A bit of Elk County nostalgia.
http://www.cinematour.com/tour/us/8006.html
http://www.cinematour.com/tour/us/33798.html
http://www.cinematour.com/tour/us/33746.html
Plaza Theatre
115 S Wabash Ave
Howard KS 66439
435 Seats.
Does anyone know the name of the lady that would have been in the box office? She was there when my mom was a kid and there when I was a kid. Time frame 40's to 70's. I think here name was Babe for some reason.
David
Babe Morris ---- after her husband passed away, she married Freddie Joe Rhoades.... Her name in the late 60's and 70's
Babe Rhoades
David, it was Babe Morris, she and her husband Byron had the Theater for many years, Byron passed away and Babe married Freddie Joe Rhoades. Later Babe sold the Theater to one of my Classmates, Robert Miller and I think Robert ran it until he finally shut it down. Babe and Byron had both the Howard and the Moline Theater.
Interesting that Grenola had a larger capacity theater than Moline.
Thanks everyone for the answers. The number of seats also threw me at 435. As I thought about the number of seats I began to think maybe Waldo had posted something from the days when EK had 10,000 people. Now that I have your attention can anyone tell me a time when that 435 seater was pretty well filled? I love the history I can find here. I know the stories may seem boring to you, but I would really love to hear them.
David
I saw the movie "Gun Belt" at the Plaza in 1953, the year that movie was released. It was a Saturday night. I recall this particular movie because my sister was with me and the costar was Tab Hunter. All the girls thought he was a heart throb. The admission was 12 cents.
Elk County population in 1950 was 6,679 and Howard 1249 (I think).
I seem to recall the theater being packed.
I also saw "Last of the Desperadoes" in 1955. I recall the star was Jim Davis, who was an impressive actor even though he did not seem to ever make it really big until he became Jock Ewing. It was again a Saturday night and I thought the theater was packed.
I probably saw a dozen movies at the Plaza in the early to mid 50s even though we moved away from Howard in 1946.
Just for the record, the highest Elk County population on record was 14,283 during the 1885 Kansas decennial census.
It would be interesting to know why the various families did leave when they did. I would guess for jobs? I would have suspected those who were tied to the land for their living were less likely to leave.
That's about right. That is why the movers and shakers in Elk County come from families that homesteaded Elk County or settled here generations ago.
I LOVE looking at the old movie "palaces"! I especially like researching Drive In's. Did Howard ever have one?
Lisa
The Drive In in Parsons didn't close until after I was out of high school (1981)!
Elk County did not have a drive in theater.
The Hiway 54 Drive In at Eureka was the closest.
Additionally, Fall River had an indoor theater. As did Burden.
Quote from: W. Gray on September 20, 2011, 12:47:17 AM
Just for the record, the highest Elk County population on record was 14,283 during the 1885 Kansas decennial census.
Waldo, I usually look at the US Decennial Census. I didn't think to look at the state census which is done mid-decade. The first US Census after the formation of EK shows the 1880 pop. as 10,623 and the 1890 pop. as 12,216 an increase of 15%. Interesting enough. Add in the Kansas State Decennial Census in the 1885 of 14,283 and that paints a different story. 3700 up first 5 years of the decade, 2000 down the second decade. (Not exact numbers on my part). Now that makes the decade even more interesting for those interested in history.
Since you are the resident historian, in my opinion, on all things Elk County. Off the top of your head do you know what explains this boom in the first 5 years and a big exoudous in the second 5 years? If not any suggestions on where to look online to read about the 1880 to 1890 decade of Elk County.
David
David
David, part of your answer can be found by pulling up the Oklahoma land runs. There were runs in 1891, 1892, 1893,1895, and 1901 and a lot of the settlers left their lands in Kansas and went on the run.
Quote from: frawin on September 21, 2011, 06:35:34 PM
David, part of your answer can be found by pulling up the Oklahoma land runs. There were runs in 1891, 1892, 1893,1895, and 1901 and a lot of the settlers left their lands in Kansas and went on the run.
