Author Topic: The Battle of Eccles Hill, 1870  (Read 15365 times)

Offline Sir Charles deMouton-Black

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The Battle of Eccles Hill, 1870
« on: March 14, 2016, 08:21:57 PM »
Irish American nationalists attempted to invade Canada on several ocassions from 1866 to 1870, with mixed results. Ultimately the attempt to affect British policy by attacking Canada failed. It did achieve two important resujlts. Firstly, it led to the unification of Canada, and secondly, it gave Canadians pride in military acievements.

At Eccles Hill the Canadian force was a self organized and financed group of homeguards and their Ballard Sporting rifles. The reinforcement by Canadian Militia and British regulars, made it all work.

http://canadashistory.ca/Magazine/Online-Extension/Articles/War-at-the-Border
NCOWS #1154, SCORRS, STORM, BROW, 1860 Henry, Dirty Rat 502, CHINOOK COUNTRY
THE SUBLYME & HOLY ORDER OF THE SOOT (SHOTS)
Those who are no longer ignorant of History may relive it,
without the Blood, Sweat, and Tears.
With apologies to George Santayana & W. S. Churchill

"As Mark Twain once put it, “History doesn’t repeat itself, but it does rhyme.”

Offline Delmonico

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Re: The Battle of Eccles Hill, 1870
« Reply #1 on: March 14, 2016, 09:53:07 PM »
And it two days keep and eye on the border for pick-ups with 36 County Nebraska plates. 

I don't know if those people from O Neil can yet be trusted. ;)

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Always get the water for the coffee upstream from the herd.

Ab Ovo Usque ad Mala

The time has passed so quick, the years all run together now.

Offline Fox Creek Kid

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Re: The Battle of Eccles Hill, 1870
« Reply #2 on: March 15, 2016, 12:47:26 AM »
The 400m smacks of BS for two reasons:

1.  Ballard only made rifles for anemic rimfire ctgs. until Marlin started making them in larger chamberings in 1875.

2.  Canada did not start using the metric system until 1977.

It's a great story, but perhaps embellished somewhat.  ::)   ;)

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Re: The Battle of Eccles Hill, 1870
« Reply #3 on: Today at 07:34:52 PM »

Offline Sir Charles deMouton-Black

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Re: The Battle of Eccles Hill, 1870
« Reply #3 on: March 15, 2016, 05:40:41 PM »
The 400m smacks of BS for two reasons:

1.  Ballard only made rifles for anemic rimfire ctgs. until Marlin started making them in larger chamberings in 1875.

2.  Canada did not start using the metric system until 1977.

It's a great story, but perhaps embellished somewhat.  ::)   ;)

1. I did some reading before, and as I figure it, the most likely caliber was .44 Long. I wouldn't take that range estimate to the bank. This has been written up before and I can't recall the previous range estimate. It could have been a lucky shot, or those farmers had about 2 years to practice, and the ranges had been paced out and possibly shot-in.

2.  Canada adopted the metric system awhile back, and the writers convention is to translate all measurements into metric in their articles.
NCOWS #1154, SCORRS, STORM, BROW, 1860 Henry, Dirty Rat 502, CHINOOK COUNTRY
THE SUBLYME & HOLY ORDER OF THE SOOT (SHOTS)
Those who are no longer ignorant of History may relive it,
without the Blood, Sweat, and Tears.
With apologies to George Santayana & W. S. Churchill

"As Mark Twain once put it, “History doesn’t repeat itself, but it does rhyme.”

Offline Delmonico

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Re: The Battle of Eccles Hill, 1870
« Reply #4 on: March 15, 2016, 06:01:35 PM »


2.  Canada adopted the metric system awhile back, and the writers convention is to translate all measurements into metric in their articles.


That pretty much is a given.
Mongrel Historian


Always get the water for the coffee upstream from the herd.

Ab Ovo Usque ad Mala

The time has passed so quick, the years all run together now.

Offline RattlesnakeJack

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Re: The Battle of Eccles Hill, 1870
« Reply #5 on: March 23, 2016, 12:28:58 AM »
Well, regardless of actual range, history does record the regrettable evidence of at least some effective shooting during the Battle of Eccles Hill ....





(Unfortunately for the five Fenian raiders killed, and eighteen wounded, "no Canadians were harmed during this engagement" ....)
Rattlesnake Jack Robson, Scout, Rocky Mountain Rangers, North West Canada, 1885
Major John M. Robson, Royal Scots of Canada, 1883-1901
Sgt. John Robson, Queen's Own Rifles of Canada, 1885
Bvt. Col, Commanding International Dept. and Div.  of Canada, Grand Army of the Frontier

Offline RattlesnakeJack

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Re: The Battle of Eccles Hill, 1870
« Reply #6 on: March 23, 2016, 12:48:59 AM »
The Canadian defenders also captured a light field piece from the Fenian force during this engagement ... shown here with some members of the Home Guard, often referred to as 'The Red Sashes' because of the sashes of that color this non-uniformed group wore as a distinguishing mark, and clearly seen on the two men in the foreground.  Such a sash is also worn by the chap with the rifle in the first picture above ...



(I am personally convinced that the Home Guard would have been armed with a wide variety of sporting-type rifles, although Ballard rifles are specifically mentioned because they can be identified in photographs such as this.)
Rattlesnake Jack Robson, Scout, Rocky Mountain Rangers, North West Canada, 1885
Major John M. Robson, Royal Scots of Canada, 1883-1901
Sgt. John Robson, Queen's Own Rifles of Canada, 1885
Bvt. Col, Commanding International Dept. and Div.  of Canada, Grand Army of the Frontier

Offline Fox Creek Kid

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Re: The Battle of Eccles Hill, 1870
« Reply #7 on: March 23, 2016, 10:36:54 PM »
There is at least one (and possibly two more) Spencer carbines in the last photo. As well, notice the clothing, especially the hats. Sure ain't no CAS event!!  ;D   ;)

Fantastic photos, RJ.

