Author Topic: Loading Data for the 45-60 WCF  (Read 96858 times)

Offline leverman

  • Citizen
  • *
  • Posts: 18
Re: 45-60 Winchester smokeless load info
« Reply #75 on: July 28, 2012, 02:37:40 pm »
Ditto to Silver Rings for his load testing, should be given a post for all the work he has done, the Varget load will be what I will try out, many thanks to S.R. and previous poster. deerwarden ;D

Offline Silver_Rings

  • Top Active Citizen
  • *
  • Posts: 459
  • Gunfighter who shoots for fun.
Re: 45-60 Winchester smokeless load info
« Reply #76 on: August 02, 2012, 09:53:03 am »
Hammer1,

Glad to help.  Sounds like you found a great load for your rifle.

Silver Rings
Gunfighter, SASS 27466, NRA Life, GOFWG, BOSS, RO 1, RO 2

Offline Rowdy Fulcher

  • NCOWS
  • Top Active Citizen
  • ***
  • Posts: 2716
Re: 45-60 Winchester smokeless load info
« Reply #77 on: August 02, 2012, 12:36:23 pm »
Silver Rings
Thanks for all the load data .We appreciate your hard work and time you've spent developing them . Keep up the good work .  ;D

Offline Roosterman

  • Top Active Citizen
  • *
  • Posts: 408
    • Muzzleloading guns
Re: 45-60 Winchester smokeless load info
« Reply #78 on: October 16, 2012, 05:11:41 pm »
Shot some Varget loads that worked well for Silver Rings . Worked well for me too. Both 300gr and 405 bullits.  I GOTTA get some new sights that I can see...... :'(
www.fowlingguns.com
Known to run with scissors from time to time
Citadel of Sin Social Club

Offline Roosterman

  • Top Active Citizen
  • *
  • Posts: 408
    • Muzzleloading guns
Re: 45-60 Winchester smokeless load info
« Reply #79 on: November 08, 2012, 10:42:34 pm »
Got my peeps on, what a difference. Shot a  100 yard 5 shot group @ 1 5/8" today with 35gr Varget and 405 hard cast bullet. Very pleased. ;D
www.fowlingguns.com
Known to run with scissors from time to time
Citadel of Sin Social Club

Offline leverman

  • Citizen
  • *
  • Posts: 18
Re: 45-60 Winchester smokeless load info
« Reply #80 on: November 20, 2012, 04:12:48 pm »
I bought a Ulberti 45-60 because of my love of western movies, my favorite being Tom Horne man of the west. It was an impulsive buy, as soon as I picked it up I had to own one. Unlike you guys, here in the UK we have to prove a use/need for a firearm, as an avid deer hunter shooting around 40-50 a year and controlling others to make a combined total of 120 deer a year, just shooting at paper was not satisfying for me. To be allowed to stalk(hunt) deer, you have to use a rifle with a muzzle energy of over 1700ft/lbs of energy. Most all loads for the 45-60 fall way below this figure, many of the loads posted here do as well, I had to ask an expert for advise and guidance. To my request for load data came one person whom has shone above all others with his advice and load data, Silver Rings!! he replied to my p.m. asking if he had any loads that would help me support my request to hunt deer legal in the U.K. with a 45-60. I have just received the reply from the Chief Constable of Norfolk, stating there is no published data of 45-60 loads in the U.K. no person has been granted the right to hunt deer in the U.K. with this calibre, HOWEVER because of the data you have provided stating many deer legal loads, you will be the first person in the U.K. allowed the use of a 45-60 for deer control and any other legal quarry, I cannot wait to join you guys in hunting deer with an American icon, my lever action 45-60 rifle, Silver Rings, thank you sir for your help, from the other side of the pond. deerwarden  ;D
« Last Edit: November 20, 2012, 04:18:02 pm by leverman »

Offline Roosterman

  • Top Active Citizen
  • *
  • Posts: 408
    • Muzzleloading guns
Re: 45-60 Winchester smokeless load info
« Reply #81 on: November 29, 2012, 06:47:57 pm »
Shot some SR 4759 today. 24 gr and a 405 gr bullet.  Fired 10 shots, 6 of the shots were 1 5/8" with a couple flyer 2" out....probably my fault on the flyers.
 Had no luck with BP. Using KIK and swiiss with 300 and 385 gr bullets. 3" groups at best, lots of leading. :-\
www.fowlingguns.com
Known to run with scissors from time to time
Citadel of Sin Social Club