Thanks Frank for the info. on 1890 to 1900. I did not realize that EK citizens played much of a part in the Oklahoma land runs. If I only knew a historian that knows about Oklahoma that also, knew about Elk County. Oh, by the way you are my favorite historian. ;)
David
Quote from: frawin on September 19, 2011, 07:16:06 PM
David, it was Babe Morriss, she and her husband Byron had the Theatre for many years, Byron passed away and Babe married Feddie Joe Rhodes. Later Babe sold the Theatre to one of my Classmates, Robert Miller and I think Robert ran it until he finally shut it down. Babe and Byron had both the Howard and the Moline Theatre.
A little more history on this, Byron died in 1949 and Babe's brother Dave, ran theatre for awhile. Then Babe got hooked up with Freddie Joe (his real name was Joseph Fred Rhodes) and they were a colorful couple. Surprising Babe is buried at Howard next to Freddie. Freddie used to talk me into running him out to the Highway to get a bottle, Babe really got after me for it. I finally told Freddie I wasn't going to do it again, but one night he talked me into and he promised me he wouldn't tell Babe, the next night I had a date to the movie and Babe eat me out bigtime, Freddie told her I took him to the Liquor store.
Quote from: sodbuster on September 21, 2011, 07:07:34 PM
Thanks Frank for the info. on 1890 to 1900. I did not realize that EK citizens played much of a part in the Oklahoma land runs. If I only knew a historian that knows about Oklahoma that also, knew about Elk County. Oh, by the way you are my favorite historian. ;)
David
David, you better keep Waldo as your favorite historian, he is my favorite historian and his Mother is my favorite Rosie.
I don't know the answer as to why so many people would have left between 1885 and 1890, but from that high water mark in the 1885 census there was a continuous drop at each state and federal census until the 2,882 of today. At that time, jobs would not have been a factor. Eighty-five percent of the people in Elk County knew nothing but farming for themselves.
I would think the only way to "bone up" on what caused the exodus in the late 1880s would be to read the local newspapers from the era. I have not been able to do that because my local library says they no longer can get newspaper reels from the Kansas State Historical Society.
I have read the newspapers from Howard County. Howard County started off with a US Census population of 2,794 in 1870. At the end of 1873, the county did a special census at the request of the state and came up with a tad under 13,000. Howard County was booming so much, the growth was mentioned in the governor's annual address to the state legislature. And, only 36 percent of the county land had been claimed.
A year and a half later on May 31, 1875, when Howard County split into Elk and Chautauqua that 13,000 figure had risen to only 13,632. The rapid decline in growth rate was caused by many, many settlers who found they could not make a living on the higher ground and they just up and left before the tax collector called. Back then he or she lost their farm in about five months at a sheriff's sale if the taxes were not paid when due.
Although the local newspapers do not come right out and say so, an additional factor causing the population rate to decline so much would have to have been the political events and the physical events surrounding the Boston War. Many people did not want to locate in an unstable county.
The Elk County loss may be for the same reason of not being able to make a living on the higher land.
"Although the local newspapers do not come right out and say so, an additional factor causing the population rate to decline so much would have to have been the political events and the physical events surrounding the Boston War. Many people did not want to locate in an unstable county."
Waldo, while it is easier to ask you, part of the fun is digging into the history myself and finding answers to questions that I didn't even know that I have. So I won't pester you like a two year old with questions. But I have one more. You mention the Boston War. I assume that is in Kansas and not Massachusetts, can you clarify? I think I have enough to keep me digging for a while with all that you and Frank have given me.
David
David, you might find it interesting that when your Mother was a little girl, Waldo's mother and family lived across the road from our family. Our family lived on the river just South of Howard. Waldo's Mother always tells me that I was ornery and she had to get after me, it wasn't me because I wasn't born yet, I think she is talking about Uncle Wes and Uncle Dwight. I never tell her it wasn't me, she always gives me a big hug and says I grew up to be a good boy.
Quote from: frawin on September 21, 2011, 07:52:15 PM
David, you might find it interesting that when your Mother was a little girl, Waldo's mother and family lived across the road from our family. Our family lived on the river just South of Howard. Waldo's Mother always tells me that I was ornery and she had to get after me, it wasn't me because I wasn't born yet, I think she is talking about Uncle Wes and Uncle Dwight. I never tell her it wasn't me, she always gives me a big hug and says I grew up to be a good boy.
