Author Topic: I'll be doing my own.... Mosin Nagant ?  (Read 8331 times)

Offline Major 2

  • "Still running against the wind"
  • Deputy Marshal
  • Top Active Citizen
  • *
  • Posts: 11843
  • Cracker Cow Cavalry
Re: I'll be doing my own.... Mosin Nagant ?
« Reply #25 on: July 14, 2017, 10:46:48 am »
here is the skinny  ;D

HEX receiver 1934 date  mint & bright bore and no counter bore

A collector bought it in the box , 16 years ago never shot it , comes with bayonet, leather sling, oiler , tool , and leather ammo pouch.
I had it on hold, with $100 bill , had to go home to ye olde sock drawer stash for the balance.


Time & tide ... :-\

Owner showed up and took it off consignment ...decide to keep it , I guess
« Last Edit: July 14, 2017, 03:39:48 pm by Major 2 »
when planets align...do the deal !

Offline Drydock

  • MA1 USN ret. GAF #19, Colonel, Chief of Staff. BC, CC, SoM. SASS 1248 Life
  • American Plainsmen Society
  • Top Active Citizen
  • *
  • Posts: 3617
Civilize them with a Krag . . .

Offline Drydock

  • MA1 USN ret. GAF #19, Colonel, Chief of Staff. BC, CC, SoM. SASS 1248 Life
  • American Plainsmen Society
  • Top Active Citizen
  • *
  • Posts: 3617
Re: I'll be doing my own.... Mosin Nagant ?
« Reply #27 on: July 14, 2017, 05:43:30 pm »
Was me, I'd get this one!  http://www.gunbroker.com/item/667802399
Civilize them with a Krag . . .

Offline smoke

  • Top Active Citizen
  • *
  • Posts: 302
Re: I'll be doing my own.... Mosin Nagant ?
« Reply #28 on: April 14, 2018, 11:29:45 am »
Nice war time stock on that one.

FYI the original Mosins had a round receiver and flat rear sight.  The receiver was changed ot the hex due to ease of manufacturing.  You could always use it for GAF and claim it to be an early prototype. ;D  Although the early flat sight was different.
GAF#379

Offline Drydock

  • MA1 USN ret. GAF #19, Colonel, Chief of Staff. BC, CC, SoM. SASS 1248 Life
  • American Plainsmen Society
  • Top Active Citizen
  • *
  • Posts: 3617
Re: I'll be doing my own.... Mosin Nagant ?
« Reply #29 on: April 14, 2018, 01:06:09 pm »
Do you have a source for that?  Everything I've seen and read says Hex recievers until 1933 or so, when they changed to round for ease of manufacture.  I've held a couple of 1892 dated rifles, both hex receiver.  It's a fascinating possibility.
Civilize them with a Krag . . .

Offline smoke

  • Top Active Citizen
  • *
  • Posts: 302
Re: I'll be doing my own.... Mosin Nagant ?
« Reply #30 on: April 14, 2018, 01:26:17 pm »
I have read it on Gunboards in a number of different discussions.  I don't know if any production rifles were made with a round receiver pre-36.  36/37 is when the receivers were changed.  I think Tula transitioned in 36 and Izhevsk in 37 but I might have that backwards.

I will check my references on the earliest receivers being round and get back to you.
GAF#379

Offline Drydock

  • MA1 USN ret. GAF #19, Colonel, Chief of Staff. BC, CC, SoM. SASS 1248 Life
  • American Plainsmen Society
  • Top Active Citizen
  • *
  • Posts: 3617
Re: I'll be doing my own.... Mosin Nagant ?
« Reply #31 on: April 14, 2018, 02:22:57 pm »
My son has my Lapin book on Mosins, I need to get that back!
Civilize them with a Krag . . .

Offline pony express

  • Top Active Citizen
  • *
  • Posts: 3392
Re: I'll be doing my own.... Mosin Nagant ?
« Reply #32 on: April 14, 2018, 09:08:19 pm »
That's backwards, Hex receivers were made up until the 1930's, then round was introduced. Round is easier to produce, just turn it on a lathe. Hex requires more machining.  All the Model 91s were hex, while the 91/30s were both hex and round. M-38s and M-44s, as well as Chinese T-53 were round.

