Wow, lots of work being done on the road ditches around the county! I really have high hopes that this will help the drainage and thus help the potholes issues.
Tobina, I agree; the roads are getting so much better out our way. They even mowed the shoulders. I think they are doing a great job!
Just returned from Longton,I decided to come the back way.The County Guys were out working on River Rd from Elk Falls.Sure does look GOOD!!!Great Job County Guys.You got Donuts coming from me on Monday!!! Enjoy
Connie, thanks for getting the guys donuts this morning! I'm sure they all enjoyed it and appreciated it! River Road does look good!
Just curious as to why if/when someone says something BAD about the roads, the road guys jump all over the Forum to defend themselves... but when 3 people compliment them on the roads, they can't take the time to say "you're welcome" or "thanks for the compliment"?
Just in time for my visit to Kansas, awesome.
Well, I'm the wife of one of them. Another doesn't have a computer so I conveyed the good messages on to him. They WERE speechless! I was thanking Connie on their behalf since the one doesn't have a computer and my husband doesn't hardly ever use the computer. Sorry, as I reread what I typed I didn't make that clear...so ... Connie, on behalf of all the guys at the county shop where you so nicely took donuts this morning, THANK YOU!!! :-*
This is off subject so reholster that weapon.......
We don't have a River Rd. We don't have Busby Rd. or Cresco Rd. anymore......The names changed years ago.
How long do we have to wait for the information "data" to be released to the rest of the free world? GPS, google, etc systems still have FAS road numbers and inaccurate address information.
We try to get people to come to visit our perfect product of Kansas but can't tell them how to get here. UPS , FedEx and especally OTR freight drivers ask for directions from the grocery store staff all the time. Is there a fee we have to pay to update the mapping data? Is there someone at Garmin we can call? Is there a Magellan rep with a fax machine we could send an accurate map? Enhanced 911 provides gps capture of cell phone 10/20's but are they mapped to the old road names or is that correct. Is an emergency vehicle from neighboring ems say going to be able to find Road 7 at 3am?
I would like to know.
Quite a long time ago Janet posted information about the renaming of the county roads.
She was on the committee (I think) that did the renaming, explained how they were renamed, how numerical addresses were developed, etc.
She mentioned the proper state authority (whoever that might be) was notified of the changes and it was up to that agency to notify the map makers, etc., etc.
Sure would be nice if someone in county government would followup with the state because last time I checked even the state maps did not have the new road names.
I worked on that one way back in 2003-2005 (since our new sheriff, and the road boss weren't going to do anything about it). I'm the one who took Janet's hand written 911 map and managed to get the names and numbers computerized onto the official (at the time) KDOT map of Elk County. That's the map that is in the front of the Elk County Business Directory from that time period.
KDOT finally got around to updating the Elk County map about two years ago, after I had sent them the info they needed (aforementioned map) in 03. Their map doesn't look too different from mine, except you can barely read theirs and they didn't put the numbering on it like I did.
http://www.ksdot.org/burtransplan/maps/county-pdf/elk.PDF (http://www.ksdot.org/burtransplan/maps/county-pdf/elk.PDF)
I tried at the same time to find out how to get all the online mapping services to change their maps, just to be told their info comes from the feds. So I started contacting federal agencies that I thought would be the ultimate "source", GNIS, Geological Survey, Census, Weights and Measures, ESRI, you name it, I tried it. Nothing, not only nothing but no one seemed to know who to contact.
So I contacted places like Rand McNAlly, DeLorme, etc that publish maps. They would not disclose where their information comes from, and would not accept my map as being "official". Eventually I just gave up.
Maybe now that KDOT has put the roads on the map, some calls or emails to the map providers would get somewhere, since now I would think the info would be considered "official".
Charles
Janet was part of the committee to rename the county roads for the enhanced 911 service. The reason they are named as they are was to make it easier for the emergency services to find a location. Starting in the southwest part of the county the numbered roads run north and south. Thus, Road 9 is nine miles east of the west boundary. The east-west roads were named in alphabetical order starting in the south. Thus, Cresco Cemetery Road, as I always knew it, became Rock Road since it is one mile north of Quail Road. Some one looking for a certain address could locate it just by knowing that the higher the number, the further east it is or the higher the alphabet, the further north it is. One exception I know of is the road dividing Elk and Greenwood counties. It is call ElK-Greenwood County Line Rd. or something like that. Another is that the road sign at the Cresco Cemetery also has a sign that says Cresco Rd, along with the Rock Rd. They also tried to keep the names of the roads relevant to Elk County. I don't know many of the roads, but Turkey sticks in my mind. Guess where it is.
