Author Topic: Frontier Military Action Shooting????  (Read 22348 times)

Offline Drydock

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Re: Frontier Military Action Shooting????
« Reply #20 on: November 02, 2005, 12:11:10 AM »
It is what it is.  A GAF match.  Grand Army of the Frontier  shootin' match.  Don't y'all get silly with acromyms now. 
Civilize them with a Krag . . .

Offline US Scout

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Re: Frontier Military Action Shooting????
« Reply #21 on: November 02, 2005, 05:43:27 AM »
I think we're on to something here. 

This might be a good time for Departments to begin considering holding regional or state GAF matches using the examples set by the two previous Musters, even if they are only day shoots. 

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Offline Lou Graham

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Re: Frontier Military Action Shooting????
« Reply #22 on: November 02, 2005, 06:38:53 AM »
Great idea, Scout!

Or even a 2 or 3 stage side-match at an already scheduled NCOWS shoot.

That would also help to get more folks familiar with the difference in style from a regular CAS match.
Soot Lady
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Offline Major Matt Lewis

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Re: Frontier Military Action Shooting????
« Reply #23 on: November 02, 2005, 07:57:56 AM »
So it begins....LOL! My plan is in motion...
Major Matt Lewis
Grand Army of the Frontier * SASS Life * NCOWS * Powder Creek Cowboys * Free State Ranges * RO II * NRA Life * Man on the Edge

Offline US Scout

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Re: Frontier Military Action Shooting????
« Reply #24 on: November 02, 2005, 09:37:02 AM »
Lou,

That is a great idea - a side match or two at some of the bigger matches.  Put up the targets, have it staffed by some GAF members in uniform, and let 'er rip! 

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Re: Frontier Military Action Shooting????
« Reply #25 on: Today at 05:03:06 PM »

Offline US Scout

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Re: Frontier Military Action Shooting????
« Reply #25 on: November 02, 2005, 09:55:24 AM »
I have to admit that I didn't shoot anywhere near as well as I usually do or even would have liked, but on the other hand I shot better than I expected given that I had not attended a match since the last Muster and hadn't shot but maybe 100 rounds since then.  My physical therapist was pleased that my condition didn't deteriorate as a result of shooting guns for a day.

I like the format of the Muster.  I also like that it brings out the original values that CAS was started for in the first place.  Elsewhere in CAS City, some of the old timers have expressed concern that CAS is slowly (or perhaps rapidly) becoming what it was created to avoid.  We're seeing race guns appear, and stages set up to accomodate the serious speed shooters over those who attend for the challenge and fun of shooting "old time" guns in a competative but still friendly environment.  In many ways, CAS has begun losing the "cowboy spirit" that so many of us joined SASS or NCOWS to experience and enjoy. The Muster still has that feeling of comradery that makes (or made) shooting CAS so much fun.

What we call our interpretation of the CAS sport is unimportant, as long as it grasps the concept of what the GAF represents.  What is important is that we maintain our standards, whether it be for shooting or uniforms or camp authenticity or whatever, and that everyone realizes that the sum of the GAF is far greater than its individual components, members or interests. 

I would hope that with the increased turnout at the 2005 Muster over the 2004 Muster, that the 2006 will likewise see a continued growth, to include both new participants and the return of those who attended in 2005. 

US Scout
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Offline Major Matt Lewis

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Re: Frontier Military Action Shooting????
« Reply #26 on: November 02, 2005, 10:45:13 AM »
Lou,

The call for GAF sidematches at either NCOWS or SASS events would be cool.  However, an administrative nightmare. 

As a matter of fact, I just about reached my saturation point this year with 54 registered shooters.  I would like to put out an open call for volunteers who would be willing to help work on the match this coming year.  Folks who will commit to being in Ackley on September 27th to set up the range and shoot the match on September 28th and help with sidematches and the main match.  I think that it is also safe to say that with the good press that we will be getting and the positive feedback here at CAS City, we will have more folks this year.  I take great pride in building a quality product.  Next year, I need some help to do it.

