20 & 12 ga reloading gear for young 'uns

[Ol Gabe]

Pards,
Over coffee yesterday a young friend said he got a new Mossberg 20 for Xmas and his brother got a new 12. They have never reloaded and after going through 4 boxes each of AA's they barely got their collective appetites wet and wanted more! Yee Haw!
After some jawin' they decided as to how it would be a lot more efficient to reload themselves, I agreed and since they don't frequent forums like this I suggested that I would ask the 'pros' here for some new inexpensive start-up equipment and/or suggestions on used gear.
So, any and all comments and suggestions are welcome, post here or PM me if you have something you might want to get rid of at a fair price and I'll let them know when they buy the coffee next time.
Best regards and good shooting!
'Ol Gabe

[Delmonico]

I don't have any, but good for you.

[rickk]

Ol Gabe,

Shotgun reloading equipment for real cheap can be a tough call.

I started on a LEE Load-ALL Jr. They were dirt cheap but no longer available. They are very slow, and the quality of the crimp I was able to achieve was mediocre. I sort of gave up on shotgun reloading for quite a while, buying what little I needed at Dick's Sportsman's when they ran a sale.

About a year ago I got a renewed urge to reload shotgun. The dumb-dumbs behind the counter at Dicks turned me off. I just could not bring myself to go to the store again.

I wound up getting a MEC 600 JR and am really happy with it. By the time you get done with bushings and charge bars and suck the price goes well over $200. I probably had $300 invested into it before I loaded my first hull. Realistically you would want a setup for each gauge.

I also invested in a LEE Cast Classic press and a couple of sets of 12 Gauge dies  (both the Cowboy dies that only work on Bras and also the now obsolete dies that work on plastic).  They work well for specialty stuff and black powder loads but the dies only come in 12 gauge.  You can get 20 gauge dies for brass hulls from 4D. Like the 12 gauge RCBS dies they will only fit in a press with a removable 1-1/4x12 bushing.   This approach probably isn't what you want either.

So, while I have never used one, but maybe someone else has, I would suggest looking at the LEE Load-ALL (not the obsolete "Jr" model).  They have been around a long time. I see similarities between it and the Cheapo Jr, so maybe someone with first hand experience can chime in here.  I am seeing them all over EBAY NIB for about $50 each.  I don't think you will be able to beat that price unless you stumble across one of those "deals" that only happen once in a great while.

Good luck with your quest.

BTW, Ballistic Products Inc is a great place to shop for shotgun reloading stuff.

Rick

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[Mako]

Ol Gabe,

...I started on a LEE Load-ALL Jr. They were dirt cheap but no longer available. They are very slow, and the quality of the crimp I was able to achieve was mediocre. I sort of gave up on shotgun reloading for quite a while, buying what little I needed at Dick's Sportsman's when they ran a sale...

Rick

Rick,
The Lee load-Alls are still available.  You can get either gauge at Midway for less than $44:

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/436640/lee-load-all-2-shotshell-press-12-gauge-2-3-4-3

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/182430/lee-load-all-2-shotshell-press-20-gauge-2-3-4-3

But like you I like the MEC 600 JR., excellent press easy to use, strong and versatile.  More expensive, normal price at Midway $159.99:
http://www.midwayusa.com/product/389536/mec-600-jr-mark-5-single-stage-shotshell-press-12-gauge-2-3-4-3

There is a "secret to keeping your costs under control with a MEC.  You get a universal Multi-Scale Universal Charge Bar for only $36 right now and you never buy another bushing or charge bar again.  I have them on three presses and they work great.

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/746153/multi-scale-universal-charge-bar-with-powder-baffle-model-c-cs-mec-single-stage-shotshell-loaders-600-jr-sizemaster?cm_vc=S015ID389536

So for $160 + $36 ($196) you get the most versatile shotshell loader known to man. Of course $44 is awfully tempting, it comes with bushings and more.  Rick is right though they are a bear to use sometimes.  The work best with Winchester AA hulls in my experience, I found that even Peters Blue Magics or the Old Rem. Competition hulls didn't work as well.  I sold my 12 ga for $25 to a new BP shooter and We still have a 20 ga out at the ranch with a MEC 600 Jr. in 28 and 12 ga.  We don't load much out there we just keep them there to make the kids load when they get underfoot.

