Author Topic: Army ration rules on bread  (Read 9340 times)

Offline Delmonico

  • Deputy Marshal
  • Top Active Citizen
  • *
  • Posts: 25047
Army ration rules on bread
« on: August 18, 2004, 10:18:14 am »
Got a question from the civy cook fer you army folks.  Why did the army ration rules state that all fresh bread be held a day or two if possible before feeding it to the troops.  I wonder about this.

I have an idea, but will wait, see if anyone else comes up with the same thing.  Don't want to prejudice anyones research.
Mongrel Historian


Always get the water for the coffee upstream from the herd.

Ab Ovo Usque ad Mala

The time has passed so quick, the years all run together now.

Offline Delmonico

  • Deputy Marshal
  • Top Active Citizen
  • *
  • Posts: 25047
Re: Army ration rules on bread
« Reply #1 on: August 18, 2004, 12:14:54 pm »
The Gineral moved this to it's own post like I should of, but maybe that's why he is the Gineral and I is just the cook. ;D

I am going to add this, most of what I know about the post-Civil war ration is that they tried to follow the regs of 1865 as much as possible , at least for several years.  Any information on rations would be much apreciated.  I know out on some of the posts they didn't get stuff when they should have. 

Thank You much.
Mongrel Historian


Always get the water for the coffee upstream from the herd.

Ab Ovo Usque ad Mala

The time has passed so quick, the years all run together now.

Offline Gen Lew Wallace

  • Major General, VIII Corps, Commander Middle Dept.
  • Deputy Marshal
  • Top Active Citizen
  • *
  • Posts: 394
  • Savior of Washington D.C.
Re: Army ration rules on bread
« Reply #2 on: August 18, 2004, 11:25:09 pm »
Pard, I did a little looking and the only thing I've come up with so far is from some old health regulation.  It says that all bread must be cooked thoroughly and then allowed to cool completely before being eaten.  Didn't say how long though.  I'm still on the hunt for this one.
Retired USAF, 20 years defending my beloved nation
NRA Life, SUVCW, GAF#164, AF&AM, AASR

"This is my native state.  I will not leave it to serve the South.  Down the street yonder is the old cemetery, and my father lies there going to dust.  If I fight, I tell you, it shall be for his bones." -Lew Wallace, after the 1860 election

Offline US Scout

  • GAF Commander
  • CAS-L Ghost Rider
  • Top Active Citizen
  • *
  • Posts: 1147
Re: Army ration rules on bread
« Reply #3 on: August 19, 2004, 04:12:08 pm »
I have read in several contemporary accounts that fresh bread was much preferred to hardbread, or what we know as hardtack.

I would "think" that fresh bread was made and eaten as often as possible.  It don't take that long for a loaf to cool down after taken out of the oven.

US Scout

Offline Delmonico

  • Deputy Marshal
  • Top Active Citizen
  • *
  • Posts: 25047
Re: Army ration rules on bread
« Reply #4 on: August 19, 2004, 04:32:52 pm »
Hard bread (hard tack) is not what I mean, I sent this to the gineral but should have posted it.  Now It is a bit older than our period, but I understand the regs didn't change much.  This is from "Feeding the Frontier Army.  1775 to 1865 By Barbabra K. Luecke.  On page108 it has Article 27 of the 1825 regs.  Reg 202 States that "The troops ought not to be allowed to eat soft bread, fresh from the oven, with out first toasting it.  This process renders it nearly as wholesome and nutritious as stale bread."

I continue to search my referances, but I know I have seen that bread was to stale a day or so before eating where possible.  This might have been in Civil War books from the Library. 

It is one of those mysteries that only a food historian would even worry about.  I have fed my unit much fresh bread in the past. 

Mongrel Historian


Always get the water for the coffee upstream from the herd.

Ab Ovo Usque ad Mala

The time has passed so quick, the years all run together now.

Offline Trailrider

  • CAS-L Ghost Rider
  • Top Active Citizen
  • *
  • Posts: 2127
    • Gunfighter Zone
Re: Army ration rules on bread
« Reply #5 on: August 19, 2004, 05:23:09 pm »
Could it have had anything to do with the concern that yeast might cause the troops gastric distress, bloating, flatulance, etc.? Or maybe, like the parody of the temperance union song by the Chad Mitchell Trio, "We don't eat cookies because they have yeast, And one little bite turns a man to a beast..."   ::)
Ride to the sound of the guns, but watch out for bushwhackers! Godspeed to all in harm's way in the defense of Freedom! God Bless America!

Your obedient servant,
Trailrider,
Bvt. Lt. Col. Commanding,
Southern District
Dept. of the Platte, GAF

Offline Delmonico

  • Deputy Marshal
  • Top Active Citizen
  • *
  • Posts: 25047
Re: Army ration rules on bread
« Reply #6 on: August 19, 2004, 06:26:17 pm »
That is my asumption as to why, but did not want to prejudice anyone.   Them old barracks and tents could be a bit lacking on ventilation. 

I don't have my notes handy here but I think the ration was about the size of a large home made loaf today.  Fresh bread does have that affect on people at times. 

If any body else has any more info I would like to know.
Mongrel Historian


Always get the water for the coffee upstream from the herd.

Ab Ovo Usque ad Mala

The time has passed so quick, the years all run together now.