Offline Grizzly Adams

  • Deputy Marshal
  • Top Active Citizen
  • *
  • Posts: 1303
Re: 45-60 Winchester smokeless load info
« Reply #82 on: November 29, 2012, 09:59:57 pm »
I bought a Ulberti 45-60 because of my love of western movies, my favorite being Tom Horne man of the west. It was an impulsive buy, as soon as I picked it up I had to own one. Unlike you guys, here in the UK we have to prove a use/need for a firearm, as an avid deer hunter shooting around 40-50 a year and controlling others to make a combined total of 120 deer a year, just shooting at paper was not satisfying for me. To be allowed to stalk(hunt) deer, you have to use a rifle with a muzzle energy of over 1700ft/lbs of energy. Most all loads for the 45-60 fall way below this figure, many of the loads posted here do as well, I had to ask an expert for advise and guidance. To my request for load data came one person whom has shone above all others with his advice and load data, Silver Rings!! he replied to my p.m. asking if he had any loads that would help me support my request to hunt deer legal in the U.K. with a 45-60. I have just received the reply from the Chief Constable of Norfolk, stating there is no published data of 45-60 loads in the U.K. no person has been granted the right to hunt deer in the U.K. with this calibre, HOWEVER because of the data you have provided stating many deer legal loads, you will be the first person in the U.K. allowed the use of a 45-60 for deer control and any other legal quarry, I cannot wait to join you guys in hunting deer with an American icon, my lever action 45-60 rifle, Silver Rings, thank you sir for your help, from the other side of the pond. deerwarden  ;D

Outstanding!  Keep us posted on performance. :)
If you can read this, thank a teacher. If you can read this in English, thank a Veteran!
COMNAVFORV, NRA life, SASS Life, TG, STORM Rider #36.
GAF

Offline Joe Lansing

  • Top Active Citizen
  • *
  • Posts: 290
Re: 45-60 Winchester smokeless load info
« Reply #83 on: December 02, 2012, 04:47:36 pm »
 Leverman,
    According to my calculations, a 300 gr. bullet would need a muzzle velocity of1600 fps to give you a muzzle energy of 1700 ft lbs.      This is taken from "COMPLETE GUIDE TO HANDLOADING", by Philip B. Sharpe.

                                                                                                             JL

Offline leverman

  • Citizen
  • *
  • Posts: 18
Re: 45-60 Winchester smokeless load info
« Reply #84 on: December 03, 2012, 03:25:24 pm »
Hi there, I'm loading up the 300gn Lyman 2640191 bullet with I4198 starting from 31 growns up to 34 grams of I4198, when I get to 1700+fps, I'll be happy with that as that will give me 1924ft/Ids, I'll then tweak it for accuracy etc, just loaded 3 each of 31, 32, 33, 34gns of I4198, with Puff-Lon, slightly compressed. I'm looking at some rear sights now, really don't know what to go with, Lyman or Marbles, 1873 or the 76 model, or a ladder sight. Of all my rifles, this one has real class and a look of authority about it, a true classic in my opinion, and I'm looking forward to hunting with it as your forefathers did. Our fallow deer here are available to hunt all year round, around the size of your whitetail deer, we also have Red, Sika, Roe, Muntjac, and Chinese water deer as well to hunt, Muntjac are very challenging as they seldom stop walking while feeding, this will be something I've longed to do, to hunt with a lever action rifle, a challenge that I will enjoy immensely. Leverman. ::)
« Last Edit: December 03, 2012, 03:40:50 pm by leverman »

Offline Sir Charles deMouton-Black

  • THE ANCIENT SUBSTANCE ENDURES - ALL LESSER PROPELLANTS SHALL FIZZLE
  • NCOWS
  • Top Active Citizen
  • ***
  • Posts: 5992
Re: 45-60 Winchester smokeless load info
« Reply #85 on: December 03, 2012, 07:09:17 pm »
The closests British round would be .450,.400 Nitro-for-black, 2 - 3/8" It shows a lower me as the factory bullet was either 230 gr or 270 gr.  With the 300 grainer, getting the required me from your 45-60 should be easy.

I would suggest a tang sight, with the nod to the Marbles as it has windage adjustments.

