Cas City Forum Hall & CAS-L
Special Interests - Groups & Societies => USFA CSS => Topic started by: Buckaroo Lou on June 18, 2022, 11:20:19 AM
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In my opinion this is a terrific looking USFA revolver, probably because I was a Charlton Heston fan.
https://www.gunsinternational.com/guns-for-sale-online/revolvers/usfa-pistols-revolvers/u-s-f-a-charlton-heston-deluxe-quot-prototype-quot-commemorative-single-action-army-45-colt.cfm?gun_id=101976236
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Beautiful gun. Do you think it is an all USA made one?
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:) Well Heck ;)
I realize in the rarefied air of the collectors world, there seems to be some cache attached to an offering of USFA to be ALL USA. Which frankly, I don't buy into. I think it's dumb. It makes no difference. Either way, they are real fine SA revolvers.
This particular referenced example is particular fine in fact. I'm not a collector and wouldn't even dream of paying that much money for anything "previously sold at retail" but it is unquestionably a superb example. Were a "collector" I wouldn't care were it ALL USA or not. Bottom line is ALL USFA guns are just gussied up Uberti in the final analysis.
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Bottom line is ALL USFA guns are just gussied up Uberti in the final analysis.
That is so wrong (factually incorrect) I wouldn't know where to start. I'm surprised as a gunsmith you would make a statement like that.
You are entitled to your own opinion but you're not entitled to your own facts.
Dave
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:) Well Hi DaveT ;)
Ok, let me see. Way back in the beginning, USPFA began existence, using imported Uberti Major parts and assemblies, a well as functional internals, final finished and assembled here. Very Fine finishing indeed. Really fine guns.
Then, USFA sourced their own machine tools and CNC and began making their parts "in house." It didn't happen over night, but it did in fact happen. ALL USA parts is a FACT. But, here is the rub:
The CNC and Machine tools were set-up and programed to produce parts of the exact same dimensions as the previously imported Uberti Parts. So, if you will, USFA became a CLONE of Uberti. Very well made CLONE of Uberti. Hence, my descriptive of "Gussied-Up Uberti." Duplicated to the point I use to mix and match Uberti parts as "drop in" and "bolt on."
Now, let us add to the story. You wanna guess where the USFA machine tools went?? Complete with imbedded CNC programming??
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I think its about mass word association. ;D
usfa -all usa made?
45acp - moro warriors
defensive ammo - range ammo
357 mag - You can shoot tons of cheap little 38spl through it!
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:) Well Hi DaveT ;)
Ok, let me see. Way back in the beginning, USPFA began existence, using imported Uberti Major parts and assemblies, a well as functional internals, final finished and assembled here. Very Fine finishing indeed. Really fine guns.
Then, USFA sourced their own machine tools and CNC and began making their parts "in house." It didn't happen over night, but it did in fact happen. ALL USA parts is a FACT. But, here is the rub:
The CNC and Machine tools were set-up and programed to produce parts of the exact same dimensions as the previously imported Uberti Parts. So, if you will, USFA became a CLONE of Uberti. Very well made CLONE of Uberti. Hence, my descriptive of "Gussied-Up Uberti." Duplicated to the point I use to mix and match Uberti parts as "drop in" and "bolt on."
Now, let us add to the story. You wanna guess where the USFA machine tools went?? Complete with imbedded CNC programming??
Would the word "Standard" have any connection??
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:) Texas John Ringo ;)
Lemme see. Trucks were loaded with packed and crated Machine Tools at the now dead USFA works. Those same trucks were seen to unload those same packages and crates at Standard. There may well be a connection. There is also the rumor that Uberti, USFA, and Standard SA parts will interchange. Hummmmmmmmm.
Let us Have Fun Out There
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;D Seems as if I heard this somewhere before, not from you ;D
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Ringo:
It is good to see that you are still alive and kicking.
T-Joe
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Ringo:
It is good to see that you are still alive and kicking.