My Mom always said you were ornery too. She said we got it from her side of the family, though said it skipped her. So if Waldo's Mom said it and my Mom said it; I guess that they knew what to expect before you were born. :angel:
David
Just by telling the story of the feeding of a certain Uncle (by marriage) a gainsburger sandwich, I think I can implicate 3 maybe 4 generations of ornery.
David
Boston was a boom town located four and one-half miles south of the future town of Moline. It was the eighteenth settlement in Howard County to obtain a post office.
The political events surrounding the Boston War for the county seat began in the spring of 1872 when Boston unsuccessfully tried to take the county seat by election from Peru.
Further political events escalated until January 1874 when a Boston paramilitary army raided Elk Falls, which had subsequently become the county seat. The army forcefully relocated the county seat to Boston.
Boston had legally won the county seat in late 1873 but an election technicality developed in an earlier 1873 election and Boston did not get to the Supreme Court in a timely manner.
Subsequent negotiating events by the governor and the state militia brought the county seat back to Elk Falls two months after the raid, but the status of Boston being the county seat remained in limbo until the Supreme Court ruled in January 1875 in favor of Elk Falls. The state legislature decided it had had enough and split Howard County into Elk and Chautauqua.
Boston disappeared fast because the new county line in June 1875 went right down Main Street, dividing the town into two parts. It disappeared in 1879 when its post office was transferred to the new town of Moline.
One other note.
The two fellows responsible for starting the Boston War were best friends and they both relocated to Sedan after Howard County was divided.
One of them took part in the 1893 Oklahoma Land Rush and the other went to Oklahoma after serving for several years as the Sedan postmaster. Both died in Ponca City.
When I zoom in on Howard on my weather radar map, certain communities pop up that I haven't heard of. Let's see, there's Keighley, Bloggett, Fiat, Busby, Buxton, Wingate, Glen Crouse, Hale, Grafton, Gibbs, Cloverdale, and Eaton. Are any of these towns still around?
Lisa
No, but one of our historians should be able to tell you where they used to be.
Keighley – Butler County
Bloggett - (Piedmont?) Greenwood County
Fiat – Elk County
Busby – Elk County
Buxton – Wilson County
Wingate – Butler County
Glen Crouse – Chautauqua County
Hale – Chautauqua County
Grafton – Chautauqua County
Gibbs - Chautauqua County
Cloverdale – Chautauqua County
Eaton(ville) – Cowley County
Piedmont, latitude 37.624
longitude -96.366
Bloggett, latitude 37.626
longitude -96.463
Busby is no longer a town, but it is a community -- still being referred to by it's name.
Quote from: W. Gray on September 22, 2011, 06:51:05 PM
Piedmont, latitude 37.624
longitude -96.366
Bloggett, latitude 37.626
longitude -96.463
about 5 miles west of piedmont.
Quote from: Jo McDonald on September 22, 2011, 07:27:01 PM
Busby is no longer a town, but it is a community -- still being referred to by it's name.
And people still talk about taking the Busby road or the Busby shortcut.
:)
For the record the correct spelling for Blodgett is Blodgett, not Bloggett.
While we're clearing the record, I believe Glen Crouse was in extreme NE Cowley County, not Chautauqua.
Quote from: frawin on September 22, 2011, 09:16:04 PM
For the record the correct spelling for Blodgett is Blodgett, not Bloggett.
Ooops...sorry, my bad!
Lisa
Lisa, all of these communities have been at one time a booming place. we lived in a house at Busby and from what the "Old-timers!" say and what we read from history.........it was once a major part of the area. Now, it is the school house and several farm/ranches and if you ever go see it, it is a beautiful spot in the road and the neighbors are busy raising cattle, cain and
heck and very nice and fun to deal with. It sits right at the corner where West Elk and Elk Valley school zones are. I had to drive our kids to the corner where the school house is to catch the school bus.
Yes, it is out in the "Boon-Docks" but I enjoyed my time out there. (Oh, at one time you did not take the Busby road east after a rain/storm...........just wasn't any bottom to it.......LOL We use to use it for a short cut (It is) to Fredonia and I sent my city-slicker family that way when they had been to visit us..........and I still catch heck from Dad for the nastiness of the road. It has improved, but I still remember it was like quicksand.
