Historical question on Gov'mnt .45

[River City John]

OK, I know the "Wild Bunch" tutorial disses the mags with the lanyard ring. I do not foresee myself "slamming" mags home in a frenzy to shave another 1/2 second off my time. (Plus, the lanyard ring mags were more early period. Right?)

My question, - were they really clipped to a lanyard rig setup? Meaning multiple lanyards strung across the body, one to the pistol and two(+) to the magazine pouch?

And who makes such a period setup?


RCJ

[S. Quentin Quale, Esq.]

There are some references in official Manuals to using a lanyard with a magazine loop and clip but I don't know of any photographs of such things nor could some very knowledgeable folks come up with any evidence that the Army ever purchased any.  I did find one photo of dual-clip lanyard but the consensus was that this was a locally manufactured item, probably for an officer.

Here is a discussion from some time back on the subject:

http://www.militaryhorse.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=11390

SQQ

[St. George]

The lanyard loop was pretty much a Cavalry thing - used by mounted troopers in the event that they lost the grip of their piece for one reason or another, or to be able to drop (and late retrieve) their spent magazine.

You don't see the lanyards being used on the magazines by Infantry, who didn't have to contend with a moving horse - but you do see them affixed to the service pistol all through the use of the pistol lanyard - and that'd be right up until today.

That said - extant mounted photos aren't all that common - I have a few of Cavalrymen during mounted exercises and on patrol where the multiple lanyards are visible, and I seem to remember them being illustrated by Randy Steffens in his 'Horse Soldier' series.

While they could be worn across the body, many were affixed to the epaulet - the trooper figured it out.

Who makes the set-up?

You do.

Vaya,

Scouts Out!

[S. Quentin Quale, Esq.]

So likely this was a "field expedient?"  That would explain the lack of contracting data.

Were there any official "drawings" or was it just what a unit saddler might fix up?

SQQ

[St. George]

It was the standard-issued woven lanyard, with a smaller hook than that issued for the M1909 Colt Revolver....

Scouts Out!

[Pitspitr]

I have a couple of lanyards. The one by What Price Glory seems to be pretty good quality. http://onlinemilitaria.net/products/725-US-M1905-Pistol-Lanyard/

I use them on the mags and not on the pistol. I use them on the mags because the lanyard ring mags are more expensive and I really don't care to drop them and possibly step on them or otherwise damage them. That being said wearing the lanyard is something of a PITA.

[Bat 2919]

I had a rich uncle, you know, Uncle Sam, who insisted that I utilize a lanyard at all times when I carried a 1911.  Since I was assigned to a U S Army Military Police Company and our primary job was the police patrol function we carried our 1911's more or less every day.  After a few years of that, none of us gave a second thought about the lanyard, it was simply always there.  My mind and arm worked within the establish limits of the lanyard and I rarely found myself attempting to exceed them.  Ain't it strange what you can get used to if you have to.  I haven't used a lanyard in the real world for ever but when I do attach one to a 1911 today for a match it's amazing how quickly that muscle memory returns and it goes back to being a non issue in short order.

[Drydock]

As a Master at Arms I was required to use a lanyard with my 1911s and M9s, makes sense on a ship really.  The one issued at the time was the annoying boingy phone cord one.  Everyone hated that thing, got an old style one pretty quick.  It really becomes a non issue quite quickly, and does have a comfort factor involved,  whether walking a ships deck or bouncing across the desert in a Duece and a half.

I could see wearing one addtional magazine lanyard were I mounted,  attached to the one in the gun, for that first reload.  After that, things are probably too far gone to care!

Interesting that the only lanyard magazines I do have, are for my Tokarevs!  Must not lose the peoples magazines, perhaps?

[Niederlander]

Personally, I could never use the issue lanyard, because by the time I got it around me, especially wearing a flak jacket, I was basically holding the pistol against my chest.  I'd have had to just tie it on me, and powers that be seemingly didn't like that.

[Bat 2919]

The only lanyard loop magazines I own both came off a prize table at a shooting event.  I've always liked the historic look of them but never wanted one of them badly enough to buy it.

