Author Topic: Why the 1892?  (Read 11850 times)

Offline Coal Creek Griff

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Re: Why the 1892?
« Reply #20 on: March 12, 2017, 07:11:09 pm »
Similar to Blair, a '92-style rifle was lower on my wish list in part because of the number of times it appeared inappropriately in western movies and in part because of the late date of the design.  I recently ended up with a Rossi '92 carbine in 44-40 (pre-safety, blued), however.  I can't really afford originals of very many guns for which reproductions are made, but I got this idea of having at least one example of the Winchester 19th century lever action rifles starting with the Henry.  They are almost all reproductions, but I now have a Henry, an 1866 carbine, an 1873 short rifle (all in 44 WCF), an 1876 carbine (45-75), an 1886 rifle (45-70), the new 1892 and two original 1894's (a 32-40 octagonal barrel rifle and a 30-30 carbine).  Now I'm saving my money for an original 1895.  It seems that decent non-collectable shooters are relatively inexpensive in this model.  No doubt before I have the money saved up, someone will make a movie where the hero carries one and the prices will skyrocket, but I hope not.

Anyway, I have found the little Rossi to be a decent rifle so far.  It was barely used, even though it was an older production.  I did a little polishing, but it was actually not too bad when I got it.  I put 100 rounds through it the other day and it gobbled them up just fine.  I wasn't really shooting for accuracy, but I had no trouble hitting those tin cans at 30 yards!

I think that some of the springs are a bit too stiff and I'll probably replace them, but I'm pretty impressed with the overall quality considering that it cost maybe 1/4 what an original might.  OF COURSE I'd like to trade most of those reproductions for good originals, but I'm in that financial position where I would have to choose maybe two or three guns if I wanted originals, but I can have "all of the above" if I settle for reproductions.

CC Griff
Manager, WT Ranch--Coal Creek Division

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Offline Niederlander

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Re: Why the 1892?
« Reply #21 on: March 12, 2017, 08:02:39 pm »
I've got the same collection, but fortunately, I started it before marriage, kids, etc.  In other words, when I had more disposable income for such things!  My reproductions are the Henry, 1866, and 1876.  The rest are originals.  To give an idea of how things have gone up,   my original 1873, 1886, 1894, and 1895, all rifles, cost me right at $2500 put together!  Ah, for the good ol' days!
"There go those Nebraskans, and all hell couldn't stop them!"

Offline PJ Hardtack

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Re: Why the 1892?
« Reply #22 on: March 13, 2017, 11:30:54 am »
In the not too distant future, the 'kids' of today will be referring to these times as "the good ol' days" when good original Winchesters could be had for as little as $3500.

I do sincerely hope that the price of Colt Pythons will drop through the floor after the "Living Dead" fades from memory.
"I won't be wronged, I won't be insulted, I won't be laid a hand on.
I don't do these things to others and I require the same from them."  John Wayne

Offline Tuolumne Lawman

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Re: Why the 1892?
« Reply #23 on: May 03, 2017, 11:24:21 pm »
I just picked up another 92 Rossi in 44-40.  I started CAS with one in 444-40 in 1994, and it served me well until I got bit by the 1860 Henry bug a couple years later.  My SASS/CAS persona is an ex-military Law dawg in the 1870s, so I have open tops, an 1860 Henry and a mule eared double for my main match guns.  

As far as a versatile rifle goes, the 1892 wins hands down. A 44-40 loaded for CAS with 200 grain RNFP and Trail Boss for my back up CAS rifle, or loaded for hunting with a .428 JSP over 23.5 grains of IMR 2400 for 1950 fps for whacking deer and black bear.  Mine will probably go camping with me loaded with the HV pills I do (for Marlin and 1892 ONLY).

As far as not being a real "Cowboy gun" that's BS.  they were used in the Johnson County war, and were getting very common in the era of Butch Cassidy and the Wild Bunch.  The Oklahoma territory was untamed until the 1920s or later.

Additional: Wikipedia list 13 major old west gunfights between 1892 and 1918.  Daltons, Doolins, Brooks, Mc Farlin, etc.  I would lay odds that 1892s were in more than a few of them.  IIRC, there were several 1892s listed as seized in the Johnson County War.
TUOLUMNE LAWMAN
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Offline PJ Hardtack

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Re: Why the 1892?
« Reply #24 on: May 04, 2017, 10:48:21 am »
It took a while for the '86 and '92 to be accorded due respect as "Cowboy" guns on this forum.

The only rifles that I question are the modern Henrys with the .22 type mag tube. That's a bit of a stretch for me.

There was a time when the SASS Rule Book, under 'Equipment Eligibility' stated: "If John Wayne would use it, it's OK." That pretty much summed it up.

I wonder what JW would say about short stroke kits and all the other gadgetry in common use today?
"I won't be wronged, I won't be insulted, I won't be laid a hand on.
I don't do these things to others and I require the same from them."  John Wayne

Offline Tuolumne Lawman

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Re: Why the 1892?
« Reply #25 on: May 04, 2017, 11:30:44 am »
Recently, I was at a match and asked a shooter if his rather modern rig "would pass the John Wayne Test?"  He asked me what was that!  He had no clue.  Same guy asked me why I shot an unmodified Uberti 1860 Henry when it is so darn slow.  I told him that I don't care about speed and scores.  I just shoot to have fun and honor the Old west and the men that forged it.  He looked at me like I had a third eye or Unicorn horn in the middle of my forehead!
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Offline Slamfire

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Re: Why the 1892?
« Reply #26 on: May 04, 2017, 12:01:15 pm »
I'm with ya',,,i have a older model,,ROSSI,,44/40,,stock,,just polished centain areas,( the loading gate ,,sharp!!),shoot's to POA,,CAS loads for now,,going to load ,,up to 7.5gr,ww231,,for rifle,,have 2, 1875 outlaw's,,44/40,,,,work's for me!!!! " Just be true to your self ".





