Author Topic: Starting my 44-40 reloading adventure but I have a question.  (Read 15258 times)

Offline PJ Hardtack

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Re: Starting my 44-40 reloading adventure but I have a question.
« Reply #20 on: May 19, 2017, 10:05:12 am »
Old habit. I used to fastidiously wipe off the spray on lube before proceeding to avoid primer contamination. I've since cut the lube with alcohol so it dries PDQ. I could start off with the first position on the Dillon.


Wait a minute there PJ, ......
You Lube, Size, and De-Prime ....... BEFORE?? ...... running it through your Dillon???  I mean it's really none of my business, but ................ Isn't that what the first position on a Dillion is for??  Well, to resize and De-Prime.  Squirt the lube on prior of course.  Well, anyway, 44-40 or 38-40 or 32-20 can be a challenge to load.  After a little trial and error ..... easy peasy. 

Coffinmaker
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I don't do these things to others and I require the same from them."  John Wayne

Offline Coffinmaker

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Re: Starting my 44-40 reloading adventure but I have a question.
« Reply #21 on: May 19, 2017, 05:12:23 pm »
Well Heck PJ.

I admit I'm lazy.  I don't like extra steps.  At'z why a run two progressive presses.  One for small primers and one for biggies.  Just move my stool.  I digress.  Only a little.  Extra steps.  Nada.  None.  Zero.  Piffit.  I dump all my cases inna box wid a lid (shoe box), squirt the lube lightly, close the lid and shake ..... dump inna collimator (case feeder) and go.  After the turret fills, every cycle of the handle pops out a loaded round.  Once properly adjusted, even 44-40.

Coffinmaker

Offline M113A3

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Re: Starting my 44-40 reloading adventure but I have a question.
« Reply #22 on: May 19, 2017, 10:45:09 pm »
Thanks Baltimore Ed.

One more question I ordered the wrong primers Fed #155 vs. 150 which is what the manual says... since there are no returns should I just order the correct ones or is it safe to use them?


Offline Baltimore Ed

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Re: Starting my 44-40 reloading adventure but I have a question.
« Reply #23 on: May 19, 2017, 11:31:06 pm »
Federal 155 primers are magnum primers. The only time I've used magnums was during the primer shortage when they were all I could find. I had to tweek my recipes until they were gone and then I went back to my usual. The 150s are standard. Find some standard primers until you get more comfortable reloading. You don't need extra variables in whatever load you are working up. I've been using CCI or Winchester large pistol primers in my .44-40 with no issues. When you start attending shoots you should be able to sell or swap the mags for standards with no problems.
"Give'em hell, Pike"
 There is no horse so dead that you cannot continue to beat it.

Offline mehavey

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Re: Starting my 44-40 reloading adventure but I have a question.
« Reply #24 on: May 19, 2017, 11:39:30 pm »
You're not going to run into pressure problems using mag primers
if you're loading anywhere near standard 44-40 loadouts.  Use`em.

BTW: What powder/load are you contemplating ?
         (200gr bullet/8.0gr UNIQUE is a standard)

BTW#2:  I note Badaman advertises "hard-cast", but doesn't specify
             just "what" hardness that is.  FWIW, soft is good is
             future buys.  (Remember http://i67.tinypic.com/ny8qva.jpg.
             That 30-1 alloy is not much harder than pure lead.)

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Re: Starting my 44-40 reloading adventure but I have a question.
« Reply #25 on: Today at 11:11:33 pm »

Offline PJ Hardtack

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Re: Starting my 44-40 reloading adventure but I have a question.
« Reply #25 on: May 20, 2017, 02:47:13 pm »
I've got a pair of Dillons as well; one older model without removable tool head and a 550B that does. The older model is dedicated to .38 Spl. but I have extra tool heads for 9mm, .45 ACP, .44 Russian, .44 Spl. .45 Colt and 44-40 c/w powders measusres .

I'm thinking that I  need at least one more Dillon .....

I may try your squirt lube method using a plastic bag.


Well Heck PJ.

I admit I'm lazy.  I don't like extra steps.  At'z why a run two progressive presses.  One for small primers and one for biggies.  Just move my stool.  I digress.  Only a little.  Extra steps.  Nada.  None.  Zero.  Piffit.  I dump all my cases inna box wid a lid (shoe box), squirt the lube lightly, close the lid and shake ..... dump inna collimator (case feeder) and go.  After the turret fills, every cycle of the handle pops out a loaded round.  Once properly adjusted, even 44-40.