Would also be nice if the Platt Directory (rural roads directory) would show level of road maintenance. Road 9 does go a mile North of Limestone just East of our house... but I wouldn't recommend anyone taking that road and expect to get past the creek. I watched the FedEx guy try not too long ago... and then have to back UP the hill with all the slick rocks. I thought I might have to call Chuck to get the tractor to pull him back up!
Here's a story (to show that all counties in KS are dealing with issues)... my grandma lives in rural Southeast Rawlins county. Well, her 911 address in Rawlins county is different than her mailing address from Oberlin (Decatur county). Apparently when Decatur County did their 911 addresses, they did them for all mail routes, even if they were in another county. The other kicker is that she's probably halfway between getting ambulance service from both Atwood and Oberlin... so I suppose she'll have to give the address depending on which town they come from?! Yikes!
The last time i was out that way, it's been about 2 years now, my magellan worked fine and didn't seem to have any errors. But then i wasn't in Howard for very long.
Flintauqua
That map is dated 2007 and is the latest KDOT Elk County map and still does not have the roads labeled properly.
For instance, the old Busby road is labeled RS229. Nothing indicates it is Limestone Road. My favorite, Junebug Road is not shown.
As I seem to recall, the east-west roads were renamed by the committee and the KDOT map from Greenwood County south to Howard does not seem to list any of them.
There did appear to be some names on a couple roads just north of Longton.
Waldo,
As I said they are hard to read. Blow it up to 125% or higher and you will find that the roads are labeled across the top and down the left side, just as I had done on the Directory Map (I used a much larger font). They did label the few that veer off of the section lines, but not all of them, ie the road on the half mile line going south from Moline for one mile (past Bill and Deanna Cannon's). Yes the old FAS system of numbering is still on the map, they just added the 911 road names to the previous map.
Charles
I now see them.
My comments: That is ridiculous. The names are not even on the map they are off to the side in what would be Cowley or Butler County.
Maybe the 20?? version will actually have the roads labeled.
Charles,
What is the FAS numbering system?
Additionally, do you know if there was actually ever a Busby Road?
Or, did everyone call it that because the road went to Busby?
Federal Aid Secondary. Federal Aid Primary is the Interstate and U.S Highway System, along with most (but not all) state numbered routes. From Wiki:
"The Federal-aid secondary highway system (FAS system) consists of the principal secondary and feeder routes including farm-to-market roads, rural mail and public school bus routes, local rural roads, county and township roads, roads of the county, road class, and their urban extensions. These roads are chosen by the state highway departments and appropriate local road officials cooperatively, subject to approval by the Bureau of Public Roads."
With the last federal highway construction bill, they changed things a bit, but it doesn't really matter because its been a decade or more since the county got any state or federal funding to maintain the FAS system.
As far as roads having local names, they were never official. Busby Road, Wolf Trail, River Road, Garvin Road, Five Mile Road are all roads that I would know by name, but others wouldn't have a clue. For example, Five Mile Road. People in Moline would know this means go five miles west from Moline on US 160, turn south if you want to go to Hewins or Cedar Vale. I rather doubt that people in Grenola called this road "Five Mile". They probably called it Round Mound Road or Hewins Road, same with people living in CQ county. Today this is Road 8.
Growing up I was instructed on how to get to a specific field or pasture based on landmarks, some of which were nothing more than a crossroads where someone "used to live". For example if I were at Merle's Station in Moline and I was supposed to go to the "Criger Bottoms" I would:
Go north over Goss Hill turn west at the Cemetary and go past the Rhudy, the Feedlot, and Braces Pond; turn north at Star Schoolhouse then go west one mile from where Boyer used to live, turn north, go past Slick Vincen's; keep going north past Brown's corner and straight through Perkin's Curve, down the hill and then across to the Criger Pasture T; turn east go around the house in the hill, cross the River, and turn left into the first field entrance.
I know where I've been, can anyone tell me what roads I traveled?
Waldo, I get a book every year titled "Elk County Kansas Rural Directory", it has all of the Road names and numbers, land ownership is listed on the maps,it is laid out in Townships, it is a great reference for finding where people live. You can buy one at the Elk County Title /Abstract office at Howard.
All Right.....
Thank you. Will do.
The book is published by Central Publishing Company, Inc, P.O. Box 806, Iola, KS ( Zip Code wasn't shown), Phone is 620-365-2106. They have them for most if not every county in Kansas .
It has been a while since I visted the forum and I believe it was when I posted something about the National Geographic's new maps. One of the thing's I remember during my tour of the NatGeo HQ in Washington was the point they made about how they advocated corrections that the public pointed out to the national map agencies when errors needed correction. It is obvious that many local agencies are affected by errors in rural maps. I have a suggestion for anybody who might want to become an advocate for correct maps and addresses in the rural counties.
- Bring the subject to the attention of your state senator (Shmidt) & representative (King).