T-Joe
Yes, still around. Shot my 1st SASS match in nearly 3 years last month. Nothing wrong, just life got in the way. ;)
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I have never really understood why the big deal about whether USFA made their guns using Uberti dimensions, or Colt, or whoever. The fact is they achieved being CNC machined stim to stern from 4140 solid bar stock right here in the good ole USA and then hand fitted and finished right here in the good ole USA. The end product being roll marked on the barrels USFA MFG CO. HARTFORD CONN. USA, arguably the best single action ever made, thus far.
Whether Standard Manufacturing can achieve the status of being the best single action ever made in my humble opinion is yet to be determined. And why wouldn't Standard not acquire USFA’s equipment since USFA had already achieved success as the best.
I am certainly no expert, but I have owned them all and in my estimation USFA is still king of the mountain when it comes to quality. Having said that, were it not for the Colt SAA there would have been no icon to perfect.
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Back to the original post and point, the OP calls to attention
a USFA SAA that is a "CHARLTON HESTON PROTOTYPE COMMEMORATIVE" beautified by Turnbull for the asking price of $7750.00 !!!!
Now if it was actually Moses's or Ben Hur's gun ... ;)
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Back to the original post and point, the OP calls to attention
a USFA SAA that is a "CHARLTON HESTON PROTOTYPE COMMEMORATIVE" beautified by Turnbull for the asking price of $7750.00 !!!!
Now if it was actually Moses's or Ben Hur's gun ... ;)
That is really funny ;D
My reference was to the looks of the revolver and not the asking price. I still think it is a terrific looking revolver.
Would I spend that much for it? Depends on how badly I might want it, and certainly not unless I was well enough off so that amount was like a very far lesser amount is to my current financial status. :)
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:) Lou ;)
There is no doubt USFA found THE MOST expensive method to manufacture their SA. USFA also manufactured the most precise SA on the market. To their doom. At the price point, the guns should have been ready to play right out of the box. They wern't. It took a goodly amount of work to make them user friendly and useable for our game.
A much better choice for someone who wants to actually use their SA, whether for goofing off or competing in our game, a much more reasonable purchase was and is a pair of Pietta GW IIs. Excellent, serviceable PAIR of guns for less than the price of USFA or Colt. Colt, also way over priced and way under built.
As to your original post. That is a superb example. Absolutely the Biz. Absolutely not worth just shy of Eight Grand, or if you will, add shipping and insurance and your right at Eight Grand.
People are still Contagious. Avoidance is Suggested.
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It is a beauty, but the only way it's worth eight grand is if it was previously owned by Alec Baldwin. ;D
(OK, OK, a little cold...my apologies).
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I realize in the rarefied air of the collectors world, there seems to be some cache attached to an offering of USFA to be ALL USA. Which frankly, I don't buy into. I think it's dumb. It makes no difference. Either way, they are real fine SA revolvers........Bottom line is ALL USFA guns are just gussied up Uberti in the final analysis.
Patently false, to the point of absurdity. You obviously don't have a clue what you're talking about. I know you have a real high opinion of your opinion but you're just flat wrong. The difference between the early and later guns is significant. Yes, the early guns are just gussied up Uberti's. The later all domestic guns, head, shoulders and tits above the early guns.
At the price point, the guns should have been ready to play right out of the box. They wern't. It took a goodly amount of work to make them user friendly and useable for our game.
Also makes no sense. Judging by the above, I'm not surprised. They're oversprung, that's it.
Would the word "Standard" have any connection??
Nope. That's rumor, denied by the folks at Standard.
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Nope. That's rumor, denied by the folks at Standard.
I'm just a bystander here, but...I could be misremembering but haven't there been comparison videos where the Standard measured the same size as USFA/Uberti? If so, why would Standard do that?
And to the OP, yes that is a terrific looking gun!
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Maybe the same reason USFA did, I do not know.
But I have it on good authority from a writer that spoke with the president of Standard Mfg that they did not get their machinery or employees from USFA.