A special thanks to John Torrence, Dave Sielert, Rob Brannon, Dave Birk for helping set up the range.  I would also like to thank Mike Tathum and John Torrence for submitting ideas for scenarios.  Then I added my value add ;)  Yup, every time you crawled or jumped, that was me...He he he
Major Matt Lewis
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Offline RattlesnakeJack

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Re: Frontier Military Action Shooting????
« Reply #27 on: November 02, 2005, 01:59:23 PM »
"Frontier Military Action Shooting" seems to be as good a term as any, in my view!

That name reflects one of the primary underlying concepts of GAF - i.e. to encompass the military of all nations during the Victorian era, when frontiers were being opened by various nations all around the world -  Africa, Asia, Australasia, etc., as well as in the Americas ...
Rattlesnake Jack Robson, Scout, Rocky Mountain Rangers, North West Canada, 1885
Major John M. Robson, Royal Scots of Canada, 1883-1901
Sgt. John Robson, Queen's Own Rifles of Canada, 1885
Bvt. Col, Commanding International Dept. and Div.  of Canada, Grand Army of the Frontier

Offline Pitspitr

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Re: Frontier Military Action Shooting????
« Reply #28 on: November 05, 2005, 06:52:40 AM »
I like the title "Frontier Military Action Shooting". But I still Think FUN is a good description ;) ;D
Whatever we call it, I plan to be there next Sept.
(It's sooo KEWL, I get be be in  at the ground floor of a new movement!!!!!!!!! :o)
I remain, Your Ob'd Servant,
Jerry M. "Pitspitr" Davenport
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Grand Army of the Frontier
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Offline Captain Barrett

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Re: Frontier Military Action Shooting????
« Reply #29 on: November 06, 2005, 08:25:53 AM »
Folks,

I do like the idea of Scout's to have a side match at events where folks can come up and shoot a Trapdoor, a Krag, a Lee Navy or a Lee-Enfield. Doing so while wearing a Victorian military uniform would indeed be like living a John Ford Western. Perhaps the side match can become REALLY interesting by having a few pairs of uniform trousers and shirts for the offering to those whom wish to find out how it is to shhot while wearing wool...

Another possible idea would be to create a side match as a single stage mini-GAF-style event. Let folks see how physical Victorian military combat truly was. Merely suggesting...
Your humble, obedient servant,

David P. Barrett
Captain, 1st U.S. Infantry Regiment
Regimental Adjutant

"...For I am as constant as the Northern Star..."

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Re: Frontier Military Action Shooting????
« Reply #30 on: Today at 05:03:06 PM »

Offline Drydock

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Re: Frontier Military Action Shooting????
« Reply #30 on: November 06, 2005, 09:03:22 AM »
I'd like to see a downloaded "Battle rifle" class.  IE a 2 gun class, but using documented milspec weapons, 1866-1900.  Trapdoors, Spencers,  Martini Henrys, Sniders, Krags, Lee-Metfords/Enfield Mk 1s, M1888 Mausers, etc. Must be "Rifle" caliber, but using low velocity lead bullet loads to avoid target damage. Uniforms to match the weapons.  Don't show up for the Rough Riders with a Mauser.

 My only provision would be no stripper clips.  A simple tecnical limitation, easily enforced.  I'd like to eliminate Mauser 98s, but I suspect they're too popular.  Want to use that 98 with your picklehaube?  Fine, no stripper clips. Divide them per NCOWs rules, IE powder and handgun style.
Civilize them with a Krag . . .

Offline Nine Toe Jim

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Re: Frontier Military Action Shooting????
« Reply #31 on: November 14, 2005, 08:23:06 AM »
Hang in there Rattlesnake. I've looked up Ackley on the map and giving it serious consideration for 2006. Can't let you be the only Canuck year after year. I'm already hooked on the military theme and these discussions are weakening me more.

NTJ ;D

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Offline Nine Toe Jim

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Re: Frontier Military Action Shooting????
« Reply #32 on: November 14, 2005, 11:37:01 AM »
Well we wouldn't want to get too many crossing the border at once. We might be mistaken for an invasion force. HAW!