Quote from: farmgal67357 on September 23, 2011, 03:04:34 AM
Ooops...sorry, my bad!
Lisa
Lisa, no big mistake, you got closer to the spelling than lots of people. There are lots of small towns that have disappeared and more that are almost gone. My wife and I like to drive around and visit the towns that are hanging on. If you get a chance go to the Beaumont Hotel on a Sunday for Lunch. If you haven't been there it is a rewarding experience.
Glen Grouse was indeed in Cowley County and had a post office from late 1877 to early 1894.
Quote from: frawin on September 23, 2011, 06:12:29 AM
Lisa, no big mistake, you got closer to the spelling than lots of people. There are lots of small towns that have disappeared and more that are almost gone. My wife and I like to drive around and visit the towns that are hanging on. If you get a chance go to the Beaumont Hotel on a Sunday for Lunch. If you haven't been there it is a rewarding experience.
We've been past there, we were "touring" the windmills, but didn't stop. I didn't know they had a restaurant. We'll have to go back!
Lisa
I think that some of those names are really interesting. Like Fiat. I thought that was an Italian car!
Lisa
http://atsfrr.net/resources/Sandifer/Howard/Fiat/Fiat.htm
Lisa, the town of Fiat was is pronounced with a long "i" and a short "a".
My grandparents shipped all the farm equipment, animals, and household goods to Fiat when they moved to Elk county from Nebraska in 1921. Fiat was the closest railroad station to their new home just north of the Antioch church.
Bill Hawkins
Grandson of Cordial and Mae Stanley
The recent obits reminded me of the 1962 copy of the Courant-Citizen. The paper is dated July 12.
REHEARSAL DINNER
The home of Mr. and Mrs. Ray Perkins was the scene of a three course dinner, given in honor of Sharon Kay Miller and Robert Curtis Sloan and their wedding party, preceding ther wedding rehearsal on Friday evening, July 6.
Mrs. Allen Forsyth and Mrs. Noel Mullendore assisted Mrs. Perkins in serving the dinner.
The table, covered with a white cloth, was centered with a crystal bowl of pink roses and perennial phlox, entwined with greenery. This arrangement was flanked by crystal candelabra.
Those attending were Miss Sharon Kay Miller, her mother, Mrs. Everett Miller; Robert Curtis Sloan, his parents, Mr. and Mrs. R.B. Sloan; the Rev. and Mrs. Dean Brown, Eddie B. Henry, Pat Criger, and Miss Suzanne Crisp, all of Howard; Miss Ann Adkins of Centerville, Indiana; Miss Linda Grimes of Tulsa, Oklahoma, and Bill Stevens of Erie.
----------------------------------------------------
BIRTHDAY CELEBRATION
Mrs. Carl Criger and children, Pat and Carla Mae, entertained at their cabin home, west of Howard. on the evening of July 4, honoring the birth anniversary of their husband and father, Carl Criger.
The following guests enjoyed a delicious supper and the fireworks which followed; Mr. and Mrs. Johm C. Garison, Jr., and son, John Carl, Mrs. John C Garison, Sr., Mr. and Mrs. Ned Smith, Mrs. W.O. Russell, Mr. and Mrs. Albert Criger, Mrs. Cora Barackman, Mr. and Mrs. Bud McClure, Mike, Charles and Guy, Mr. and Mrs. Charles McClure, Mr. and Mrs. Jim Criger, Colette, Roxann and David, Mr. and Mrs. Wayne Young of Winfield, Edw. E. Gregor, Mr. and Mrs. Dale Harrod, Hal and Susan.
___________________________________________________
The Sloan-Miller wedding is covered in the next column.
__________________________________________________
Larryj
I wonder if that cabin home west of Howard is still there?
The Red Barn on 400 highway 6 miles west of Beaumont is known as the Keighley Barn. Wingate is about half way between Latham and Atlanta as the crow flies.
The flying crows and the Kansas City and Southern Railroad must have taken the same route as Wingate was a stop along that railroad. The line later became part of the "Frisco Line". On satellite photos the old RR route shows fairly well running almost on a straight diagonal between Atlanta and Latham.