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Well golly. I also have it on good authority, from a commentator, who spoke with the warden, that Charles Manson categorically denied his crime.
I have also never said the all USA made USFA weren't FINE guns. They are. However, when you have worked on as many of them as I have, you discover they do have warts. they did/do require more than just "springs." I have also stated, USFA guns were overpriced. They were and now are commanding stupid money.
You are also entitled to your "opinion," right, wrong or indifferent. Oh, and I also have it on good authority, the Machine tools from USFA were seen shipped to Standard. What "they" did with them?? No clue. But there is certain evidence . . .
Have Fun Out There
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Sure would like to hear Garry's take on all this. After all, he was there.
Dave
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You can call, ask for Lou and ask him. The word from the horse's mouth is that they did not buy USFA's machinery. Not that it really matters.
I don't care how many guns you've worked on. If you conclude that the Uberti parts USFA's and the domestic parts USFA's are all the same, your "opinion" is highly suspect. Yes, I will flat-out call you out. Anyone who has owned and disassembled both should be able to plain see and feel the difference.
USFA's were not overpriced. In fact, they were underpriced. They were too good for their price point. People scoffed at paying Colt money for something that was not a Colt but they were easily head and shoulders above anything Colt ever produced. Look at the Freedom Arms guns for example. All stainless steel, no period correct finish work, $3000 to start. The domestic USFA's are machined and finished 'that' good. If you disagree, you either need your eyes checked, you're not being honest or you have an agenda. USFA is the reason why Colt upped their game. If they were all just a gussied up Uberti, they wouldn't have had to bother. This is just silly.
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Well, here is the kicker there Craig. I have in fact owned, disassembled, worked on and tuned both. All manner of USFA offerings. I have never in fact made any claim they were other than Very Fine guns. They were, while in production, and they are, now not in production, Very Fine Guns. That is a given. They also had Warts. That is a fact.
Now I'll repeat myself, at their price point, the guns should have been "right" right out of the box. They wern't. Unless the intended purpose for ownership is simply to place them in a safe and fondle 'em once in a while.
Your prime displeasure seems to be taking great umbrage at my descriptive terminology. Sorry, but I don't make apology for that. Your have in fact, placed the "Apple of Your Eye" on such a high pedestal you're blinded by simple reality. You're comparison with a limited production, niche market specialty item is ludicrous.
I will agree though, This is just silly. We could go round and round for a decade and not budge. Let's just give it a rest, shall we.
Have Fun Out There
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I'm not going to participate if my posts are going to be deleted without explanation.
Suffice to say, you're the only person I've EVER heard say that the Uberti parts guns and the domestic guns were all the same. I know that I don't agree with you and don't know of anyone else who does. 99.99% will say just the opposite. The early guns were indeed just gussied up Uberti's. The machine work, the specs, the polishing, virtually everything about the later guns is not just better but measurably better and that is why people pay more for them. Otherwise, we'd just buy new Uberti's, send them to Turnbull for refinishing and save ourselves time and money.
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:) WELL BYE ;)
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Well, I remember the USFA website stating that their SAA's were built to original Colt blueprints - with the sole exception that the cylinder was 0.020" larger diameter for a little added strength. And parts were interchangeable with Colt. I haven't had to do any repairs on my 4 USFA single actions, so I don't know about that. What I do know is that the limited number of Lightning rifles were exact copies of the Colt Lightnings. I have a USFA Lightning. Later I bought a Colt Lightning that was a wall-hanger, missing quite a few parts. I bought the missing parts from USFA and they were drop-in for the Colt. And now it is a shooter again! ;D
I know prices escalated toward the end on USFA, but I bought 2 premiums (44 WCF) for $875 each, with Longhunter tuning included. Both are beautiful guns and great shooters. I later bought 2 Rodeo's (45 Colt), again tuned by Longhunter for $575 each. All are hugely superior to the Uberti and Pietta's I own. I regularly kick myself in the posterior for not buying a pair of 32-20's back then.