- Have them put pressure on the KU department of Geography that one of their mission be the accuracy of rural maps.
- Open up a correspondence with the National Geographic Society and ask for their help. Send them copies of all correspondence with your state legislators.
- Have your state legislators bring this to the attention of Congressman Tiahrt
- Form a group to continue to irritate all players on the subject. Note. A fine educational project for High School Jrs/Srs. They will learn how to use the modern political system.
Sorry to be so long winded - But I'm a Map Nut
(And a graduate of KU Geography Dept.) ;)Regards
-=Carl=-
:D W.Gray,
Junebug is our favorite also, as it is the road to our pasture (Vinette) and ends there. We know the county does not maintaine the road. It goes right pass Scott Hunters place. Scott and Marty own both sides of Junebug.
Jane
Yes, the Elk County Rural Directory is what I was talking about when I said "Platte Directory". That's what it was called back home... maybe because the company who printed it out there? As I said in another post a month ago or so... our rural directory was missing quite a few pages this time (they were printed blank). This directory is also useful to find out who lives where... and who owns which land.
I have been in Neva Walter's office (Elk County Register of Deeds) a few times and each time have taken a short time to review the huge wall sized map of Elk County on her north wall showing the various survey sections and who owns what therein.
Each time, I have silently wondered if she frequently keeps that map up to date and, if so, it must be an expensive effort. Maybe the same Iola printer does the updating for her.
Quote from: Diane Amberg on August 12, 2009, 06:24:53 PM
Leo, My Al is a map nut too! You two would be quick friends. He love satellite photographs, and geology and soils and how fast what percolates and all that stuff.
Diane, has he ever tried: http://mapper.acme.com/ (http://mapper.acme.com/) It's a single site that lets you switch between eight different views, and then also has links to eleven map servers, updated to the current view.
I love it, because I don't have to go to favorites and switch servers all the time.
Charles
Quote from: flintauqua on August 13, 2009, 03:13:30 PM
Quote from: Diane Amberg on August 12, 2009, 06:24:53 PM
Leo, My Al is a map nut too! You two would be quick friends. He love satellite photographs, and geology and soils and how fast what percolates and all that stuff.
Diane, has he ever tried: http://mapper.acme.com/ (http://mapper.acme.com/) It's a single site that lets you switch between eight different views, and then also has links to eleven map servers, updated to the current view.
I love it, because I don't have to go to favorites and switch servers all the time.
Charles
Just added that site to my notebook computer. That is going to come in very handy. Any of you that have been to San Francisco and tried to walk it using a street map can appreciate that the topographic map view could have helped me plan a better route. Thanks Charles I love that site.
David
David
Thanks,
I added the site to my bookmarks.
I noticed on the map that they still have the Santa Fe Howard Branch tracks as coming from Severy and ending at K-99 at about Michigan Street in Howard.
And, at Severy Junction they have the St Louis and San Francisco as stilll going through northeast Elk County and southern Greenwood.
On the Topo map, they have the Santa Fe Howard Branch going through Howard and on to Moline and junction with the "mainline" Santa Fe.
I also love google map street view. Much of my area is covered by it. Street view gives you a street level photographic view of an area. You can walk down a street, spin around for a 360 degree view. With it you can take a virtual tour of my little town of Belmont, CA or San Francisco. Want to see what Fisherman Wharf looks like you can take a street level photographic tour. Very fun toy.
David
I think "street view" is awesome! I'm delighted any time I see it as an option.
Quote from: W. Gray on August 13, 2009, 05:55:26 PM
Thanks,
I added the site to my bookmarks.
I noticed on the map that they still have the Santa Fe Howard Branch tracks as coming from Severy and ending at K-99 at about Michigan Street in Howard.
And, at Severy Junction they have the St Louis and San Francisco as stilll going through northeast Elk County and southern Greenwood.
On the Topo map, they have the Santa Fe Howard Branch going through Howard and on to Moline and junction with the "mainline" Santa Fe.
Waldo,
That is the one bad thing about online topos, you don't get the "legend or key" information, especially the date of the map. Remember these are just merges of whatever the latest published printed quad is for the spot, they're not updated online any faster than they would be in print. And the USGS doesn't publish new topos very often, unless it is an area of urban/suburban growth.
Charles
Quote from: Mom70x7 on August 13, 2009, 06:05:26 PM
I think "street view" is awesome! I'm delighted any time I see it as an option.
I love streetview also. In my continuing search for employment, my geographic range has increased. Streetview lets me get a "feel" for a place that has an opening in community development, so I can decide if that is a place I and my wife would want to live, what kind of problems the place may have, what level of "pride" in the community the residents have, etc. That way if I get called for an interview, I have a visual picture of what I might be able to help the community with.
Charles