Author Topic: BP choices  (Read 1511 times)

Offline PJ Hardtack

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BP choices
« on: December 23, 2018, 01:34:14 pm »
Who is using Swiss 1-1/2 or Swiss FFFg and which do you prefer?
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Offline kwilliams1876

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Re: BP choices
« Reply #1 on: December 24, 2018, 07:44:21 am »
answer is......what ever shoots the best in your big bore buff gun cartridge. generally speaking one does not load 3f in those big cases. yes 3f in say a 40-65 might get the nod, but then that is not a vintage buffalo caliber choice. 1F, 1 1/2F or even 2f with proper loading technique will get you there.
best
kw

Offline Gabriel Law

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Re: BP choices
« Reply #2 on: December 24, 2018, 07:45:53 pm »
PJ:  "Til now, I've been using Swiss 1 1/2 Fg in my Sharps rifles, with some success.  But I bought fourteen pounds of GOEX 1Fg from Doc last September, and want to give it a try.  I understand it fouls more heavily, but with the right kind and volume of lube that should not be an issue.  I know a local fellow who uses GOEX FFg in his 45-70 with a healthy grease cookie and a Lyman 457125 slug, and does very well...no wiping or blowing for as long as he's shooting.  But he's not a CAS shooter.  He's uncorruptable.

Offline PJ Hardtack

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Re: BP choices
« Reply #3 on: December 25, 2018, 11:18:01 am »
I note that in his latest writings (Dec. 2018 Handloader magazine) Mike Venturino has switched to Swiss 1-1/2. He used to laud Goex Cartridge which prompted me to buy a case of it. It's almost gone now. I've got 5 lbs of Swiss 1-1/2 coming via a friend who is picking it up for me.

In the current Black Powder Cartridge News I see that some are using Swiss FFFg, hence the question. Once knew a guy that insisted 1F was THE right powder fir the 45-70 because Elmer Keith said so. He was a pretty good shot  with his Shiloh Sharps so he managed to make it work.

I wonder what the next powder fad will be ...... ?
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I don't do these things to others and I require the same from them."  John Wayne

Offline Drydock

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Re: BP choices
« Reply #4 on: December 25, 2018, 04:56:38 pm »
OE and Swiss seem to be the powders of choice for the precision guys.  As for granulation, more and more the old rules of what grind to use have gone by the wayside.  What ever the type and grind of powder your gun shoots best, is what you use.  Some of the thousand yard guys are using FFF for more velocity, out of very heavy rifles.  My trapdoors seem to like OE 3f best, as does my Sharps .50-70 carbine.  My .43 Spanish roller seems to do best with OE 2f.  I've got a Gras that will only shoot decent with Swiss 1.5.

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Offline Blackpowder Burn

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Re: BP choices
« Reply #5 on: December 25, 2018, 09:22:03 pm »
As Drydock says, I find Swiss and Olde Eynsford to be indistinguishable in performance in my long guns when loaded to the same charge by weight.  Clean burning and much less expensive than Swiss.  I have nothing against Swiss, it's a great product.  But when I can buy a fully comparable American product which is also less expensive...........it's an easy decision.

The long range competitors in our club use primarily Olde Eynsford and the matches are hotly contested with one dropped point frequently deciding them.
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Offline Lumpy Grits

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Re: BP choices
« Reply #6 on: January 19, 2019, 06:19:44 pm »
Been run'n Old 'E' 2F, in my .45-70 & .45-90 Shiloh's.
Targets say I made a good choice........ ;)
LG
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Offline Arizona Trooper

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Re: BP choices
« Reply #7 on: January 20, 2019, 03:50:48 pm »
Swiss 1 1/2 F is one of the few powders that will duplicate the original load in 45-70-405 and 45-80-500 Sharpshooter. 65 gr. in a modern 45-70 case with the 405 government bullet runs 1340fps from a Trapdoor rifle and shoots quite well. 75 grains in a modern 45-90 case (same case as 45-80SS) with the 500 grain government bullet also runs 1340 fps from a Trapdoor LRR. Strangely enough, this powder is also the best in my Smith carbine shooting N-SSA matches.

Offline frimath

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Re: BP choices
« Reply #8 on: January 21, 2019, 05:47:57 pm »
Hmmmmmmm, after reading this I’m thinking about trying the FFF in my 50-70 Rem RB..............

Offline greyhawk

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Re: BP choices
« Reply #9 on: January 21, 2019, 07:09:51 pm »
Hmmmmmmm, after reading this I’m thinking about trying the FFF in my 50-70 Rem RB..............

I always ran FFF in my sharps 45/70 but it has a short barrel (28inch) ---FFF was what I had at the time and it shot ok so kept doin it. Longer barrel I would use FF for sure

Offline Lumpy Grits

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Re: BP choices
« Reply #10 on: January 22, 2019, 07:18:29 am »
Ran Goex 3F in my 34" BBL, .45-70 and 30" BBL, .45-90 Shiloh's. The targets said it was a good thing to do.
Then switched to Old 'E' 2F, and found it burns like the 3F did. Except the 'E' had less fouling issues.
Sticking with 'E' 2F.
LG
« Last Edit: January 22, 2019, 07:20:17 am by Lumpy Grits »
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Offline PJ Hardtack

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Re: BP choices
« Reply #11 on: January 23, 2019, 11:30:04 am »
My Farmingdale 'Business Rifle' has a 28" barrel. I've never thought of it as being "short".

A pal has an original High wall in 45-70 and it has a 26" barrel, factory original. Looks odd but it groups very well at 200 m.

I think we make too much of granulation and ought to let the rifle decide what it prefers.
"I won't be wronged, I won't be insulted, I won't be laid a hand on.
I don't do these things to others and I require the same from them."  John Wayne

Offline greyhawk

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Re: BP choices
« Reply #12 on: January 23, 2019, 10:07:55 pm »
My Farmingdale 'Business Rifle' has a 28" barrel. I've never thought of it as being "short".

A pal has an original High wall in 45-70 and it has a 26" barrel, factory original. Looks odd but it groups very well at 200 m.

I think we make too much of granulation and ought to let the rifle decide what it prefers.

I sawed two inches off of it to get rid of some rust (previous owner = long term storage) so the "short" was part in my head - but alongside a 34 inch tube ??? yeah it looks short.
You right about granulations

this -----FFF was what I had at the time and it shot ok so kept doin it.

Offline Pitspitr

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Re: BP choices
« Reply #13 on: February 06, 2019, 02:41:27 pm »
75 grains in a modern 45-90 case (same case as 45-80SS) with the 500 grain government bullet also runs 1340 fps from a Trapdoor LRR.
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Offline Arizona Trooper

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Re: BP choices
« Reply #14 on: February 07, 2019, 08:38:08 pm »
it's an original '79 Trapdoor that had a horrible bore, so I had it relined to LRR specs and installed a Bulls Sight. Sort of a poor mans LRR. Sure fun to shoot!