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:) Well Hi DaveT ;)
Ok, let me see. Way back in the beginning, USPFA began existence, using imported Uberti Major parts and assemblies, a well as functional internals, final finished and assembled here. Very Fine finishing indeed. Really fine guns.
Then, USFA sourced their own machine tools and CNC and began making their parts "in house." It didn't happen over night, but it did in fact happen. ALL USA parts is a FACT. But, here is the rub:
The CNC and Machine tools were set-up and programed to produce parts of the exact same dimensions as the previously imported Uberti Parts. So, if you will, USFA became a CLONE of Uberti. Very well made CLONE of Uberti. Hence, my descriptive of "Gussied-Up Uberti." Duplicated to the point I use to mix and match Uberti parts as "drop in" and "bolt on."
Now, let us add to the story. You wanna guess where the USFA machine tools went?? Complete with imbedded CNC programming??
I see where you are coming from, but my 2 USA made guns, the Uberti cylinder from Navy Arms Cattlemen does not fit into the frame. The frame is too small. Yet a Colt 2nd generation fits into them, perfectly. The timing is perfect. What gives? I do not know. Maybe someone can answer.
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I see where you are coming from, but my 2 USA made guns, the Uberti cylinder from Navy Arms Cattlemen does not fit into the frame. The frame is too small. Yet a Colt 2nd generation fits into them, perfectly. The timing is perfect. What gives? I do not know. Maybe someone can answer.
First time I have heard of this. Very interesting.
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USFA's were not overpriced. In fact, they were underpriced. They were too good for their price point. People scoffed at paying Colt money for something that was not a Colt but they were easily head and shoulders above anything Colt ever produced. Look at the Freedom Arms guns for example. All stainless steel, no period correct finish work, $3000 to start. The domestic USFA's are machined and finished 'that' good. If you disagree, you either need your eyes checked, you're not being honest or you have an agenda.
333 N. XXXXXXX St.
Mesa, AZ 85207
Feb. 27, 2004
Doug Donnelly
United States Fire Arms Mfg. Co.
55 Van Dyke Ave.
Hartford, CT 06106
Dear Mr. Donnelly,
Recently, I purchased my second Single Action Army in .45 Colt and I am very pleased with it. I have said since buying my first SAA, that having a USFA was like having a brand new first generation Colt. It is in my opinion, the finest single action revolver made. I still stand by that.
I have been doing action work on Colts SAAs and replicas since 1978, and attribute a lot of my skills that I have learned, to Bob James. I believe him to be one of the best SAA specialists in the world. Now to get to the reason I am writing this.
Although I am very pleased with my new USFA, when I started doing the action job on it, I noticed something I have never seen before in any single action, and it caused me great concern. The working (hammer cam) side of the bolt had been what looks like belt sanded for relief. (See photo)
Top View drawing
(actual photo via scanner)
It has been sanded or ground by approximately .015, which is about 1/3 of the thickness of that leg. While I did polished that area highly, I would not be surprised to have bolt failure due to that leg breaking, within 6 months of SASS match shooting. And I can not figure out the reason for it being ground.
Also, I noticed that the hand had been very nicely machined, but could have stood have the sharp edges broken.
I would expect these minor flaws in an Italian Colt replica, I have seen them all too often (with the exception of the ground bolt), but I did not expect to see them in the USFA, especially when the rest of the gun is immaculate.....
This is a copy of a letter that I sent after buying my first USFA. Wanna know what I got in return?
ZILCH, NADA, ZIP, NOTHING. I did not even get acknowledgement of the letter .
So don't try and say there were without flaws. They might not have overprice then, but the prices they are bring now is ridiculous for a gun from a defunct company.
I quit as moderator of this board, (the first for many years, i might add) because I could not believe in USFA after Donnely started experimenting with brown, pink, and blue guns, and then his little "toy" the ZIP gun. He had a good thing going but blew it on his "larks".
