Author Topic: Miroku 1873 carbine owners, any upgrades?  (Read 2206 times)

Offline Flatlander55

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Miroku 1873 carbine owners, any upgrades?
« on: January 06, 2019, 09:21:21 pm »
Good evening,

As the title states, do any of the owners of the new Miroku Winchester 1873 saddle ring carbine owners have any upgrades done to their rifles? How do you like them? I bought one a few months ago and shot it today for the first time. It's in 38/357 and it cycled literally everything like butter with no hesitation no matter the OAL. I just couldn't get over how heavy the lever safety leaf spring was.

I saw that there is a replacement coil made for the Uberti 73's. No mention if it works with the Miroku models or not, but I ordered one anyhow and will report when it arrives. I know there is a short stroke kit, but I'm not terribly excited about that. I don't shoot for speed, I just enjoy shooting at my own turtle pace.

Are there other upgrades/aftermarket parts I am missing?

Also, can somebody help me out here? I love absolutely everything about this rifle but two things. One I can live with, one I can't. The stock is just blah and too darned light. It doesn't look right. That said, I can get over it. What drives me crazy is the front barrel band. Rather than a screw, they just use a straight pin through the stock. You have to use a punch and no matter how lightly you try you WILL deform the pin somewhat when removing it to get the forearm off. If you are spending $1100+ on a rifle and everything else is right, you would think they would use a darn screw instead of a pin.

I took the barrel band screw out of my 1947 Model 94 and it is both too short and too small so replacing the factory unit won't be easy. Such is life. I'm going to have to buy a new barrel band from Winchester(scratched the original a bit), find a larger and longer barrel band screw, determine the thread pitch of that then buy a tap and thread one side of the band to make the rifle how it should have been to begin with. If anybody has a Marlin 336 or similar rifle along with the Miroku 73 carbine, would you mind seeing if that barrel band screw is larger and longer than the factory pin?

Thanks to all in advance.


Offline Cliff Fendley

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Re: Miroku 1873 carbine owners, any upgrades?
« Reply #1 on: January 07, 2019, 06:58:32 am »
Uberti has actually gone to the coil spring for the lever safety on newer rifles. It's not as light as the aftermarket but makes them much more user friendly than the flat spring. I don't have any idea if it can be modified or will work in the Miroku though.
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Offline Blackpowder Burn

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Re: Miroku 1873 carbine owners, any upgrades?
« Reply #2 on: January 07, 2019, 09:05:15 am »
I'm glad you're happy with the performance of your carbine.  From what I've read and from a couple I've handled, it seems Winchester/Miroku has done all of the work I'd consider doing on a Uberti.  The action is already pretty slick, slight short stroke, drilled and tapped the tang for a peep sight.  Just shoot and enjoy.

I've just ordered a 24" sporter in 44WCF and am waiting for it to arrive.  Can't wait to belch smoke and fire with it this weekend (hopefully) at our club match.  ;D
« Last Edit: January 07, 2019, 09:07:03 am by Blackpowder Burn »
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Offline Flatlander55

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Re: Miroku 1873 carbine owners, any upgrades?
« Reply #3 on: January 07, 2019, 05:15:46 pm »
Yeah, I truly do love the rifle. I've gone through a dozen or so rifles and never have been fully happy, it was ten year long mid-life-rifle-crisis. I'd get a new rifle, shoot it and then I would get bored so I would sell and look for the next interesting thing but never be fully satisfied with any gun until now. It is slicker than snot and does seem to have a pretty short throw. I was surprised that it fed everything from the shortest .38 to the longest 357 without issues. Pleasantly surprised, but surprised none the less.

The lever safety spring should be here within the next few days. I can't see why it wouldn't work, the design is the same for both rifles with minimal differences. I might have to tweak it here or there but it is always worth a shot. Worst case scenario, I am out $10.00. Not terrible.

I'll figure out this barrel band thing somehow. Standard taps are pretty short, I *might* have tap from the outside in and just have a reverse thread but even so a screw would be a huge improvement over that darn pin.

