Somethin else to worry about

[Noz]

I've been trying to get ahead on my loading for next year. Been loading 12ga square loads minus about 10% on the powder side into "pick up" Winchester Feather Weight hulls. I had a hull wrinkle. A few minutes later I had another. I put them both aside and continued loading. It bothered me because the Versa MEC was doing such a good job. I stopped and took my utility knife and opened the first wrinkle to see why.
The base wad was loose and laying on it's side below the powder covering the primer access hole. Opened the second and the base wad was loose and pulled up on one side.
I would guess that at best I had a couple of squib loads. What the worst could be I don't know. Now I have to look into each hull to see whats going on. I have not found another in around 100 hulls. I'd hate to have one of those loose wads hang up in the bore.

[Arcey]

Whudsa Winchester Feather Weight?

I gots ‘recovered’ Feather Lites ‘n Win Lites but no Feather Weights. Sounds like an ittsy bittsy boxer. Sumthin’ new?

[Tensleep]

"Feather Weights?" 


sounds like separation on the new 2 piece Winchester hulls....

[Advertising]

[Noz]

Whudsa Winchester Feather Weight?

I gots ‘recovered’ Feather Lites ‘n Win Lites but no Feather Weights. Sounds like an ittsy bittsy boxer. Sumthin’ new?

Whatever. I've never seen a box. The hulls are the red ones with the feather on the side.

[Arcey]

Shot a boxful ah them I reloaded last Saturday. Like I did the shoot ‘fore that ‘n the shoot ‘fore that ‘n so on. Not a problem. Maybe ya need ta pay a l’il more attention ta what yer doin’.

Whatever’ll get ya hurt.

[hellgate]

Noz,

So far, I have not come across any base wad separations in the newer AA hulls. However after reading your post I will scrutinize the cases much more closely and quit trying to ring out extra loadings. I've gone over to the various Remington hulls that are all (so far) one piece compression formed cases. I do always use some form of plastic gas sealing wad either as an over powder wad or as a one piece wad.

[Howdy Doody]

Noz,
I am not sure where your square load of powder comes up to, but I had some issues very similar. I always used the red Winchester wad over 65grs of Goex in my 12ga loads. I had to buy some substitute red wads after Win quit making them. When I started in using them, I had hulls that bent, kinked and would not crimp on my Mec loader. The problem was that the early red wads were too hard, the legs would not bend when compressed and that caused the whole problem for me.
I contacted the company that makes the wads for Claybuster and they told me they changed the plastic formula and sent me some samples. The new ones work every bot as good as the ones that were made by Winchester. All I ever get is once fired AA hulls any more and they all have that two piece design. So, if you are catching the edge of the second inner piece of plastic at the bottom of the column and are using a red Claybuster wad, it could be an old batch and they can tell that by the small label strip with a a number on it that is applied to the bag.

[Delmonico]

Got a question, does anyone buy and read reloading manuals any more?  Seen that problem talked about in most anyone I've ever read.

Grabbed the Hodgdon one on shotsells, came out in 1996 edited by the Late Great Don Zutz.  Scanned Don's words on the subject:



I alwasys look into my hulls just before I put them in the loader, have found stranger things in them than loose base wads, stuff I didn't want in there.

[Mako]

Delmonico,

The new Winchester AA hulls are not a true Reifenhauser type hull.  They are a 2 piece design which they try to make work as well as the old one piece hulls.  They claim they are bonded... I have heard (anecdotally) that the grey hulls have more issues than the red hulls.  This is not uncommon when joining polymers, pigmentation changes the polymer and the way it bonds to other molded pieces.  There is a skin on the outside surface which has different properties than the inner molded polymer.  You see this effect when you scuff plastic, you loose that shiny skin and it never looks the same even if polished out.

~Mako

[Delmonico]

Delmonico,

The new Winchester AA hulls are not a true Reifenhauser type hull.  They are a 2 piece design which they try to make work as well as the old one piece hulls.  They claim they are bonded... I have heard (anecdotally) that the grey hulls have more issues than the red hulls.  This is not uncommon when joining polymers, pigmentation changes the polymer and the way it bonds to other molded pieces.  There is a skin on the outside surface which has different properties than the inner molded polymer.  You see this effect when you scuff plastic, you loose that shiny skin and it never looks the same even if polished out.

~Mako

If they are two piece then all the cautions in that scan apply, guess I could search the net and find out what the heck they call them, but since they ain't a true one piece they sure as heck ain't no compression formed, guess if they want to call them that, it fine, they build them.  Been relaoding since there was a peanut farmer in the Whitehouse, sure as heck ain't gonna change my rule of look in the dern case afore I reload it.

Others can do what they want, but please fire a long ways from me, I'm allergic to flying scrap metal.

[Dick Dastardly]

The new and very shiny WWAA hulls are not the same as the old one piece compression formed hulls.  The base wad can come loose.  Just exactly what that means to reloading and shooting reloads isn't absolutely clear.  I do reload them, but I inspect each hull before I reload them.  I have found some with loose base wads and discarded them.

Since I load only cardboard and fiber wads I've not had a problem with wads, but I suspect that the loose base wad would present the same problem with either "natural" wads or plastic wads.

I've not found any of the Remington STS hulls that are two piece.  I suspect that they still use the true compression formed one piece system.

DD-DLoS

[Delmonico]

The base wad can come loose. 

Anything made in two pieces and joined can come un-joined if what ever joins them don't work as it should or if the bond is less than the strength of the materal being joined.

Don't take much to have a look see and find out if everything is all right, the eyes or fingers you save may be yer own.

[Mako]

Anything made in two pieces and joined can come un-joined if what ever joins them don't work as it should or if the bond is less than the strength of the materal being joined.

Don't take much to have a look see and find out if everything is all right, the eyes or fingers you save may be yer own.

Delmonico,
I don't disagree with your dislike of 2 piece wads.  When I told you they weren't true Reifenhauser type hulls I just wanted to make sure people didn't get confused because Winchester has very carefully tried to distance themselves from the idea of it being two pieces.  They stress the term "BONDED."  What there are is really compression formed into the tube.  Look at the patent it isn't a Reifenhauser hull.

I use Gold Remington STS hulls, they are still one piece.  I'm spoiled, I use to use Win AA and Peters Blue Magic hulls for my Sporting Clay loads.The majority of tossed shells at matches I go to now are Win AA featherlite hulls, I used to dig them out of the trash for loading my BP lloads.  If I snag them now I will use them only once and they have to be a once fired AA hull, but that is it, not more than once.  Actually I use the Win Hulls for my daughter's heathen powder loads, so she doesn't mix em up with mine.

~Mako