Offline smoke

  • Top Active Citizen
  • *
  • Posts: 302
Re: I'll be doing my own.... Mosin Nagant ?
« Reply #33 on: April 14, 2018, 10:13:57 pm »
That's backwards, Hex receivers were made up until the 1930's, then round was introduced. Round is easier to produce, just turn it on a lathe. Hex requires more machining.  All the Model 91s were hex, while the 91/30s were both hex and round. M-38s and M-44s, as well as Chinese T-53 were round.

Yes, production rifles pre 36/37 were hex.  Chatellerault made the first Mosins in France.  All of their production was hex. 

Russia contracted with Chatellerault because Russian was not yet up to producing the Mosin.  My vague recollection of the discussions was that the Imperial arsenals were not up to/did not have the machinery to mill it round precisely enough.  It was easier to mill a flat, rotate the receiver, mill a flat etc.   "shrug"  Best that I can remember. 

Things in the Mosin world change.  Maybe more info has come to light about the prototypes.  I do have the latest Russian book on the Mosin Nagant.  Of course I don't speak or read Russian so it will be a struggle to sort out.  Maybe the pics will help me figure it out.  I will check it tomorrow.

There are Russian built M38's and m44's built on older recycled hex receivers.
GAF#379

Offline smoke

  • Top Active Citizen
  • *
  • Posts: 302
Re: I'll be doing my own.... Mosin Nagant ?
« Reply #34 on: April 14, 2018, 10:28:25 pm »
Found it.

2. Rifle M1891/30, later pattern

In the years 1936-37 the Soviets fell back on something, which the co-designers of the old three-line-rifle, Emile and Leon Nagant, used in their test-rifle of 1889; the round receiver. This is the most significant feature of the rifle Mosin-Nagant M91/30, second pattern. The other important feature is the simplified rear part of the cocking device. With introducing the round receiver the Soviets tried to save material and working time. The new rear part was significant smaller and completely rounded without steps.

http://www.mosinnagant.net/ussr/soviet-m9130.asp
GAF#379

Offline Drydock

  • MA1 USN ret. GAF #19, Colonel, Chief of Staff. BC, CC, SoM. SASS 1248 Life
  • American Plainsmen Society
  • Top Active Citizen
  • *
  • Posts: 3617
Re: I'll be doing my own.... Mosin Nagant ?
« Reply #35 on: April 15, 2018, 09:24:36 am »
Ah, the 1889 test rifle.  That makes sense, it would have been a hand made rifle with no tooling, thus a lathe turned and bored receiver,  but as only one or two were made, and they were not, in fact 1891s, it won't affect the rule: Hex receivers only.  But it does make a point: the round receivers were easier to machine, not the hex.

The 1889 was also probably a single shot!  Check out C&Rsenals new video on the M-N.
Civilize them with a Krag . . .

Offline cpt dan blodgett

  • Top Active Citizen
  • *
  • Posts: 1438
  • SASS Conv 2013
Re: I'll be doing my own.... Mosin Nagant ?
« Reply #36 on: June 15, 2018, 06:50:34 pm »
Took mine to the range today.  Shot about 3 inches at 100.  Set the sights for 400 which should be something close to 300 yards not more than about 4 to 7 inches high at 100 and 200 with Romanian Silver tip.  No wind zero left and right seems good.  May shoot it for the long range if the Krag is not working well when we try sighting in.
Queen of Battle - "Follow Me"
NRA Life
DAV Life
ROI, ROII

Offline smoke

  • Top Active Citizen
  • *
  • Posts: 302
Re: I'll be doing my own.... Mosin Nagant ?
« Reply #37 on: June 15, 2018, 08:25:10 pm »
Ah, the 1889 test rifle.  That makes sense, it would have been a hand made rifle with no tooling, thus a lathe turned and bored receiver,  but as only one or two were made, and they were not, in fact 1891s, it won't affect the rule: Hex receivers only.  But it does make a point: the round receivers were easier to machine, not the hex.

The 1889 was also probably a single shot!  Check out C&Rsenals new video on the M-N.

Sorry I missed this post.  Yes the trials rifle.  I do have the new Chumak book on Mosins but since I don't read Russian.... ::)
GAF#379