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Offline RattlesnakeJack

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Re: Frontier Military Action Shooting????
« Reply #33 on: November 14, 2005, 01:37:48 PM »
Nine Toe:
I'll keep plugging away at you, sir!  Would be good to have a countryman there, certainly ... I have worn my khaki field service dress, at least some of the time, just to avoid the " everyone seems to be uniformed in blue, grey or khaki, what's with the lone fool in red?" scenario!

Sgt. Drydock:
A "main battle rifle (downloaded)" class would be great!  So, shall we start lobbying for it?   I didn't have quite enough time prior to Muster to get any cast-bullet cartridges loaded for my "Long Lee-Enfield" rifle (externally the same as the Lee-Metford rifle adopted in 1888 - and a real "peach" she is - see below) or I'd have had her along this year.  (Got as far as getting bullets cast, and a bunch sized and lubed, but then ran out of time - so I should certainly get a load finalized and be "good to go" by next year! 







My 1890's small arms could then be - and quite properly for the North West Frontier of India, the Sudan, South Africa, even the Yukon  - a "Pistol, Revolver, Webley. 455 inch" and a "Rifle, Magazine, Lee-Enfield, .303 inch" ....)

Rattlesnake Jack Robson, Scout, Rocky Mountain Rangers, North West Canada, 1885
Major John M. Robson, Royal Scots of Canada, 1883-1901
Sgt. John Robson, Queen's Own Rifles of Canada, 1885
Bvt. Col, Commanding International Dept. and Div.  of Canada, Grand Army of the Frontier

Offline Major Matt Lewis

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Re: Frontier Military Action Shooting????
« Reply #34 on: November 14, 2005, 02:39:11 PM »
I think the idea has potential, but remember, baby steps boys....
Major Matt Lewis
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Offline Silver Creek Slim

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Re: Frontier Military Action Shooting????
« Reply #35 on: November 14, 2005, 03:10:12 PM »
How did I miss this? This is a great topic.

Slim
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Offline Drydock

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Re: Frontier Military Action Shooting????
« Reply #36 on: November 14, 2005, 06:53:08 PM »
Lovely Jack, just lovely.  If nothing else, you could use it for a sidematch.  I'm still waiting for my Krag parts to show up. 

Then what do I do?  Shoot my Trapdoor, or shoot the Krag?  Ah, the agony of such decisions . . . 
Civilize them with a Krag . . .

Offline Major Matt Lewis

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Re: Frontier Military Action Shooting????
« Reply #37 on: November 14, 2005, 06:57:36 PM »
I reckon this is one of those delightful dilemas....
Major Matt Lewis
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Offline RattlesnakeJack

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Re: Frontier Military Action Shooting????
« Reply #38 on: November 14, 2005, 09:37:05 PM »
... Then what do I do?  Shoot my Trapdoor, or shoot the Krag?  Ah, the agony of such decisions . . . 

Well, you could shoot one the first day and the other the next day ... attired in the proper "period" uniforms for each, of course ....

Sidematch use was why I was hoping to get suitable .303 rounds loaded and tested in time for Muster 2005 ... but the fact that I'd only have been able to use it for 10 rounds was why that project ended up in the "low priority" category .... 
Rattlesnake Jack Robson, Scout, Rocky Mountain Rangers, North West Canada, 1885
Major John M. Robson, Royal Scots of Canada, 1883-1901
Sgt. John Robson, Queen's Own Rifles of Canada, 1885
Bvt. Col, Commanding International Dept. and Div.  of Canada, Grand Army of the Frontier

Offline Grizzle Bear

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Re: Frontier Military Action Shooting????
« Reply #39 on: November 15, 2005, 09:55:32 AM »
I loaded the Krag ammo we used at the Muster.  168 grain bullet, cast from straight wheel weights.  Gas checked.  Over 12 grains of Unique.  Velocity should have been about 1200 fps.  Did absolutely nothing to the target except wear off multiple layers of paint.  Was not aware of any bounce-back.   I think this is very practical.  And Major Matt knows I like to see unusual firearms brought out and used!

Grizzle Bear

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