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Who used the word "flawless"? You're also judging an entire company based on a single example. Run it until it breaks, fit a new bolt and move on.
I disagree on their pricing. They should have always been $2000-$3000. When the friggin' pre-war was $1200, so was a Colt SAA and the USFA was 10x the gun.
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While I did polished that area highly, I would not be surprised to have bolt failure due to that leg breaking, within 6 months of SASS match shooting.
So you're trashing the whole company and all their guns, based on something you think might happen. Good grief!
I bought a USFA 5-1/2" Gunslinger (I hate that name) a while back. It had the cylinder pin retained by the spring loaded cross pin in what many think of as a "smokeless powder frame" so I thought for the first time out I would shoot Winchester's recommended factory duplication load, 7.1g WW231 behind a 255g soft cast RNFP. At the very first shot what I call the firing pin bushing in the standing breech exploded in a shower of chunks, one zooming by my eye close enough to make me duck (late of course). The primer was gone but the brass around the primer cup had flowed back into the gap where the bushing was. I went through 7 gunsmiths before I found someone who would work on it and they did repair it quite well.
I didn't go on any public forum and trash USFA for the lousy firing pin bushing they used on that gun. I have 7 USFA single action revolvers. They are my favorite firearms and I shoot black powder through them regularly. I find them superior to the small collection of 1st Generation Colts I owned 25+ some years ago.
Dave
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Who used the word "flawless"? You're also judging an entire company based on a single example. Run it until it breaks, fit a new bolt and move on.
On a brand new gun?? I think not. I did have to refit a new bolt, no thanks to USFA. And no, i wasn't judging an entire company based on a single example. He owned the replica market but blew it with his larks. Tell me I am wrong about that.
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USFA ended how he wanted it to. Good, bad or indifferent, it was his choice. IMHO, this happened mostly because they were underpriced. It's kinda funny it's taken this long for the critics to come out of the woodwork. ::)
I thought for two seconds about denying myself the pleasure of one of my USFA's over a part that I could easily replace.......and laughed.
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Price: $7,750.00 still available ;)
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I had a very good friend who died from a heart attack a little over 20 years ago. He and I were at a gun show when he came across a silversmith who had a small powder flask for priming the flash pan on a flintlock. It was 75.00. He would not buy it even though I did my best to convince him to purchase it. When I questioned his reason for not buying it (and he could very well afford it) he told me it was about “solvency”. After he died I always referred to him as the most solvent dead man I ever knew. My point being, why must someone be criticized for paying “too much” for anything. Life is way too short to deny yourself something you can afford just because of a perceived high price. Just my two cents worth.
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You have a point, if its " something you can afford"
That is why, people pay 2 & 3 + times the retail to be the "first on their block"
Currently, Ford's new Bronco is in that category, the newest wowzah Corvette is too;)
and maybe the Chrysler HELLCAT.
Guys are paying a premium for Springfield's new SA-35 just to have one...
There is no doubt, Charlie Heston got paid royalties for his name on the limited edition, and 'ol Doug Turnbull was paid well for a premium finished prototype.
All in all, makes that gun a COMMEMORATIVE DELUXE MODEL.
your point IF it's " something you can afford"
My point,... It is still available :o
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I've just never been able to wrap my head around the "High End" guns even when the High End guns were just "High End." Pay that kind of money and still need a serious bit of action work to make 'em ready for our game.
I also never understood "Collectors" who put perfectly good guns in the back of a safe, never to see the light of day again. At least those guys like Yahoody take their special toys out and played with 'em.
I suppose, for those who see obscene sums of money for some, yes, really cool guns, as pocket change, never playing with 'em is OK. I once had a chance to pick up a matching set of engraved, Silver Plated early second generation colts at what was a reasonable price. When I told the fella who had them on his table, I was going to do an action job, some good springs and shoot 'em CAS, He pulled them back and said "not for sale." Seemed kinda dumb at the time. Annoying as all get out too.
Play Safe Out There
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USFA ended how he wanted it to. Good, bad or indifferent, it was his choice.