One thing I did notice if anybody is interested or considering a Miroku 1873 carbine, is the rear ladder sight. I don't know how to word this but I will try to do by best. The sliding sight notch bar has on the right side a very small, nearly invisible, flat spring it seems protruding out of the top and bottom of the bar holding it in place tight. This spring was NOT present on the preproduction 1873 carbine ladder sight I bought from homestead parts to go on a Rossi 92 I had. That was a very nice sight, but the sight notch had nothing to hold it in place and it would move after every shot fired with the ladder up. With this system it stays put when you fire repeatedly no matter how stout the loads were. I am NOT knocking any company or website here, only making an observation. Just food for thought. If anybody wants I can try and get pictures later.

Offline chuckerbird

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Re: Miroku 1873 carbine owners, any upgrades?
« Reply #4 on: January 08, 2019, 07:49:03 am »
Pictures would be nice.

Offline Flatlander55

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Re: Miroku 1873 carbine owners, any upgrades?
« Reply #5 on: January 08, 2019, 09:45:59 am »
Here is what I am talking about. I didn't even notice until I begun to shoot at longer ranges to be honest. It held very firmly and didn't budge one tiny bit no matter how fast I worked the action or heavy the load. That was a pleasant surprise. Maybe they are all like this both on the originals and all reproductions and the one I ordered a few years back was a fluke and had that missing but either way I figure it couldn't hurt posting about it.
« Last Edit: January 08, 2019, 10:14:47 am by Flatlander55 »

Offline Abilene

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Re: Miroku 1873 carbine owners, any upgrades?
« Reply #6 on: January 08, 2019, 10:20:29 am »
The ladder sights like that that I have seen had a small indent inside the side of the slider with a spring and ball inside to hold position.

Offline Boone May

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Re: Miroku 1873 carbine owners, any upgrades?
« Reply #7 on: January 11, 2019, 10:12:39 am »
I recently bought one of the 1873 carbines in .44 WCF and I like it very much.  I have a couple of observations of things that could have been done differently.

First, the lever and hammer should be case hardened.  That was standard for all 1873's.  Not sure why Miroku blued them. 

Second, the gap between the barrel and magazine is not correct.  The original rifles and carbines didn't have this gap.  You could not see light through there.  I know these Miroku's are closer to Uberti's than original 1873's. 

As others have stated, there are other differences from the original 1873's.  I have owned several original carbines and still have some sporting rifles in the collection.

Overall, a nice carbine and I am proud to add it to my collection.  I like to get it out when I am watching old TV westerns.   ;D
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Offline Blackpowder Burn

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Re: Miroku 1873 carbine owners, any upgrades?
« Reply #8 on: January 11, 2019, 04:42:21 pm »
Boone, I have a new Winchester '73 24" rifle, as well as an original '73 carbine.  Both have a small gap (about the same width) between the barrel and magazine.  Perhaps the presence or absence of that gap varied among the 3 models of the original '73's?  The one I have is a 3rd model, so I'm assuming the new ones would be closest to them?

My new rifle has a case hardened (actually case colored) receiver, butt plate, fore end cap and lever, but a blued hammer.

Lots of details to compare.............but my main concern is how well it will make smoke and hit the targets tomorrow!  ;D
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Offline Flatlander55

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Re: Miroku 1873 carbine owners, any upgrades?
« Reply #9 on: January 11, 2019, 07:21:36 pm »
So the lightened safety lever spring arrived today. It most certainly will NOT work with the Miroku Winchester 73's. I took the best picture I could showing the spring it is supposed to replace. I thought the Winchester came with a flat spring but no that is not the case and things became a lot more complicated and a simple drop in replacement became out of the question. Oh well, it was only $13.00 so no big loss. I was able to slightly bend one of the spring legs which lightened the force necessary to close the lever significantly so all is well. Live and learn.