As for Ned's comment about not finding a lanyard that fits, all I can say is they make most things for us average people.  I bet you could have tied two of them together and made something usable.  I thought Marines were supposed to adapt and overcome.

[pony express]

I bet you could have tied two of them together and made something usable.  I thought Marines were supposed to adapt and overcome.

In this case, adapt and overcome would probably mean go steal another lanyard from the Army, or from a sailor, and tie it to his to extend it.

[Drydock]

We left the boingy phone cord ones out for them to steal.  Worked every time . . .

[Niederlander]

I did adapt;  I just chose not to wear one!  (Never lost my pistol OR any magazines, either!)

[Major 2]

The lanyard loop was pretty much a Cavalry thing - used by mounted troopers in the event that they lost the grip of their piece for one reason or another, or to be able to drop (and late retrieve) their spent magazine.

You don't see the lanyards being used on the magazines by Infantry, who didn't have to contend with a moving horse - but you do see them affixed to the service pistol all through the use of the pistol lanyard - and that'd be right up until today.

That said - extant mounted photos aren't all that common - I have a few of Cavalrymen during mounted exercises and on patrol where the multiple lanyards are visible, and I seem to remember them being illustrated by Randy Steffens in his 'Horse Soldier' series.

While they could be worn across the body, many were affixed to the epaulet - the trooper figured it out.

Who makes the set-up?

You do.

Vaya,

Scouts Out!

"..."I seem to remember them being illustrated by Randy Steffens in his 'Horse Soldier' series."

I was thinking this very point as I began, to read this thread..... I have Randy Steffen's Volume's ...you're spot on Sir

If you'd like, RCJ  I'd scan a page for you  

[River City John]

Major 2,
you are a Gentleman!

And I can use all the help I can get.


Appreciate it.

I do not plan to use a lanyard. Tried one year before last for a bit on my Swiss revolver. Didn't take to it, so it ended up on the prize table.

To be truthful, I'm mainly curious for historical reasons.
Got to thinking, if you had one for the pistol, and one each for up to three mags, it must have been quite a display draped on the body . . .

RCJ

[pony express]

I Got to thinking, if you had one for the pistol, and one each for up to three mags, it must have been quite a display draped on the body . . .

RCJ

Be kinda hard to sneak through the brush with all those loops of string hanging off of ya...

[St. George]

Except that that never happened...

Like I said - it was a Cavalry thing - and they fought mounted.

Any dismounted action took place next to the horse - not running about in brush - the Infantry did that - to make sure it was safe for the Cavalry...

No one's supplied a looped magazine since forever, though they would appear in ARNG inventories up until the early  '70's because the Guard owned that equipment (and they were Class IX) - but as soon as gun shows became really common, those magazines and L-tools and Squad boxes disappeared immediately  - stolen and sold by enterprising Guard guys, along with a myriad of un-dyed tan leather holsters.

The lanyard was worn affixed to the soldier or to his equipment - whichever proved most convenient and offered the most free range of movement without entanglement - sometimes coiled with a rubberband across the loop that came free as soon as pulled - like I said, soldiers figured it out.

Scouts Out!

[Major 2]

Here you are John...note the lanyard is slung over the shoulder in Steffen's prints....

[1961MJS]

HI

Midway has the lanyard mags:

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/345716/metalform-magazine-1911-government-commander-45-acp-7-round-steel-blue-flat-follower-ww1-lanyard-loop-welded-base

I'm not totally sure I'd want one, but I have the loops on both my hardball 1911's.

What Price Glory has the lanyards, I have one somewhere, but I don't remember which one and I've never used it.

https://onlinemilitaria.net/products/c136-SLINGS-LANYARDS/

Later

[Professor Marvel]

Here you are John...note the lanyard is slung over the shoulder in Steffen's prints....

My Dear Major 2

I really must comment on print #1 :



- it is an excellent example of " make sure to extend your  pistol PAST your horse's head" otherwise....

- And I am intrigued by the trooper's method of carrying his bayonet - on his shoulder....

yhs
prof marvel