Interestingly, my prior post was silently deleted ::)
I would have appreciated the courtesy of a PM, we are all adults here, and the BOSS does not condone censorship.
USFA ended because Beretta, new owner of Uberti (Uberti became owned by Benelli, part of the Beretta holding company )
ended the relationship which allowed USFA to use the Uberti proprietary CNC software/design code.
So, without the Single Action business to pay the bills, Donally was pretty much hamstrung.
Sad, because I was saving up for a pair of Rodeos and a short barrled Omnipotent.
Not gonna happen at current prices, the value simply isn't there for what they are.
yhs
prof marvel
Editted -
Terribley sorry, I should not be posting with a fever :o
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...USFA ended because Beretta, new owner of Uberti (Uberti became owned by Benelli, part of the Beretta holding company )
ended the relationship which allowed USFA to use the Uberti proprietary CNC software/design code....
I've never heard this before. Interesting.
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At Shot 07 I talked to Donnally in regard to the then new planned Remington 75 ....
He had a Uberti rough forged frame, and another one CNC machined in house.
I saw a finished gun in a Plexiglas display case.
It was a 3 way deal he said, Remington would be on board (name) USFA and Uberti
He was livid, when Beretta pulled the plug, Remington dropped out that doomed the Remington revolver project.
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USFA ended because Beretta, new owner of Uberti (Uberti became owned by Benelli, part of the Beretta holding company )
ended the relationship which allowed USFA to use the Uberti proprietary CNC software/design code.
yhs
prof marvel
prof marvel,
Please understand I am not questioning the truth or accuracy of the Beretta account you have presented. I just think it interesting that of all the discussions we have had on the forum about why USFA ceased production of their single action revolvers, like Abilene has stated, this is the first time I have ever heard this.
Just because Beretta pulled the plug on their involvement with the Remington project does that mean they had the authority to pull the plug on all the proprietary CNC software/design codes USFA may have been using for the production of their other revolvers.
Again please understand I am not denying the accuracy or truth to your account. Just astonished that this is the first time I have heard it. Would this not better explain the demise of USFA and take all the heat off of Doug Donnally that some of us have heaped on him.
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Back then it was my understanding that USFA would produce the 1875 and that, thanks to the aforementioned collaboration with Remington, they would bear the Remington roll markings just like the originals. For a very brief period Remington actually listed the USFA 1875 on their website as a "coming soon" attraction.
Another factor at the time was the fact that Remington was in dire financial straights and I, for one, attributed that to the demise of the USFA/Remington project. Too bad! Like them or not, it would be cool to own a USFA 1875 that bore the original Remington barrel markings.
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I wish GaryG would chime in on this thread.
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I wish GaryG would chime in on this thread.
https://www.cascity.com/forumhall/index.php?topic=28630.0
Offline Harley Starr
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Re: USFA Remington
« Reply #8 on: October 20, 2009, 01:14:09 AM »
LikeQuote
I called Gary Granger to confirm this. I told him about this particular thread which I am responding to so I could confirm it.
After talking to Gary Granger, I've come to the conclusion that Doug Donnally does not keep his employees well informed. :-X
Translation, Gary found out about this "cancellation" FROM ME and nobody at USFA told him about it. ???
Somewhere in my photo's I have my photo on the 2007 Shot Show and Doug with the finished Remington
imagine what that would bring NOW if went up for sale.
Beretta squoze Donnally out
Remington pulled out
turn out the lights the party was over ::)
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So Major 2, to be clear, are you saying the demise of the Remington project is what determined the end of all USFA single action production, or just the Remington project?
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The demise of USFA was collage of countless crack-pot ideas, and poor leadership.
The Production of the SAA was NOT one of them, Quality yes, but cost-effective no.