Offline Gen Lew Wallace

  • Major General, VIII Corps, Commander Middle Dept.
  • Deputy Marshal
  • Top Active Citizen
  • *
  • Posts: 394
  • Savior of Washington D.C.
Re: Army ration rules on bread
« Reply #7 on: August 19, 2004, 09:43:07 pm »
The wife says that air and water give me gas.   :-X
Retired USAF, 20 years defending my beloved nation
NRA Life, SUVCW, GAF#164, AF&AM, AASR

"This is my native state.  I will not leave it to serve the South.  Down the street yonder is the old cemetery, and my father lies there going to dust.  If I fight, I tell you, it shall be for his bones." -Lew Wallace, after the 1860 election

Offline Delmonico

  • Deputy Marshal
  • Top Active Citizen
  • *
  • Posts: 25047
Re: Army ration rules on bread
« Reply #8 on: August 19, 2004, 10:33:12 pm »
Such things were not often mentioned, but a bunch of men with a lot of gas seems to be hinted at from time to time in accounts of the period either civilian or military.  One thing that seems to get very bad rap are the Sibley tents.  Since these were used in the field and held I belive 20 men a bunch that had not bathed because of field conditions would be a bit rank.  Add a bunch of guys whose diet had been sudenly changed for the worse and that tent could get a bit dangerous.

One note:  Many Indian accounts of going to white towns talk about how bad they smelled.  White accounts of Indian villages talk about how bad they smelled.  I think they both would have offend the noses of us modern folks.
Mongrel Historian


Always get the water for the coffee upstream from the herd.

Ab Ovo Usque ad Mala

The time has passed so quick, the years all run together now.

Offline SGT John Chapman

  • Top Active Citizen
  • *
  • Posts: 471
  • And from the mists and darkness, He came.........
Re: Army ration rules on bread
« Reply #9 on: August 27, 2004, 10:55:01 pm »
Gen Wallace,
My wife says the same thing......................she still lets me have my beans though......... :o
Regards,
Sgt Chapman

##**EXTREME WARTHOG**##
            ~~GAF #143~~
               **SCORRS**
             ~*RATS #165*~
__________________________________________________
Courage is being scared to Death,...But saddling up Anyway." -John Wayne
"BUTT THOSE SADDLES, It's Time To Ride"

CAS City Profile For Sgt John Chapman

Offline Delmonico

  • Deputy Marshal
  • Top Active Citizen
  • *
  • Posts: 25047
Re: Army ration rules on bread
« Reply #10 on: August 27, 2004, 11:15:59 pm »
I highly recomend going over ta TFS and check out Ruff Justice's Kinchee recipes.  Good stuff but a platoon of kimchee eaters could blow the top off of a Sibley. :P :o ::) :'(

In all seriousness there are hints that flatulance was a problem in the Frontier Army, the just didn't often come out and say it.
Mongrel Historian


Always get the water for the coffee upstream from the herd.

Ab Ovo Usque ad Mala

The time has passed so quick, the years all run together now.

Offline Gen Lew Wallace

  • Major General, VIII Corps, Commander Middle Dept.
  • Deputy Marshal
  • Top Active Citizen
  • *
  • Posts: 394
  • Savior of Washington D.C.
Re: Army ration rules on bread
« Reply #11 on: August 27, 2004, 11:53:47 pm »
Gawd, kimchee brings back bad memories of my tour in Korea.  PEW! 
Retired USAF, 20 years defending my beloved nation
NRA Life, SUVCW, GAF#164, AF&AM, AASR

"This is my native state.  I will not leave it to serve the South.  Down the street yonder is the old cemetery, and my father lies there going to dust.  If I fight, I tell you, it shall be for his bones." -Lew Wallace, after the 1860 election

Offline Delmonico

  • Deputy Marshal
  • Top Active Citizen
  • *
  • Posts: 25047
Re: Army ration rules on bread
« Reply #12 on: August 28, 2004, 10:00:28 am »
Gineral, I bet ya have ate that hot beef stuff ya eat on a lettuce leaf with rice and that really good pepper sauce?  Can't rember the name, ny notes and recipes are home right now, but good stuff.

Also never move kimchee from point A to point B in a sealed jars in an un-air conditioned car on a hot day.  If you do, be careful of the ceiling in yer kitchen.
Mongrel Historian


Always get the water for the coffee upstream from the herd.

Ab Ovo Usque ad Mala

The time has passed so quick, the years all run together now.

Offline Gen Lew Wallace

  • Major General, VIII Corps, Commander Middle Dept.
  • Deputy Marshal
  • Top Active Citizen
  • *
  • Posts: 394
  • Savior of Washington D.C.
Re: Army ration rules on bread
« Reply #13 on: August 29, 2004, 09:38:49 pm »
Pard, I'm a midwestern farm boy raised on meat and potatoes.  I never did like green leafy stuff.  ;)  I think yaki-mandu(sic) was ok, which is spicy beef.  Other than that, forget it. 
Retired USAF, 20 years defending my beloved nation
NRA Life, SUVCW, GAF#164, AF&AM, AASR

"This is my native state.  I will not leave it to serve the South.  Down the street yonder is the old cemetery, and my father lies there going to dust.  If I fight, I tell you, it shall be for his bones." -Lew Wallace, after the 1860 election