Anybody have any experience with Model 3 fakes?

[Zip Wyatt]

I've got a S&W "russian" that looks pretty good and is made as good as any S&W but I don't think it is one.  Too many inconsistencies - a lack of markings, looks more New Model 3 than Russian, etc..  What does a "Tula" made russian look like - I'd love to see a photo.  It's not a Ludwig and Loewe - I've seen a photo of that.  Thanks!

Zip

[Will Ketchum]

Rather than calling them fakes I would call them "copies" .  The Spanish as well as other countries made copies of various Smith and Wesson break tops.   I have a Spanish copy of a Merwin Hulbert Pocket Army.  It is well made and shoots fairly well.

Jim Supica would be the one who would know more.

WIll Ketchum

[Zip Wyatt]

Will,

Thanks for replying - your Spanish copy of a Merwin - what kind of markings does it have?  Did you know if was Spanish from those markings? 

This S&W or copy of a S&W has no markings, except for a "B" on the cylinder face and serial numbers on the base of the grip, the face of the cylinder and on the inside of the top strap where the latch is located.  The barrel profile is New Model 3 but it is 7 inch, the latch is Russian, there is no nut holding the cylinder in place, the frame is Russian and the trigger guard has the spur.

Does Mr. Supica haunt this forum?

Zip

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[Will Ketchum]

I don't have it here so I'll do the best from memory.  On the top of the barrel it says something like Merwin Hulber Cartridges are best for this.  Then it says something in Baque.  On the frame it says "Russian Model" 

Jim is a member of this forum but I don't know how often he checks in.

Will Ketchum

[French Jack]

I looked at two copies at a gun show yesterday.  Both were made in Belgium.  Appearance was close, but not the same.  As you noted, some minor differences.  No markings other than  caliber, serial numbers and Belgian proof marks.  The finish was in good condition, and had not been redone, so markings had never been put on the revolvers.

[Zip Wyatt]

French Jack,

What Belgium proof marks were on the guns you looked at?  Were any of them a B in a square?  Thanks!

Zip

[Zip Wyatt]

What the copy looks like:



Before anyone asks - the grips are suppose to be cow horn.

Zip

[Books OToole]

I see what you mean.  The ejector housing is too small for a Russian and the "knuckle" on the grip is too pronounced for a New Model Three.  Hmmmmm.

You need a copy of Standard Catalog of Smith & Wesson by Supica and Nahas.

I would recomend checking out from your local library.  Once you've done that and looked it over, you'll want one of your own.



Books

[Zip Wyatt]

Books,

That is a good suggestion - I've been meaning to buy Supica and Nahas and this is as good a time as any.

I put this question to the S&W forum too and they seem to think it was made in Spain, although there is nothing in Spanish on the gun.  Mr. Supica has yet to weigh-in on the topic over there either.  I guess some of the Spanish copies can be quite nicely done - as good as the originals.  That's where I'd put this one - it's as nice a gun as the two original NM3s that I own both in metal quality and fit and finish.   It also has the best bore I've ever seen on an "Old West" gun - a 9+ on a scale of 1-10.   I guess I'll have to keep it.

Zip

[Books OToole]

Zip;

There is a guy who goes by the handle of "Spanish Marshall" that posts occasionally on the Barracks Forum.  He is an active duty Spainish Army Officer and a Old West Shooter/Enthusiast.  If I recall correctly he has some knowledge on the Spanish Copies of S&Ws.

Books