Gary Granger had stated that " they should have never tried to make all the parts in house
turning a profit that way, wasn't profitable"
Too many ill-fated projects, USFA (Donnally) over promised and under deliver on too many "new" projects. > the Woodsman for example,
That short lived USFA's version of the Taurus "Judge" like project, and the USFA Lightening failure's,
the expensive USFA/Turnbull 1911 in a market rife with 1911's .... the Remington.
The big splash Shot Show 2007 (Orlando) intro "new project Remington"
Beretta (prototype Uberti forgings and CNC) hung him out to dry, Shaky Remington pulled out, that doomed the Remington's.
The "ZIP" was the final straw on the camel's back.
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I never understood why they'd try to resurrect the Woodsman when there were plenty of nice originals available for less money. That "Judge" like thing just seemed bizarre.
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USFA coping Taurus' "Judge" was somewhat akin to BMW building a Yugo ::)
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As a retired CNC manual programmer, I can easily say with all honesty that doing a program to replace "the Uberti proprietary CNC software/design" would be no big deal. I can't think of a single programmer at our plant (Honeywell Aerospace) that could not write such a program. Had I the experience with the software, even I could have done it. It's just defining features from a certain starting point. Nothing mysterious about it at all.
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prof marvel,
Please understand I am not questioning the truth or accuracy of the Beretta account you have presented. I just think it interesting that of all the discussions we have had on the forum about why USFA ceased production of their single action revolvers, like Abilene has stated, this is the first time I have ever heard this.
Just because Beretta pulled the plug on their involvement with the Remington project does that mean they had the authority to pull the plug on all the proprietary CNC software/design codes USFA may have been using for the production of their other revolvers.
Again please understand I am not denying the accuracy or truth to your account. Just astonished that this is the first time I have heard it. Would this not better explain the demise of USFA and take all the heat off of Doug Donnally that some of us have heaped on him.
Terribley sorry,Lou - I should not be posting with a fever :o
fortunately the strange crap I apparently bid on over on GB was bught by someone else!
prf
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The demise of USFA was collage of countless crack-pot ideas, and poor leadership.
The Production of the SAA was NOT one of them, Quality yes, but cost-effective no.
Gary Granger had stated that " they should have never tried to make all the parts in house
turning a profit that way, wasn't profitable"
Too many ill-fated projects, USFA (Donnally) over promised and under deliver on too many "new" projects. > the Woodsman for example,
That short lived USFA's version of the Taurus "Judge" like project, and the USFA Lightening failure's,
the expensive USFA/Turnbull 1911 in a market rife with 1911's .... the Remington.
The big splash Shot Show 2007 (Orlando) intro "new project Remington"
Beretta (prototype Uberti forgings and CNC) hung him out to dry, Shaky Remington pulled out, that doomed the Remington's.
The "ZIP" was the final straw on the camel's back.
thank you Major! I stand corrected!
Terribly sorry, I should not be posting with a fever :o
fortunately the strange crap I apparently bid on over on GB was bught by someone else.
prf
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As a retired CNC manual programmer, I can easily say with all honesty that doing a program to replace "the Uberti proprietary CNC software/design" would be no big deal. I can't think of a single programmer at our plant (Honeywell Aerospace) that could not write such a program. Had I the experience with the software, even I could have done it. It's just defining features from a certain starting point. Nothing mysterious about it at all.
Terribley sorry, Rio - I should not be posting with a fever :o
fortunately the strange crap I apparently bid on over on GB was bught by someone else!
prf
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thank you Major! I stand corrected!
Terribly sorry, I should not be posting with a fever :o
fortunately the strange crap I apparently bid on over on GB was bught by someone else.
prf
no reason to apologize :)
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Hey Prof, get well soon! :)
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Found the photo, Donnally @ 07 Shot Show with his ill-fated Remington.
He showed me the two Uberti sourced forgings, one rough the other machined,
and this finished gun...
Remington (Brand license) backed out,
Uberti went one to produce their own Forged Framed Remy, cutting Donnally off.
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There was also the Hartford guns that never got made.
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Who made all those nickel guns on the hartford wheel display? Were they ubertis?