) of Seller's work labled a business rifle (complete with a higher profile buckhorn site). The only problem is the forestock. The Italians have never learned how to copy the forestock of a Sharps, they all have this bulbous portion that I guess you are supposed to grab with the off hand. Since by implied reputation you are probably into defarbing your weapons, this is no problem that a bit of sand paper can't cure. Regardless of conversion or Business rifle - they all were found in .45-70 (an easy cartridge to load by the way).

One more note of caution from someone that has been down that road, it is still a $1000 bucks or so. Make sure that is what you REALLY want, or save to the next level. My Perdersoli is basically a loaner, it was the gun I bought to save money. I had to buy a second one to get what I wanted.

[Otter]

Sir Charles,

Why wait for Green Mountain barrels to be available again when Badger is available? I have both GM's and Badger and both are good stuff . . . And you shouldn't have to wait if you don't want to . . .

[Ol Gabe]

Sir,
Having read all your posts over the past few weeks and months on various threads regarding your potential purchase of a Rifle in a caliber that will fit your posited needs, i.e., NCOWS, hunting, target shooting, etc., etc., etc., and I am still in the throes of perfidity that you have not been elucidated enough, informed and educated beyond a doubt to this point.
As of this date 9/21/07, you have been in receipt of more suggestions, recommendations and referrals than most posters looking for selfsame information and have still to this date been posting for more info, a voracious e-appetite indeed! I, for one, am impressed by your veracity!
Now, with that in mind, I admire your tenacity to seek out and find the absolutely best Rifle to serve your purposes whilst holding your purse strings intact, and with that in mind, you Sir, should be praised!
You seek a rifle with certain ramifications in style and design that will fit your own selfsame idealistic quantifications of idealism from some ethereal pattern of historical identity, or that which has been imbued onto you by others of the same ilk, that may or may not be in any realistic format, to say the least, yet you personify those that only want the best for the available dollar.
Therefore, and I offer the following with many years of hand-holding with others of your ilk that were vasilating over what to buy and where, this position of faith and candor, to wit;
1. Buy a Pedersoli in whatever model or format you desire as you will always get back what you put into it down the road, and perhaps more.
2. When you sell the Pedersoli, buy a Shiloh Sharps or C. Sharps or Axtell Sharps and never look back.
3. Keep it simple, when its not fun, your done.
Best regards and good shooting!
'Ol Gabe
NCOW #925, Proud Sponsor of the Annual CVR 'Strands Stand' Mid & Long Range Shoot (200-1,000 yds) and the Annual NSW, Australia, Billy Dixon Shoot.

[Sir Charles deMouton-Black]

Ol Gabe;

I fully appreciate your informative volubility.  Your facility to elucidate is, indeed, profound

[Delmonico]

He says thing right well also.

[Marshal Deadwood]

I admittly have asked way too many questions reguarding the rifle.

Money is a precious comodity,,for one thing , and I wanted to make the best informed decision possible.

And, I just like talking about guns, paticular ones I wish to learn about.

Not a snide remark or scarcasim,,but I offer my appologies.


Marshal Deadwood   

[Sir Charles deMouton-Black]

Marshall Deadwood;

I think you were about right in the question you posed.  Basic or better?

I would say, get a basic model of the Sharps, or a roller, from Pedersoli.  Any calibre will do as long as it is a .45-70!

K.I.S.S.  We can outsmart ourselves from time to time!