That would be correct. Taking the train or flying with the crows was much more direct than driving from Latham to Atlanta via Clay Center Corner. ;)
(I began typing this once before, but it disappeared into the blue)
From the same 1962 Howard Courant-Citizen.......
A column entitled "From the Citizen Fifteen years ago"
July 10, 1947................
Mr. and Mrs. Will O. Gibbon left Sunday morning for Alexandria, Virginia, where they will visit with their daughter and husband, Mr. and Mrs. Keith Coffin.
Miss Ruth Smith of Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, arrived in Howard last Saturday to spend her vacation visiting with her mother, Mrs. George Smith, and other relatives and friends at the old home.
Martin Haigler, formerly of Howard, now of Hutchinson, has recently won a fine promotion. He is now district supervisor of the Southwest Division for General Baking Company. Martin started working for Bond three years ago as foreman in the plant at Hutchinson.
Mr. and Mrs. Paul Wisner and son, Jimmy, and Mr. and Mrs. Harry Lees of Lawrence visited in Howard over the Fourth of July weekend with their parents, Mr. and Mrs. L.B. Wisner, and other friends and relatives.
Mr. and Mrs. Carl L. Zeller of Wichita drove to Howard last Thursday morning and accompanied by Mr. and Mrs. Floyd C. Flory and grandson, Bill Threlfall, went to Grand Lake in Oklahoma, where they vacationed until Sunday evening. The made their headquarters at Bernice and visited many of the points of interest around the lake, fished, and had a fine rest.
Mrs. J.B. Hunter went to Grenola last Sunday to visit with her daughter, Mrs. Ralph Logsdon, and family, and to get acquainted with her new granddaughter, who had just arrived home with her mother from the hospital at Winfield.
Jim Hunter has been visiting in Chicago, Illinois, the past two weeks with his sister and husband, Dr. and Mrs. Paul Meredith, and taking in the sights of the big city, and looking over the college situation for next year.
The First Methodist Church in Wichita was the scene of a pretty wedding Sunday afternoon, July 6, at 2:30 o'clock, when Miss Irene Thompson of Howard became the bride of Wayne E. Keast, son of Mr. and Mrs. Fred Keast of Larned.
Elma Roberta Platz was born July 18, 1885, near Millersburg, Ohio, and departed this life at St. Francis hospital in Wichita, Kansas, July 5, 1947, at the age of 61 years, 11 months and 17 days. Elma came to Howard with her parents, Mr. and Mrs. Walter Platz, one brother and two sisters, January 1, 1889. Funeral services were held at the Moon Chapel in Howard at 10:00 a. m., Monday, July 7.
Mrs. A. M. Sloan of Howard, in Union Center township, passed away last Thursday morning, July 3, and funeral services were held on Saturday, July 5. Edith Bascom Sloan was born on the old Bascom farm in Elk County, Kansas, September 21, 1878. She was married to Alfred M. Sloan, November 25, 1902. To this union were born four children, Olive and Elizabeth Sloan, Mrs. Roberta Carter and Robert Sloan.
Miss Mary Olive Minerd, daughter of Mr. and Mrs. Sam Minerd of McCune, became the bride of Ira Highsmith, son of Oscar Highsmith of northeast of Howard, at 5:30 o'clock, Thursday afternoon in the First Baptist Church at Pittsburg.
Cora Blanche Leo, daughter of Charlie and Rachel Spease, was born in Elk County, Kansas, ten miles west of Howard, on November 6, 1880, and departed this life July 7, 1947, at her home in Howard. She was married to William Leo on November 11, 1903. To this union four children were born, all of whom are still living.
James R. Anderson and Mrs. Belle Smith of Howard were united in marriage at Wichita on Monday, June 30, and are now at their home in the east part of Howard.
Waldo Gray, recently discharged from the Navy, who has been working part time in the Gray barber shop under the post office, while looking after repairs and improvements on his residence property, will now be found regularly at his chair.
_____________________________________________________
Next one will be from thirty years ago, July 13, 1932.
Larryj
Quote from: larryJ on October 30, 2011, 09:10:02 AM
(I began typing this once before, but it disappeared into the blue)
From the same 1962 Howard Courant-Citizen.......
A column entitled "From the Citizen Fifteen years ago"
July 10, 1947................
