Which would you buy? modern double action revolver

[Major 2]

Opinions may be varied... on this subject

I recently needed a CWC revolver (that's to say wanted one) I have a little Back-up .380 auto but my wife latched on to it.

All my revolvers are cowboy save the old S&W Hand ejector my Dad carried in WW2 ,That's a Heirloom.

I looked at the Taurus Judge at "Shot" interesting....
I had an opportunity to shoot several small frame light weigh revolvers Smiths , Ruger & Taurus  ... these were not really to my liking both in grip feel and felt recoil.
I gave some though to the Ruger Montado, my reasoning here , I'm most use to and proficient with SA.

But what won out was a , chance happening ... a retired LEO was selling his back-up carry.
A Taurus 44 ... long carried, lightly used , it had action job....
This is a Medium Frame DA 44, 5 shot which fit my hand perfectly. Lighter & narrower than a Ruger.
Best of all, was the price. 
I did not want to spend the bank. The bonus is the life time regardless of original owner warranty.
 

[Steel Horse Bailey]

Fine looking bargain, Major 2!

[Lawful Larry]

Howdy, Pard,

  I know there are folks who tell you that you can load a .45 LC up to equal the .44 Magnum (in velocity, but NOT in pressures!!!), but the advantage to the .44 Magnum case is that it is thicker and smaller in diameter than the .45 LC, which gives you a bit more strength margin. 
 

Shooting holes in myths.  Please read the following article:

http://customsixguns.com/writings/dissolving_the_myth.htm

Hopefully this clears up the misconceptions of the .45 Colt!!!     

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[Steel Horse Bailey]

Not to take anything away from our learned Mr. Johnson: he's gives good advice, but I'd say that Mr. Linebaugh, certainly a recognized expert in the field of powerful   hand-cannons, has probably proved the possibilities of the great 45 Colt.  Somehow, I doubt that the extra .001" to.0025" of brass in the 44 case really adds that much strength to the round, rather, it is the thickness and metallurgy of the cylinders that were designed for a really powerful MODERN load about 80 years after the 45 Colt was designed.  (And a tiny bit of extra strength added by a thicker case.)

I like the way Mr. L. stressed the fact that he was ONLY talking of the power of the 45 Colt round made possible by the modern S&W (a favorite of Driftwood's) and Ruger revolvers ( - and now others).

I don't expect I can speak for pard D.J., but I think, however, that Driftwood knows all this, he just stressed the case thickness angle for brevity's sake. 

[E.R.Beaumont]

Howdy Pards and Pardetttes.

Tommy Pard, I don't own any double action Taurus, or Ruger revolvers, so of course I have an opinion.  A far piece ago I was looking for a holster sized .357 for taking to shooting schools, and walks in the woods.  What I did then was to go to a full service gun store, and compare the L frame Smith, the Ruger 101 (?), and the Colt King Cobra.  I chose the Colt, I probably would have been happier with the Smith, but it had those huge Goncalvo Alves 4x4s that they stuck on their high end guns.  I just cannot stand those things,  What a waste of pretty wood and time.

What I am trying to point out is that only you can pick the gun that is right for you.  Go to a real gun store and set a few on the counter.  Pick them up and fondle them, remember you can change grips for cheap.  There have been some other fine candidates put out there.  The Ruger Redhawk is a fine gun, it must be hell for stout, cause the Custom "Big Gun" Makers use it for .50 Cal stuff.  The S&W Mountain Gun in any of the .40+ calibers, but some of those are only available on the used gun market. Several years ago Lew Horton had S&W make up a bunch of 3" N frames in calibers from .44 spcl, to .44 Mag.  There were .41s and .45s too, some of these are still available new in box on several f the auction sites.  And if you feel the need for them there are the Real Cannons in .460, .480, and the various .50 caliber loadings.

Heck Pard just go to some gun stores and go comparison shopping, look at the used stuff too.  I would guess that sooner or later there will start to be the Smith short barreled X frames showing up with a holster, and a box of bullets with three gone, for less than new price.  First you got to figure out what you want the gun for.  Do you want to shoot .45 in the Taurus shotpistol and will it group or pattern?  I'v noticed through the years that very few combination tools do either of their functions veru well, so you might end up with a shot pistol that won't patterm and a .45 that won't group.

I probably would not buy a Big Boomer in a caliber that I was using for cowboy, just to keep me from blowing a cowboy gun up with the wrong ammo.  Now that is just me, but a mans got to know his limitations.

That is all i think i know.
Regards, Beaumont

[Tommy tornado]

Howdy E. R.,

A buddy of mine has a Tarus and that was what got me thinking about one.  However, as you pointed out in your post, I am going to avoid, "just to keep me from blowing a cowboy gun up with the wrong ammo."  Although I do load up some Keith style loads of 9.0 grains of Unique every now and then, but I don't make it a regular item in my SAAs.  Funny you mention X-frames, the local Gander Mountain has a .500 S&W used for about 850, but I am passing on that.  Too much power!!!!  I believe that I have narrowed my choice down to either a Ruger Super Redhawk in .44 Mag or a used Model 29 in .44 mag. with an unfluted cylinder and full lug barrel.  Both are stainless and can handle hot loads if I want to load them up.  This all started because I started reading Keith and Skeeter, and went back through my handloader magazines reading about .44 mag.  I think I am going to try Keith's .44 mag load using 2400 first, and I do realize that you don't use the same amount of 2400 as Keith because the modern stuff is a little hotter.

[Tommy tornado]

I am also sad because www.sixgunner.com isn't working at the moment.  I know that there would have been a ton of information on that website.