 "SMOKE"M if'a GOTUM.,,,,HOOTMIX.

Offline Coffinmaker

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Re: Why the 1892?
« Reply #27 on: May 04, 2017, 02:40:21 pm »
PJ,
AH, JW wouldn't care.  He was an actor.  He used whatever gun the prop department handed him.  Only a few of his "movie" guns were his personal guns.

Tuolumne,
Unmodified Henry??  If I might be so bold, you would do well to change out your lever side springs and the Main Spring before extensive use.  The OEM springs will cause undue wear on the bearing parts.  Changing the Main Spring will also result in a much more user friendly rifle.

May the Fourth be with You

Coffinmaker

Offline Tuolumne Lawman

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Re: Why the 1892?
« Reply #28 on: May 04, 2017, 06:17:04 pm »
CM. Yep stock. I don't shoot enough to worry about it ::). I'll be dead before it wears out. LOL
TUOLUMNE LAWMAN
CO. F, 12th Illinois Cavalry  SASS # 6127 Life * Spencer Shooting Society #43 * Motherlode Shootist Society #1 * River City Regulators

Offline PJ Hardtack

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Re: Why the 1892?
« Reply #29 on: May 04, 2017, 08:02:55 pm »
Of course, but you missed the point.

Wayne shot movie blanks, but his guns were likely stock. I don't think he would have thought much of powder puff .38s and a two hand hold on pistols (read IPSC in Cowboy boots minus the power factor).


PJ,
AH, JW wouldn't care.  He was an actor.  He used whatever gun the prop department handed him.  Only a few of his "movie" guns were his personal guns.



Coffinmaker
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I don't do these things to others and I require the same from them."  John Wayne

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Re: Why the 1892?
« Reply #29 on: May 04, 2017, 08:02:55 pm »

Offline Tuolumne Lawman

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Re: Why the 1892?
« Reply #30 on: May 04, 2017, 08:26:28 pm »
Funny, the closer it gets to getting the 92 in 44WCF, the more excited I get about shooting it in matches!  I have about 275 rounds of brass, powder, a LEE 4 die set with factory crimp die (an absolute necessity with 44-40), Trail Boss, and primers.  I also have a 5-pack of the Cheyenne Pioneer cartridge box 44 WCF boxes.  All I need to do is stop at the LGS and pick up a 500 box of Bear Creek 200 grain lead RNFP .428s.

I have a feeling my Henry will sit out more than a few matches! ;D
TUOLUMNE LAWMAN
CO. F, 12th Illinois Cavalry  SASS # 6127 Life * Spencer Shooting Society #43 * Motherlode Shootist Society #1 * River City Regulators

Offline Gabriel Law

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Re: Why the 1892?
« Reply #31 on: May 05, 2017, 05:09:49 pm »
Coffinmaker:  can you suggest a source for the springs of which you speak?  I have Uberti Henry - love it - but I'll change the springs if it will make the rifle better.

GL

Offline Coffinmaker

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Re: Why the 1892?
« Reply #32 on: May 06, 2017, 05:27:10 pm »
Gabriel,

There exist two sources of really nice Lever Side Springs.  I personally like SlixSprings.  They do require careful fitting.  Also "Whisper Springs" a product of "The Smith Shop."  They are both intended to be used in a rifle with some action work.  If the rifle is chambered in 45 Colt, I strongly suggest modifying the Carrier Block Arm for Positive Slam Down.  Bottleneck cases run clean enough a grungy carrier block is seldom a problem.

Main Springs are available from "The Smith Shop" and "Slick Magic."  

Just changing these three springs will result in a marked improvement in serviceability.  OEM lever side springs cause an awful lot of unnecessary wear on the Lever Cam and the Carrier Block Arm.  Your rifle will love you.

Coffinmaker

PS:  With a lighter Main Spring, I also suggest reducing the Firing Pin Return Spring.

Offline Gabriel Law

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Re: Why the 1892?
« Reply #33 on: May 06, 2017, 05:47:02 pm »
Thanks Coffinmaker:  I'll GOOGLE them and see if they can send to Canada.  I appreciate your help.  It's hard to imagine liking my Henry more than I already do, but I'm willing to take the chance.

My original '92 Winchester is also in 44 WCF and it is so sweet to shoot.  There's no new left on the old girl, but she sure runs smooth.

Offline Gabriel Law

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Re: Why the 1892?
« Reply #34 on: May 13, 2017, 09:24:03 pm »
Well, I called the Smith Shop, talked to a nice fellow there who took my order of whisper springs, mainspring, and pin return spring.He said to send him the money when I get the parts and am happy with them.  Hard to fathom in this day and age.
So thanks guys, for the great advice.

Offline Gabriel Law

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Re: Why the 1892?
« Reply #35 on: May 15, 2017, 05:05:05 pm »
Spring kit arrived this morning from The Smith Shop...installed new whisper springs, mainspring and firing pin return spring.  The mainspring is so soft that I wondered if it would set off a primer, but surprise, surprise!  The action of my Henry is very soft and smooth now.  Thanks again for the great advice.

Offline Coffinmaker

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Re: Why the 1892?
« Reply #36 on: May 15, 2017, 05:15:45 pm »
TA DA.  ;D

Coffinmaker   ::)

 

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