Coffinmaker
"I won't be wronged, I won't be insulted, I won't be laid a hand on.
I don't do these things to others and I require the same from them."  John Wayne

Offline M113A3

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Re: Starting my 44-40 reloading adventure but I have a question.
« Reply #26 on: May 20, 2017, 09:22:42 pm »
Mehavey - I am starting from the beginning so 6.9gr Unique and 15.0gr IMR-4227 which are the two I currently have.

As for hardness I found on the website it is 15 BHN is the stat provided. This is something I have not considered... is this to hard for current production 1873 and a Schofield?

Since I will not be casting my own I am open to suggestions for who to buy bullets from.

Thanks!

Offline mehavey

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Re: Starting my 44-40 reloading adventure but I have a question.
« Reply #27 on: May 20, 2017, 10:53:08 pm »
#2 will likely serve ... but I recommend you work your way up to the 8gr/Unique standard "quickly" before making follow-on decisions.  The faster/higher pressure rise will help ensure best bump-up to fill the bore.

... ditto for the Schofield.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Try http://cowboybullets.com/44-Caliber_c_10.html for softer bullets downstream and see how they work for you (8-9 Brinnel). 

Offline M113A3

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Re: Starting my 44-40 reloading adventure but I have a question.
« Reply #28 on: May 21, 2017, 12:19:46 am »
Thanks - for the link. As for the bump up I hope there will not be too much leading in my future due to the pressure being too low for the hardness of the bullets I have.

I will order a sample to test from Desperado.

Thanks Again.

Offline Baltimore Ed

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Re: Starting my 44-40 reloading adventure but I have a question.
« Reply #29 on: May 21, 2017, 08:11:38 am »
We think alike Coffinmaker, my bench has 3 progressive presses, a Dillon for .45 acp/ar, a modified Lyman turret for .45 LC and another Lyman for .38/.357 mag and anything else. I also load .44-40 on the .45 LC press and use the same powder set up, 5.2 grs of clays or clay dot. I just swap dies. I use a Dillon powder measure on my turret so all I do is raise the ram and dump the powder. Easy.

I admit I'm lazy.  I don't like extra steps.  At'z why a run two progressive presses.  One for small primers and one for biggies.  Just move my stool.  I digress.  Only a little.  Extra steps.  Nada.  None.  Zero.  Piffit.  I dump all my cases inna box wid a lid (shoe box), squirt the lube lightly, close the lid and shake ..... dump inna collimator (case feeder) and go.  After the turret fills, every cycle of the handle pops out a loaded round.  Once properly adjusted, even 44-40.

Coffinmaker
[/quote]
"Give'em hell, Pike"
 There is no horse so dead that you cannot continue to beat it.

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Re: Starting my 44-40 reloading adventure but I have a question.
« Reply #30 on: Today at 11:11:33 pm »

Offline M113A3

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Re: Starting my 44-40 reloading adventure but I have a question.
« Reply #30 on: May 29, 2017, 05:11:15 pm »
My order came in for the bullets and set up my first load for 6.9 gn Unique. Being new to all this the amount that weighs in at 6.9 gn seems rather small when poured into the case. It is only the bottom 1/3rd or maybe less using the MK1 eyeball.

I guess my concern is under loading... maybe bit over cautious but just being safe. I noticed on the Alliant site they suggest what Lyman considers the max load of 8.6gn for CAS 44-40

Thoughts?

Offline mehavey

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Offline jthbjr

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Re: Starting my 44-40 reloading adventure but I have a question.
« Reply #32 on: May 29, 2017, 07:56:33 pm »
I load a fair amount of 44-40. I load with a single stage press and Lee dies. I use Starline brass, Standard CCI primers and Laser-cast 44-40 200g bullets sized .427. My standard load is 8 grains of Unique. The guns I load for all like this load. It is a good load full power load for pistols and a good load in an original 1892 rifle.
I have found that with the thin case necks and Lee dies I don't have to lube the cases to deprime and resize. I also seat the bullet and crimp all in one motion. I have a Lee factory crimp die but don't use it any more.
I prime with an RCBS hand primer. (I am lazy too. I have one set up for large primers and one for small primers.)
I use a Little Dandy powder measure for all smokeless powder pistol reloading. You are right there is some extra space in the case. Before I seat the bullets I do a visual inspection of the powder level with a flashlight.
I generally get a formula that I like for a particular cartridge and stick with it.
What I do that is different from the advice I was given when I started on the 44-40 is: I don't use case lube with Starline cases and Lee dies and I can seat and crimp in one motion. Others may have different results.
John in beautiful Art, Texas

Offline Coal Creek Griff

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Re: Starting my 44-40 reloading adventure but I have a question.
« Reply #33 on: May 29, 2017, 11:09:17 pm »
M113A3:

I don't recall the bullet weight that you're using, but for most standard 44-40 weights (say, 200-220 grains), I don't think that a charge of 6.9 grains of Unique is unreasonable.  Yes, the powder kind of gets lost in the case, but that is not unusual for smokeless loads in blackpowder cases.  You might find it to be a bit position-sensitive (higher velocity when the powder is settled back in the case and lower velocity when the powder is settled forward), but it likely won't make enough difference to really matter.