[Steel Horse Bailey]

Tommy T:

Howdy again!  You mentioned that you liked the Super Redhawk because of the scope mounts.  You DO know that you can get a factory Redhawk with Ruger scope mounts milled in, don'cha?  Then you wouldn't have to look at perhaps the ugliest, good-quality handgun of the 20th Century!  (JMHO  )

 

[Tommy tornado]

Yes but I like the strength of the thing.  It looks like a GP101 with an extra length of barrel sticking out. 

[Steel Horse Bailey]

Yes but I like the strength of the thing.  It looks like a GP101 with an extra length of barrel sticking out. 

Uhhh.  Forgive me if I sound like I'm workin' too hard at changing your mind.   

The Redhawk is ALREADY stronger than any other gun, even without the extra barrel extension.  And it ain't ugly.   

I promise that I won't try to dissuade you from a Redhawk vs. a Super Redhawk any more!!      I respect the fact that you have made up your mind on which version you might get.

Get a Smith.     

S&Ws are even prettier than Redwawks. 

[Cyrille]

I had been seriously thinking of ordering a Super Redhawk in .454 Casull from my supplier, because it handled both the .454 and the .45 Colt.
 Then, by happenstance, while looking on the S&W website I spotted the Model 460XVR and 460V the only diffrence between the two models is the .460V has a 5" barrel and the XVR sports an 8 3/8" barrel The .460 handles three diffrent cartridges i.e. the .460, .454 and .45 LC as opposed to the SRH's two. Onlyest trouble is if I order the .460 I'll have to also buy (in the near future) reloading paraphnailia for the .454 cartridge and the .460 which will add about $200.00 dollars to the expenditure; and that's not considering the almost $400.00 dollar diffrence in the price of the two revolvers.
But then you get what you pay for. and I like the idea of haveing three slightly diffrent calibers to make noise with.
Now if only I could reload all three with the Holy Black----!

[65bsaA65]

On the Old Town Station, Ltd. website there's a S&W HE in .455 cal. at a very reasonable price, in fine condition.  If I was looking for a modern revolver I'd jump on this with both feet.  Course your idea of modern and mine could be different.  I had one many years ago, chambered in .45 ACP and loved it.

[Steel Horse Bailey]

... I like the idea of having three slightly different calibers to make noise with.
Now if only I could reload all three with the Holy Black----!

But Cyrille!  You can load them with Goex BP or Pyrodex!  Just fill the cases with BP to where you compress the powder .125" - .250" with your bullet of choice.  (I'd go with a BigLube design.  )  For the magnum .454 & 460 rounds, use fine granulation Swiss powder or 777 !!!  I'm POSITIVE the gun could handle it with ease!

[Cyrille]

But Cyrille!  You can load them with Goex BP or Pyrodex!  Just fill the cases with BP to where you compress the powder .125" - .250" with your bullet of choice.  (I'd go with a BigLube design.  )  For the magnum .454 & 460 rounds, use fine granulation Swiss powder or 777 !!!  I'm POSITIVE the gun could handle it with ease!

Mr. Bailey, sir;
                 I kinda figguered thet. I jus didn't know fer shore the type of powder (granulation to use.) As fer the powder, as of now, I have a  local supplier who sells GOEX exclusively. No Swiss. What do you think about me using GOEX 3F/777 3F in place of the Swiss?

[Steel Horse Bailey]

Mr. Bailey, sir;
                 I kinda figguered thet. I jus didn't know fer shore the type of powder (granulation to use.) As fer the powder, as of now, I have a  local supplier who sells GOEX exclusively. No Swiss. What do you think about me using GOEX 3F/777 3F in place of the Swiss?

Howdy!

Cyrille, the 3F Goex would do fine, but you'd get more power from those .454s & 460s with 777, rather than 3F Goex.  Since they are magnum guns from the git-go, and BP in ANY form probably (    ) won't produce the power that smokeless magnum loads will, you'd get the most power possible from those hot-potatoes (!) rounds.  And STILL be shooting BP.  Shucks, I've tried BP in 45 ACP to see if it was possible, but it doesn't cycle reliably for me unless you put in a lighter spring. 

Actually, you could, in THAT gun, use 777 in all 3 calibers you mentioned (or 6 - that one of those guns will chamber: 45 S&W [45 Schofield], 45 Cowboy Special, 45 Colt, 45 Colt Magnum. {a wildcat longer than 45 Colt but shorter than the .454}, 454, 460 - have I missed any?)

[Cyrille]

None that I have knowledge of; shucks until I read your post, I had no idea of the "wildcat" .45 Colt magnum you mentioned.

[Tommy tornado]

I have never heard of .45 wildcat either, I suppose you have to turn down another cartridge to make the brass?

[Steel Horse Bailey]

Don't know about the brass, but it MAY have come about after the .454 was introduced and the brass was shortened from that - but I'm not sure.

That round falls into the "really isn't needed ... but fun" category.  Right there with the 45 Auto Magnum.  I don't think it lasted very long. 

PS - My copy of Barnes "Cartridges of the World" is too old for it to be listed, but perhaps one from, say, 10-15 years ago might, since that's about when I remember hearing about it.

[Tommy tornado]

Do you know where to find loading data?  Also Steel Horse do you know if it will shoot out of a .45 Blackhawk or do you have to get one of the big X-frame Smiths?

[Steel Horse Bailey]

TT, no.  I don't know about any published data.  Or if it will fire from anything smaller than a gun especially for it OR a .454 chambered gun.  The whole idea, if I remember right, was to do the same as the 38 & 44 spls.  In other words, the gun would NOT be able to chamber the lengthened round by accident.  I really think it was pretty much a flash in the pan, 'cause the .454 pretty much did every thing that wildcat intended, only more powerfully.