Author Topic: Help identifying a remington revolver  (Read 1998 times)

Offline Mad Miles

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Help identifying a remington revolver
« on: February 16, 2022, 10:50:51 AM »
Good morning,
Yesterday I took possession of a few old firearms.  These have been in a wooden box up in a room above a shop for years.  Not in the greatest of shape but I'd like to get to know more about them and how to inspect/repair in order to shoot.  Along with the Mauser C-96, colt model 1872, Savage model 1899,  1918 Lee Enfield, Ranger 12 gauge, and a AMD percussion cap long gun of some sort, I found a Remington revolver.

I looked all over the internet, I'm not good at that sort of activity, and have determined it's what some call a model 1858, which is supposed to be a percussion gun.  This doesn't look like a percussion revolver but I read some were converted from percussion to cartridge.  This revolver seems to have a two piece chamber (cylinder ?), perhaps the back half was cut off and a non percussion part was attached?  I assume the cylinder with the six bores in it is called the chamber?

It has 'PATENTED SEPT 14. 1858' on the top of the barrel with 'E. REMINGTON & SONS ILION  NEWYORK U.S.A.'  underneath. There is a 'C' stamped on the right side of the barrel just ahead of the mainframe, an 'A' stamped on the left side of the barrel just ahead of the main frame, there are two 'J's stamped on the chamber near the rear 180 degrees apart from one another.  There is an 'S' stamped in the frame above the hammer pivot screw head on the left side, and an 'M' stamped on the left side of the frame just behind the brass trigger guard.

The serial number 33250 is stamped on the bottom of the barrel.

The gun has a tag attached to the trigger guard, it is an RCMP laboratories tag dated Nov. 5 1985.  It has a case number and an inspectors signature on it.  I don't know the history of the gun and whether it was involved in a criminal case or perhaps just some kind of gun registry. The owner has been dead for over 20 years, I got the firearms from his nephew. 

The back of the tag has the serial number-33250, the make-Remington, the Model-New Model Army, type-HG, action-R, caliber-.44, shots-6, barrel-200MM, rifling--------------.

So that's about all the info I have about this revolver and wonder how/where to look for info about the date of manufacture, what kind of ammo is it meant to shoot, where to find a schematic of parts and how to disassemble and inspect it.  And anything else about it that anyone can tell me.  Like what's the difference in a New Model Army and an Army Model, who used them, any significance about this particular model, etc.

Thank you in advance.
Al

Oh yea, this gun is dinged up and filthy, I have to get it apart and cleaned up, but in the meantime would I be hurting it if I took the grips off and just soaked the whole gun in solvent for a few days to eat some of the crud off?.


Offline DeaconKC

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Re: Help identifying a remington revolver
« Reply #1 on: February 16, 2022, 12:30:02 PM »
Okay, congratulations on a great find! There are a couple of us here familiar with the C96, so go ahead and ask questions. As to the Remington, yes there were conversions made. As far as soaking it, yes, remove the grips and then put it in some odorless Mineral Spirits overnight. This will soften up any old grease and fouling. Wipe it down and then take an old toothbrush to it to get off any gunk left there. Clean and oil normally.

And we love pics here!
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Offline Mad Miles

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Re: Help identifying a remington revolver
« Reply #2 on: February 16, 2022, 01:21:31 PM »
Thanks for the reply.
I looked up the Mauser and found a lot of info on it.  It's a Red 9.  It has the slot in the grip for attaching the buttstock, but alas, I couldn't find the buttstock or anything else that would have been with it.  I'll go back to the barn and look around for it.  The shop is full of old Hudsons, one banger industrial engines, riding and pack saddles, more wooden spoke wheels than I've ever seen and nothing new.  There were about 20 firearms and I was given seven, plus a couple disabled and beyond recovery ones, so I feel very fortunate, I think the Mauser was the newest item in the place, and it's in the best shape of any of the guns I got. It's a 9mm and after I learn how to strip it down and clean it I'll take it to the range.

Any idea on how to tell when this Remington was made?

Any idea how I can find out what cartridge and caliber it would use?  the RCMP tag said 44 caliber but I don't know if that would be before or after the conversion, it looks like the cylinder is just as old as the rest of the gun so I don't think it was bought in the last few decades. I found a box of old CIL made dominion cartridge 455 Colt cases in the box but I presume those would be for the Colt.
I also found a bullet mold and some lead bullets that I measured to 0.4295" which Wikipedia says fit the 44 S&W special, Remington 44 magnum and 44 S&W Russian, but there were a dozen other guns hanging around there of various calibers.

Any Idea where to look for disassembly instructions?  I'd hate to break something taking it apart.

I also got a cartridge belt with a holster but it's a left hand and I'm right handed, I'll go back and see it the right one is there.

Thanks again,
Al

Offline Major 2

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Re: Help identifying a remington revolver
« Reply #3 on: February 16, 2022, 01:44:40 PM »
This is stuff of imagination, finding a stash of old firearms, car(s) or a motorcycle.
The thought makes me giddy.
Congratulations, maybe buying a Lotto is in order  :)

Please post photos
when planets align...do the deal !

Offline Coffinmaker

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Re: Help identifying a remington revolver
« Reply #4 on: February 16, 2022, 01:59:51 PM »

For me, it would be of articular interest to see some photos of the Colt 1872.  If an Original Open Top, it will be chambered for .44 Henry Flat or .44 Stetson.  It will NOT be a .45

The Remington is interesting.  Period Remington were converted to other than a .45.  If later or a reproduction, the Remington will be .45 although the .455 cartridges pique my curiosity.  Don't think they will run in any of the old guns you have snagged.