I have MEC 750 presses which are progressive, but the MEC 600 JR. is still the best first and possibly the last press for a CAS shooter. Easy to use, easy to check, easy to correct, just easy.

Regards,
Mako

[Delmonico]

The Lee Load Alls will do a good job on AA's, some of the other cases not so good, the old Peter "Blue Magic" cases were hard to get locked down, the ends would unroll and the shot would float down into the defroster vent on your pick-up and make a heck of a noise on the first cold day.  Ain't loaded with mine or 12 gauge at all for years. 

Got a MEC Jr in 28 back in about 83 and love it, used to see a lot of those universal bars for sale cheap, used to work in a friends gunshop and he wouldn't stock them at all.  Unless they have improved them they tended to change settings a little bit as you load, not enough to be dangerous but enough to change the patterning a bit. 

[Johnny McCrae]

I started reloading 12 Ga. Shotgun shells earlier this year with a MEC 600 Jr. Mark 5. This press is easy to use and produces a quality reload. I really like the convenience of reloading the exact round I want at home rather than traveling at least 30 miles to buy them.

[Stu Kettle]

I never heard of a Load All Jr.  I started loading on a Load All in the 70s, & switched to a Load All II in the 80s because I thought the auto primer feed would be the greatest thing ever - it wasn't, but I've loaded thousands of rounds on that machine & ever had a problem with crimps until the AA design changed.  I've loaded a lot of different cases, including Blue Maxes.  The problem I have now is that shot is so costly that I can buy loaded ammo for less than I can reload.

[rickk]

Load-All Jr:



It sorta look sand works like a cheaply made, mostly plastic mini MEC Jr, but without powder or shot dispenser.

Hardly fancy, but they sorta work. If you want to load BP and roll crimp with a drill press setup, they are excellent.

They are cool for loading slugs over smokeless as well, assuming you roll crimp on a drill press.

They will resize, reprime, stuff a wad in.

Like I said, they crimp too, but not well.

Powder and shot get put in with dippers.

I don't see any on fleabay right now, but $10 bucks would be a fair price to pay for one in any caliber. Make sure it comes with the sizing ring. They tend to get lost and you cant resize without it.

Rick

[Delmonico]

I started loading 28 gauge shotshells with the old Lee hand tools back when there was a peanut farmer in the white house.  Slow but the make a high quality shell if you reload your empties.  My hunting load at the time was loaded in Federal cases and the guy who helped me out sold me empties and sized them for me.  He was a 28 man also and like most of us, very anal on making perfect shells.  The Lee hand dies did a good job, I still have a set but prefer to hang on to them.

[Buffler Razz]

I got my first reloader back when I was 14 (over 40 yrs ago!) it was a Mec 600 Jr. I still have it and use it just fine. A freind of the family showed me the ropes on how to set it up and run shells with it. I got my components at a local shop, after a few trips toting my mom to make the purchases the owner had her write me a permission slip and I picked up my shot, powder etc on my own. They can be found on some of the sites at a fair price if you are not in a hurry. I have the universal charge bar and it makes it right handy for changing loads.

[cpt dan blodgett]

Started years ago with a lee load all.  It sorta worked, was shooting a little CAS from a double and at birds with a pump.  Somewhere along the line it broke.  About the same time my brother inherited a 12 guage MEC 600 Jr and 20 gage Mec Sizemaster from a brother in law.  Not sure how it happened but both the Mec presses are now in my garage.  Tossed the Lee Load All, am sure if not free, lee would have supplied the part at a very low cost.  After the mec was kinda like asking somebody to switch from a Porshe 911 to a VW Beetle 1600 cc.  Both will get you to the store, but the Porche is more fun enroute.

If you are stuck on AAs then it is worth the effort to reload.  If you are shooting CAS and cheapy shells do not fly out of the chambers, or you want low recoil you really will need to reload.  If you can buy the 8 or 9 field loads that are really cheap promo loads beginning of Dove and Quail season, it really is hardly worth the effort.  The price of shot has gone out the roof in the past few years. 

If you want to shoot Holy Black then reloading is about the only affordable game in town.