Offline Abilene

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Re: Miroku 1873 carbine owners, any upgrades?
« Reply #10 on: January 11, 2019, 07:32:09 pm »
So, one end of that wire is the safety spring and the other is the trigger spring?  It does look easy to adjust.

Offline Flatlander55

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Re: Miroku 1873 carbine owners, any upgrades?
« Reply #11 on: January 11, 2019, 09:43:20 pm »
It is somewhat easy to adjust with needle nose pliers, but I had to mess with it for quite some time because when I tightened the mainspring back down it added more pressure to the lever safety spring so you need to take that into consideration. It's always a learning process. If you decide to take it totally out with the intention to adjust and reinstall, be prepared to have a long string of colorful language and eventually settling on adjusting with the spring once it is back in place as it will have to be readjusted anyhow due to the slight bends required to reinstall. It really isn't tough by any means, just different. Truthfully, now that I have done it I actually like the setup as it seems to be a very robust system. The spring is very strong and will not fail in my lifetime.

Offline wildman1

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Re: Miroku 1873 carbine owners, any upgrades?
« Reply #12 on: January 12, 2019, 07:00:43 am »
Larsen Pettifogger did a post on how to rework a Win/Miroku 73 I'm sure if you search here you will find it. Covers springs action and is pretty easy to do.
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Offline Coffinmaker

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Re: Miroku 1873 carbine owners, any upgrades?
« Reply #13 on: January 12, 2019, 05:01:11 pm »

Flatlander,

There are few if any "upgrades" available for the Miroku '73.  There are just a couple of Gunplumbers that will try modifying them.  You're mostly limited to a little judicious spring work. 

There was one provider of parts whom brought out a Short Stroke kit for Miroku.  There was so much trouble with it, he dropped it and no longer supports the Miroku.  Should you elect to attempt to "up grade" a Miroku, I suggest you first plan on purchasing a fair stock of replacement parts 'cause your gonna need em.

Offline Coal Creek Griff

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Re: Miroku 1873 carbine owners, any upgrades?
« Reply #14 on: January 12, 2019, 05:08:49 pm »
I suggest you first plan on purchasing a fair stock of replacement parts 'cause your gonna need em.

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Offline Blackpowder Burn

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Re: Miroku 1873 carbine owners, any upgrades?
« Reply #15 on: January 19, 2019, 06:38:48 pm »
Well, I got my Winchester/Miroku '73 rifle and shot it in matches the last two weekends.  And the verdict is.......I'm thrilled with it!  ;D

I'll be the first to say I'm no speed shooter.  I live to make lots of smoke and boom and kibbutz with my friends at matches.  That said, I do have the actions of my rifles slicked up and springs lightened - though not short stroked.  The Winchester was perfect for my needs right out of the box.  The lever stroke is a little shorter than my original '73's, the action is smooth and trigger pull decent after adjusting the tension screw (it was cranked all the way in from the factory).  It was already drilled and tapped for tang sights, so was easy to mount one of my spare Marbles on it.  Not to mention pretty wood with a nice satin finish.

Winchester has done a really nice job on these rifles from my perspective............
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Offline Major 2

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Re: Miroku 1873 carbine owners, any upgrades?
« Reply #16 on: January 21, 2019, 04:55:19 am »


Winchester has done a really nice job on these rifles from my perspective............

Just to clarify that statement... I'd agree to...

Olin Corporation has done a really nice job, licensing  Miroku - factory in Kochi, Japan. 
Imported by BACO, Inc. of Morgan, Utah a company used for importing Winchester firearms from worldwide factories.

when planets align...do the deal !

Offline Cliff Fendley

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Re: Miroku 1873 carbine owners, any upgrades?
« Reply #17 on: January 21, 2019, 08:00:42 am »
Well, I got my Winchester/Miroku '73 rifle and shot it in matches the last two weekends.  And the verdict is.......I'm thrilled with it!  ;D

I'll be the first to say I'm no speed shooter.  I live to make lots of smoke and boom and kibbutz with my friends at matches.  That said, I do have the actions of my rifles slicked up and springs lightened - though not short stroked.  The Winchester was perfect for my needs right out of the box.  The lever stroke is a little shorter than my original '73's, the action is smooth and trigger pull decent after adjusting the tension screw (it was cranked all the way in from the factory).  It was already drilled and tapped for tang sights, so was easy to mount one of my spare Marbles on it.  Not to mention pretty wood with a nice satin finish.