Play Safe Out There

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Re: Help identifying a remington revolver
« Reply #5 on: Today at 06:04:40 AM »

Offline Mad Miles

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Re: Help identifying a remington revolver
« Reply #5 on: February 16, 2022, 02:54:52 PM »
Well I keep trying but can't get pictures to load onto the post.

Offline Major 2

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Re: Help identifying a remington revolver
« Reply #6 on: February 16, 2022, 03:13:26 PM »
Perhaps you have to reduce them in size
when planets align...do the deal !

Offline Mad Miles

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Re: Help identifying a remington revolver
« Reply #7 on: February 16, 2022, 03:20:17 PM »
Pictures

Offline Mad Miles

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Re: Help identifying a remington revolver
« Reply #8 on: February 16, 2022, 03:23:27 PM »
And

Offline Mad Miles

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Re: Help identifying a remington revolver
« Reply #9 on: February 16, 2022, 03:37:05 PM »
Man, I hate computers.  this is a pain.

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Re: Help identifying a remington revolver
« Reply #10 on: Today at 06:04:40 AM »

Offline Abilene

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Re: Help identifying a remington revolver
« Reply #10 on: February 16, 2022, 03:40:01 PM »
Your "Colt 1872" is an 1873 Single Action Army pre-war (mid-1890's or later.  The 1872 was just a patent date on the frame) and may be worth more than all the others combined.  What caliber?  The s/n will tell the year it was made.

Offline Mad Miles

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Re: Help identifying a remington revolver
« Reply #11 on: February 16, 2022, 04:22:45 PM »
OK I'll put up some Colt pics.  I hope it doesn't offend anyone posting Colt pics in a Reminton section.

Offline Mad Miles

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Re: Help identifying a remington revolver
« Reply #12 on: February 16, 2022, 04:30:06 PM »
And, 
The front screw that attaches the trigger guard is missing and the piece that keeps the cylinder from turning backwards is missing.  I believe the part that holds the cylinder is attached to the trigger guard with a piece of string.  I'll have to take it apart to see what's going on in there.  Maybe a broken spring or a missing fastener or...

Offline River City John

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Re: Help identifying a remington revolver
« Reply #13 on: February 16, 2022, 04:36:21 PM »
OK I'll put up some Colt pics.  I hope it doesn't offend anyone posting Colt pics in a Reminton section.

We're not offended. We're jealous. A very nice cache' of firearms indeed.
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Offline Major 2

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Re: Help identifying a remington revolver
« Reply #14 on: February 16, 2022, 04:49:30 PM »
offended ?  No      I'm envious !

Ditto To what RCJ said ...Jealous, .....& envious of your barn find :) 
when planets align...do the deal !

Offline Mad Miles

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Re: Help identifying a remington revolver
« Reply #15 on: February 16, 2022, 05:02:58 PM »
I'm having a hard time believing it happened.  A few of us were around a fire burning limbs from trees felled to make a turn around at the end of a ridge road.  I was telling of an old broken side by side shotgun that I was trying to fix for a buddy.  It had a guys name and 'The Mount' engraved in between the barrels. I discovered after a few hours, no days, on the computer The Mount is an old estate in England, and also discovered the owner of the gun was in the British Army and died during WWI. I even found the graveyard he's in.   My buddy and I decided we would fix the shotgun and try to track down surviving family members and see if they wanted us to ship it back to them in England.  One of the guys listening to my tale said he had a bunch of old guns that have been lying around his shop for 20 years and he wasn't going to ever use them and they were mine if I wanted.  Still pinching myself hoping I don't wake up.  I always hear of others finding a mint GOT or a Flathead Ford in a warehouse or barn.  I waited 72 years and now it's my turn.

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Re: Help identifying a remington revolver
« Reply #16 on: February 16, 2022, 05:54:25 PM »
Okay, you want to get the Wolff spring pack for that Mauser Broomhandle. Stay away from +P ammo with it. The Winchester White Box 115 grain FMJ is loaded very close to original factory specs from WW1, when your pistol was built. Actually Wolff will have springs for all the guns you have there. And I desperately want some info on what looks like a S&W in your pics.
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Offline Mad Miles

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Re: Help identifying a remington revolver
« Reply #17 on: February 16, 2022, 06:31:22 PM »
Which one is the S&W looking one?
I'm not a handgun guy, as you most likely deduced.  I shot a 1911 at  CFB Wainwright in the late eighties.  I was more into the FAL FN 7.62MM C1 A1 and  the 30 and 45 cal machine guns. I didn't take up handguns until about 10 years ago and all has been 45 auto.  But I'm a handgun guy now.  The majority of my shooting the last while has been 6.5 CM precision target and 45-70 anything I can hit.

OK I'll  google Wolff spring pack to know what your talking about as well as +P ammo.

Thanks for the replies.

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Re: Help identifying a remington revolver
« Reply #18 on: February 16, 2022, 08:22:45 PM »
The smaller hammerless nickel gun that is roughly in the center of your group photos. Like this one?
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Re: Help identifying a remington revolver
« Reply #19 on: February 16, 2022, 11:18:37 PM »
According to Colt, that SAA is from 1897.  The bolt (or cylinder stop) that is tied to the trigger guard is missing from the frame.  If the cylinder will rotate backward when the gun is pointed up but not when the gun is pointed down, then the hand (or pawl) spring is broken.  The left side of the gun shows the head of the trigger screw in place but it should protrude into the hole on the right side, which looks empty.  Probably a wrong screw. 

Uberti gripframe screws from the last number of years fit the Colt, so you could get the front triggerguard screw from them.  But considering the gun, it deserves a Colt screw, plus needs that trigger screw.  It looks fairly complete.  You really should spend the several hundred for a Colt letter.  I'm not an expert but it could be worth $2500 easily IMO. 

Oh, BTW, the Remington conversion is very cool, too!   :)

 

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