Author Topic: Original Open Top Cartridge - Which was it?  (Read 1800 times)

Offline FriscoCounty

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Original Open Top Cartridge - Which was it?
« on: June 18, 2019, 02:17:39 PM »
What cartridge were the original Colt 1871-1872 Open Tops officially chambered for?  I know it was a rim fire cartridge and the general consensus seems to be .44 Henry.  However, I have seen a variety of claims, including .44 Henry RF, .44 Short RF, .44 Long RF, and one published source claiming it was .44-23-200 RF. 

Anyone have period advertisements, manuals, documentation for it? 

Thanks.
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Offline Crow Choker

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Re: Original Open Top Cartridge - Which was it?
« Reply #1 on: June 18, 2019, 04:07:37 PM »
Officially, as you mentioned the 44 Henry Rimfire, same cartridge used by the Henry rifle, the .44 Rimfire. Reports are written here and there of them being rechambered in other calibers by private gunsmiths. I have read that some of the late production Open Tops were altered to fire centerfire primed 44 Colt cartridges. I haven't had time to go into my research library of Colt history books, but the 44 Rimfire was the original, done so to be a companion cartridge to the Henry Rifle. Short answer, a lot of other info can be added. A lot of names can be given to the same cartridge, depending on region, author, history, etc, as the 45 Colt for the 1873 Peacemaker inherited the name 45 Long Colt by some.  .44-23-200RF. That sounds like a loading recipe for the 44 'Henry' Rimfire, ie .44 caliber bullet, 23 grains of black powder, and a 200 grain bullet. Just a guess. Best of my knowledge anyway. ;D
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Offline Tuolumne Lawman

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Re: Original Open Top Cartridge - Which was it?
« Reply #2 on: June 18, 2019, 04:46:47 PM »
They were chambered for the .44 "Stetson" rimfire with a swaged bulleted, also known as the ".44 Henry Flat"  It was the common 200 grain flat point .44 Henry load that had 28 grains of powder and a slightly longer case that the original .44 Henry with its longer 215 grain conical ball, over 26 grains of powder in a shorter case. 

While the overall length was the same, the early case was shorter, and the bullets tended to be slightly larger in diameter that the later 44 Flat.  1872 Open Tops, in my understanding, were not made really to chamber the earlier conical 215 grain rounds, as by 1872, only .44 flat was being made, as the 1866 was the most popular rifle then.
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Re: Original Open Top Cartridge - Which was it?
« Reply #3 on: Today at 04:32:16 PM »

Offline Drydock

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Re: Original Open Top Cartridge - Which was it?
« Reply #3 on: June 18, 2019, 06:46:23 PM »
Remember as well: all these rounds were heel base bullets, so there was no shoulder in the chamber,  Thus cartridge length was not as critical as overall length.  Most any .44 rimfire of the proper diameter could be fired, if it did not exceed the OAL of the cylinder.  This would also apply to any conversions to straight case .44 CF.
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Offline nativeshootist

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Re: Original Open Top Cartridge - Which was it?
« Reply #4 on: June 18, 2019, 08:40:23 PM »
.44 Henry, plain and simple. Same round as the Henry and winchester '66 rifle.

Offline AntiqueSledMan

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Re: Original Open Top Cartridge - Which was it?
« Reply #5 on: June 19, 2019, 04:33:12 AM »
Looking at what I have it looks like the .44 Henry used a .446 heeled bullet,
you could probably shoot the Ballard .44 Long in it.
The S&W .44 American is supposed to be a close center fire alternative.
From Wikipedia,
"The .44 Henry cartridge was used most notably in the Henry Model 1860 repeating rifle. This rifle was first used in the American Civil War, mainly by Union cavalry troops, although only in very limited numbers. It was also used by the very few Confederate troops who managed to capture one of these rifles along with a supply of ammunition, which was impossible to find in the Confederate south.

After the Civil War, the Henry cartridge was used in the Winchester Model 1866 rifles during the Russo-Turkish War (1877-1878) by the Turkish troops and in the Franco-Prussian War 1870/71 by the French.

In civilian models, Winchester Model 1866 rifles and carbines, Smith & Wesson No. 3 Revolvers, Colt Model 1860 Army long cylinder conversion and the Colt Model 1871-72 "Open Top" revolvers were available in .44 Henry. From 1875 until 1880, Colt produced Model 1873 Single Action Army's in .44 Henry to accommodate owners of Henry Model 1860 and Winchester Model 1866 rifles and carbines."

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Offline Coffinmaker

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Re: Original Open Top Cartridge - Which was it?
« Reply #6 on: June 19, 2019, 10:09:49 AM »

I seem to remember, there may have been a Colt Proprietary cartridge intended for use in the original Open Top.  Unfortunately I can't remember the name of it.  Essentially, a .44 Henry Flat by another name.  The Open Top was originally chambered deliberately to serve in accompaniment to the Henry and Improved Henry Rifles.  Which it did admirably during it's relatively short production run.

There were several other Experimental or Development guns if you will, built by Colt but those odd chambered Open Tops were only built in onesies or twosies.  The Open Top guns, et all, were never chambered in 45 Colt.

 

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