Mr. and Mrs. Paul Wisner and son, Jimmy, and Mr. and Mrs. Harry Lees of Lawrence visited in Howard over the Fourth of July weekend with their parents, Mr. and Mrs. L.B. Wisner, and other friends and relatives.
Larryj
Mr. and Mrs. L.B. Wisner are my grandparents - Leslie and Bertie Wisner. My grandmother was delighted every time her name appeared in the paper.
Mr. and Mrs. Harry Lees are my parents - Harry and Mary Arlene.
Thanks, Larry!
Quote from LarryJ, above.
"Waldo Gray, recently discharged from the Navy, who has been working part time in the Gray barber shop under the post office, while looking after repairs and improvements on his residence property, will now be found regularly at his chair."
Eventually, he bought his father, Asmar (Slim) Gray, out and when the post office was torn down he moved up to where the newest part of the Family Market is now. He stayed at that chair for 53 years even after acquiring cancer. He persevered until he could no longer go to the barber shop. He died about one week after leaving the barber shop for the last time.
WOW!!!!!!!! That is one heck of a lot of haircuts!
Larryj
The "Thirty years ago" column is relatively short.
From the Citizen, Thirty Years Ago
July 13, 1932
Walter Lee Crumrine, son of Mr. and Mrs. Daniel Crumrine, was born on a farm near Iola, Kansas, September 16, 1876, and died at his home in Howard, Kansas, July 7, 1932, age 55 years, 9 months and 21 days. He grew to manhood in the Longton community and united in marriage with Lillie Zinn in 1896.
The year's top for cattle was reached at Kansas City yesterday, $9.25. Top hogs, $4.25.
Junior Signer, aged four years, son of Mr. and Mrs. Frank Signer, west of Howard, fell Sunday evening while playing and broke both bones in his right arm.
The Cedar Vale National Bank was robbed yesterday afternoon, the thieves securing $1,500 cash. The robbery occurred at the noon hour.
______________________________________________________
From the Citizen, Forty Five Years ago................
July 11, 1917..
Carl Russell will teach in the grade schools at Grenola this winter.
Keenan Hurst left last week for his old home in Illinois to visit a brother who is ill.
A son was born to Mr. and Mrs. Bob Lord, northeast of Howard, Saturday, July 7, 1917.
Ex-President William Howard Taft is to speak at the Chautauqua at Fredonia this week.
One Elk County boy is listed among the men of the Fredonia hospital corps. He is Jerry Liggett, who lives southeast of Howard.
J. H. McMillan, the new engineer at the municipal electric lighting plant, arrived Wednesday evening and has charge of the plant.
Mrs. Stewart McLean died at her home at Buffalo, Monday. The funeral is today and her sons, John, Will, George, Charlie and Frank, all of Howard went over to attend the service.
Mrs. Alma Munsinger Crutcher and little son, Luke, Jr.,of California are here on account of the illness of Mrs. Crutcher's mother, Mrs. J. K. Munsinger.
Mr. and Mrs. Meade Redmond of Tulsa, Oklahoma, are in Howard visiting with Mrs. Redmond's relatives and friends. Mrs. Redmond was formerly Miss Goldie Roberts.
Thos. Matthew of Springfield, Illinois, arrived in Howard this week with his family and household goods and will make Howard his home. Mr. Matthew owns a couple of good farms southwest of Howard. The family consists of Mr. Matthew and wife, a son and a daughter.
Cecil Allen and little sister, Pauline, came down Tuesday night from Emporia to spend the Fourth with their brother, Earl Allen, of the Allen Drug Store.
Will O. Gibbon, who has been superintendent of the Halstead schools for four years past, has bought an interest in the Farmer's State Bank at Stockdale, Riley County, ten miles north of Manhattan, and becomes cashier of the bank.
Thomas Jefferson Rothgeb was born September 28, 1836, in Iroquois County, Illinois, and died July 5, 1917, at the home of his son, Ira Rothgeb, near Longton.
____________________________________________________
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Quote from: W. Gray on October 25, 2011, 07:10:36 PM
I wonder if that cabin home west of Howard is still there?
No, Waldo, it is not still there.
Thanks, Sheriff Janet.