Winchester has done a really nice job on these rifles from my perspective............

Nice to hear it is drilled for the tang sights like an original 73. I wish Uberti would do that.
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Offline Boone May

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Re: Miroku 1873 carbine owners, any upgrades?
« Reply #18 on: June 16, 2019, 06:10:59 pm »
Here are some comparison photos of a Miruko 1873 with pistol grip and original 1873 rifle with octagon barrel.  Both are .44 WCF (.44-40)  The Miroku barrel is not longer, I didn't get it seated in the stand at the same spot.  Note the difference in the size of the octagon barrel and the gap between the barrel and magazine tube on he Miroku.  The original actually has a tiny gap and if you hold it up to a window, you can see light through it.  I don't think you could get a sheet of paper through it.
« Last Edit: June 16, 2019, 08:04:31 pm by Boone May »
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Offline Abilene

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Re: Miroku 1873 carbine owners, any upgrades?
« Reply #19 on: June 16, 2019, 07:46:36 pm »
Boone, I've noticed that with the Mirokus and don't really like the look.  But what caliber is it?  The original I'm sure is in 44-40 or 38-40, but originals had smaller mag tubes for .32-20.  So if the pistol grip rifle in the pic is a .357 then maybe that's why it's smaller? 

Offline Boone May

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Re: Miroku 1873 carbine owners, any upgrades?
« Reply #20 on: June 16, 2019, 08:04:03 pm »
I should have been clear, both the Miroku and the original 1873 are caliber .44 WCF (.44-40)
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Offline Abilene

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Re: Miroku 1873 carbine owners, any upgrades?
« Reply #21 on: June 16, 2019, 11:32:19 pm »
In that case, I hate it.   :)

Offline Cliff Fendley

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Re: Miroku 1873 carbine owners, any upgrades?
« Reply #22 on: June 16, 2019, 11:42:14 pm »
From aesthetics prospective I personally hate the Miroku 1873s. The barrel magazine tube gap is horrendous. Every time I look at one I have to scratch my head and ask why. It's like they took a time proven design and tried to ruin it. 
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Offline Coffinmaker

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Re: Miroku 1873 carbine owners, any upgrades?
« Reply #23 on: June 17, 2019, 10:52:51 am »

Ah NO   :o   Before everyone gets all wrapped around the axel (TOO LATE) it must first be realized Miroku DID NOT copy Winchester.  Miroku copied Uberti.  With some engineering changes meant to improve ease of manufacture ($$ Cost too) and then shoved it out there.

Something else, I personally have a beef with.  And start fights.  There is no NEW Winchester  1873 on the market.  There is a new Miroku 1873 on the market.  Winchester has NOT manufactured firearms in decades.  The name Winchester has been licensed to Miroku.  Not that the gun isn't a nice depiction of an 1873.  It is.  But it is a Miroku with "Winchester" roll stamped on it.

Offline PJ Hardtack

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Re: Miroku 1873 carbine owners, any upgrades?
« Reply #24 on: July 06, 2019, 01:55:10 pm »
I just ordered (and I mean moments ago) a Winchester/Miroku 'Short Rifle' in 44-40 for my wife. At a recent CAS event she handled a similar rifle in .357/.38 and decided that she needed one in 44-40 to match her 7-1/2" Pietta SAAs. Up to now she's been shooting her early Marlin .357 carbine sans push button safety.

Esthetics aside, the Win/Mirokus I've seen appear to be well made and quite attractive, the barrel/mag tube gap notwithstanding.

I pointed it out to my wife and her response was - "Meh." She's a shooter, not a firearms historian.

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