Offline Good Troy

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Re: The Battle of Eccles Hill, 1870
« Reply #8 on: March 24, 2016, 02:54:59 PM »
Interesting stuff!  Really like the photos!!

Despite the fact that my favorite wife thought it looked like the hat worn by William Sanderson as E.B. Farnum in the series Deadwood, I have a derby on order that looks much like the hat on the fellow on the right edge of the photo with the cannon.
It will definitely be a departure from the hats typically seen a the SASS events I attend.
Good Troy
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Offline Fox Creek Kid

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Re: The Battle of Eccles Hill, 1870
« Reply #9 on: March 24, 2016, 10:02:21 PM »
Good Troy, the difference being most in CAS today get their ideas from Hollywood movies whereas in the 19th century it was more a practical as well as personal matter regarding clothing & hats. Of course, if you really want to gag go to a modern rodeo and gander at the "Coca-Cola cowboys".  ;D

Offline Delmonico

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Re: The Battle of Eccles Hill, 1870
« Reply #10 on: March 24, 2016, 10:27:28 PM »
Got any good examples of what a trail bum should look like based on yer wardrobe, come to think of it, other than that little one to the side that's years old, never have seen you all dressed proper. 
Mongrel Historian


Always get the water for the coffee upstream from the herd.

Ab Ovo Usque ad Mala

The time has passed so quick, the years all run together now.

Offline Good Troy

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Re: The Battle of Eccles Hill, 1870
« Reply #11 on: March 25, 2016, 09:45:09 AM »
Good Troy, the difference being most in CAS today get their ideas from Hollywood movies whereas in the 19th century it was more a practical as well as personal matter regarding clothing & hats. Of course, if you really want to gag go to a modern rodeo and gander at the "Coca-Cola cowboys".  ;D

Miss Red and I went to the Houston Livestock and Rodeo at the beginning of the month.  It wasn't crowded, as we went on a Thursday during the day.  I wore "period correct" clothing...trousers with suspenders, wool vest, knee high boots, wild rag and a squished cowboy hat.  I got a lot of stares, especially when I was trying on a wool frock coat.  I just returned the stares to the folks with the bling jeans, and reptile skin boots. 
Good Troy
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Offline Sir Charles deMouton-Black

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Re: The Battle of Eccles Hill, 1870
« Reply #12 on: March 25, 2016, 09:48:22 AM »
Rattlesnake Jack; Cross border shopping is an old tradition in Canada.  In my earlier reading, I seem to recall that a shopping trip to the Ballard works was carried out and returned with a lot of about 40 rifles. I can't recall if a caliber was identified, but these yeoman farmers likely had some prior military service and knew what they needed. Nowherte was it stated that the whole shipment was identical.

I have searched "Images Fenian Raids", "Images battle of Eccles Hill", with interesting results. Out of the latter I found a picture that linked to "wikiimages" but this was molst valuable, a map!

https://www.google.ca/search?q=images+battle+of+eccles+hill&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwj63Ovph9zLAhUS02MKHTueDXEQsAQIGw&biw=720&bih=425#imgdii=ZhStHBT747Q9RM%3A%3BZhStHBT747Q9RM%3A%3BFfXUDueZU_p0mM%3A&imgrc=ZhStHBT747Q9RM%3A

For those who strive for authenticity, the comfuser set on "images..." will discover gold.
NCOWS #1154, SCORRS, STORM, BROW, 1860 Henry, Dirty Rat 502, CHINOOK COUNTRY
THE SUBLYME & HOLY ORDER OF THE SOOT (SHOTS)
Those who are no longer ignorant of History may relive it,
without the Blood, Sweat, and Tears.
With apologies to George Santayana & W. S. Churchill

"As Mark Twain once put it, “History doesn’t repeat itself, but it does rhyme.”

Offline Sir Charles deMouton-Black

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Re: The Battle of Eccles Hill, 1870
« Reply #13 on: March 25, 2016, 10:21:11 AM »
More;  http://www.wikiwand.com/fr/Bataille_d'Eccles_Hill

This is in French but states that the range of the Red Sash fire was "about 360 metres", 400yards. The origin of that number is not stated.

The Canadian Militia were equipped with Snider-Enfield conversion rifles. The Fenians had some Spencers and Springfield rifles.
NCOWS #1154, SCORRS, STORM, BROW, 1860 Henry, Dirty Rat 502, CHINOOK COUNTRY
THE SUBLYME & HOLY ORDER OF THE SOOT (SHOTS)
Those who are no longer ignorant of History may relive it,
without the Blood, Sweat, and Tears.
With apologies to George Santayana & W. S. Churchill

"As Mark Twain once put it, “History doesn’t repeat itself, but it does rhyme.”

Offline Story

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Re: The Battle of Eccles Hill, 1870
« Reply #14 on: April 27, 2016, 04:40:53 PM »
The Canadian defenders ...

Reference the gentleman at 'port arms', second from the left; once upon a time, I bought a M1865 Spencer carbine out of Newfoundland that had 'dishing' where I would have expected the Canadian military acceptance stamps to have been. IIRC, those were purchased to arm Canadian militia cavalry against further Fenian shenanigans.

 

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