Of course whenever you're shooting, especially when working up a load, be aware of the sound and recoil of the gun.  If either seems light, pause and check that the bullet has left the barrel.  That is a common safety practice--you certainly don't want to fire a round when there's a bullet stuck in the barrel.

I say, "Good job in asking questions and thinking this all through carefully."  Fools rush in where angels fear to tread.

CC Griff
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Offline M113A3

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Re: Starting my 44-40 reloading adventure but I have a question.
« Reply #34 on: May 30, 2017, 12:48:53 am »
Thanks CC Griff - I am sticking with a slow work up process. Thanks for the info on the positioning of the powder I was doing a bit of research and found that information informative.

BTW the safety tip is much appreciated.

Cheers

Offline w44wcf

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Re: Starting my 44-40 reloading adventure but I have a question.
« Reply #35 on: June 05, 2017, 06:46:31 pm »
Welcome to the world of 44-40 reloading!

a couple of things...
Does a sized case fit the chamber OK.
If so, the bullet will expand the case neck once the  case mouth has been belled  in your pic..

Magtech brass has thicker case neck walls than Starline... actually up to .002 on a side!

So it  could be that the cartridge neck od might be a tad large for your chamber in Magtech brass

In my 44-40, .428"' is the maximum bullet diameter in Magtech brass and  Starline will accept .431"
Cartridge neck od for both is .446"  

Interestingly, Magtech factory ammo contains .426" diameter bullets. At least the ones I took apart did.

w44wcf


W44wcf
aka Jack Christian SASS 11993 "I can do all things through Christ who strengthens me." Philippians 4:13
aka John Kort
aka w30wcf (smokeless)
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.22 W.C.F., .30 W.C.F., .44 W.C.F., .45 Colt Cartridge Historian

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Re: Starting my 44-40 reloading adventure but I have a question.
« Reply #36 on: June 11, 2017, 12:41:15 pm »
I use 7.0 grains TRAIL BOSS, 7.0 grains UNIQUE, or 9.0 grains of Unique (Taffin's .44-40 factory duplication load) if I want more pizzaz.  My main load in the Trail Boss 7.0 grains.  No chance of a double load to blow up my 1860 Henry, plenty of pizzaz for CAS, ands even a fair amount of smoke, compared to Unique.  My LEE auto disk throws 7.0 + or - .05 every time.
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Offline M113A3

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Re: Starting my 44-40 reloading adventure but I have a question.
« Reply #37 on: June 11, 2017, 08:08:01 pm »
Sorry for the late reply guys I have been super busy with life... So I finally completed my first round but have and issue which I want to run past you all.

Recap:
Magtech brass
200gr RNFP .428 (Desperado Bullet)
6.9 grains Unique

Here is the finished product - How does the crimp look? I seated the bullet so you can just barely see the top edge of the crimp groove. It measures 1.579




Here is the Bullet for reference



Now for the problem the round will fit the chamber of my Schofield but not the EGW chamber checker. I actually matched up a Magtech factory round to my reloaded round in the Schofield chamber you cant tell the difference between them.

BTW at w44wcf - the resized case fit my wilson case gauge but I don't recall if I tried it in my chamber... something to remember next time.

It is my understanding the EGW chamber checker is SAAMI spec so maybe my Uberti is a bit off..?

Not sure what I need to do to fix this issue.



Offline Coal Creek Griff

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Re: Starting my 44-40 reloading adventure but I have a question.
« Reply #38 on: June 11, 2017, 08:35:44 pm »
A bit of an educated guess here, but I imagine that the chamber checker is SAAMI minimum--if the cartridge fits, it will fit any SAAMI-spec chamber. If it freely chambers in your gun, I'd say that you're good to go (shooting).

CC Griff
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Re: Starting my 44-40 reloading adventure but I have a question.
« Reply #39 on: June 11, 2017, 10:04:00 pm »
I seem to remember hearing that the EGW chamber checker is set for tapered 44-40s like Black Hills factory.  If it chambers in your weapons, it is good to go.. Have fun!
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