My son hunts deer in Cambridgeshire and has to use a sound moderator.  I guess you hunt in a less populated area, but how would you moderate a levergun?  Use a half magazine and a creative front sight mount?
« Last Edit: December 03, 2012, 07:11:05 pm by Sir Charles deMouton-Black »
NCOWS #1154, SCORRS, STORM, BROW, 1860 Henry, Dirty Rat 502, CHINOOK COUNTRY
THE SUBLYME & HOLY ORDER OF THE SOOT (SHOTS)
Those who are no longer ignorant of History may relive it,
without the Blood, Sweat, and Tears.
With apologies to George Santayana & W. S. Churchill

"As Mark Twain once put it, “History doesn’t repeat itself, but it does rhyme.”

Offline Roosterman

  • Top Active Citizen
  • *
  • Posts: 408
    • Muzzleloading guns
Re: 45-60 Winchester smokeless load info
« Reply #86 on: December 04, 2012, 09:02:31 am »
Hi there, I'm loading up the 300gn Lyman 2640191 bullet with I4198 starting from 31 growns up to 34 grams of I4198, when I get to 1700+fps, I'll be happy with that as that will give me 1924ft/Ids, I'll then tweak it for accuracy etc, just loaded 3 each of 31, 32, 33, 34gns of I4198, with Puff-Lon, slightly compressed. I'm looking at some rear sights now, really don't know what to go with, Lyman or Marbles, 1873 or the 76 model, or a ladder sight. Of all my rifles, this one has real class and a look of authority about it, a true classic in my opinion, and I'm looking forward to hunting with it as your forefathers did. Our fallow deer here are available to hunt all year round, around the size of your whitetail deer, we also have Red, Sika, Roe, Muntjac, and Chinese water deer as well to hunt, Muntjac are very challenging as they seldom stop walking while feeding, this will be something I've longed to do, to hunt with a lever action rifle, a challenge that I will enjoy immensely. Leverman. ::)
Goog luck with a 300 gr bullet. I can't get mine to shoot 300 gainers. 4" to 5" groups @ 100 yards. Good enough for deer I suppose. Mine shoots a 405gr best, 1 5/8 @ 100 yards. I second the marbels peep sight. I put one on mine and am very happy with it. I can now shoot the gun to it's potential.
 If you find an accurate 300gr load, let us know!
www.fowlingguns.com
Known to run with scissors from time to time
Citadel of Sin Social Club

Offline leverman

  • Citizen
  • *
  • Posts: 18
Re: 45-60 Winchester smokeless load info
« Reply #87 on: December 04, 2012, 03:03:00 pm »
Sir Charles, the 45-60 will be iron sights only, and definitely no moderator, want to use it as is, with addition only of a better iron sight, looks like the marbles. I live in Norfolk and work near Cambridge (Barton Mills) so close to your son's county. Rooster, I also have the Lee 340grns mold, will try that as well for accuracy against the 300 gr bullet. Went for the Lyman 300 as I saw lots of posts saying it was the original bullet weight and type, will let you know how I get on. deerwarden.

Offline Rowdy Fulcher

  • NCOWS
  • Top Active Citizen
  • ***
  • Posts: 2716
Re: 45-60 Winchester smokeless load info
« Reply #88 on: December 07, 2012, 11:01:24 am »
Leverman
Good luck with your adventure . The 300 grain bullet works fine in my rifle .

Offline Snapshot

  • Very Active Citizen
  • *
  • Posts: 97
  • Aim Small - Miss Small
Re: 45-60 Winchester smokeless load info
« Reply #89 on: May 05, 2013, 02:08:45 pm »
Did not see... ??? any one tryed the Vithavouri N135. ???

I slicked my rifle, took it all apart and followded "Tom Horn`s" recipie on how to! Thanks Tom :)

Now I have a few rounds with the Finland powder N135. 43grns.  and the 350grns bullet.
I have some 300grns to try out next.
Honour is like a an island, steep and without a shore.
Once you leave you can newer return.!

General Johan Von Ewald, Danish/Norwegian Army Until 1813

Offline Palatine Tom

  • Active citizen
  • *
  • Posts: 39
Loading Data for the 45-60 WCF
« Reply #90 on: May 15, 2014, 06:29:35 am »
Dear all,

I am now also a happy Chapp 1876 45-60 owner. :) :D ;D

My bullet is a lead RCBS Style 320 grain FN.

Following powder is on hand:  Trail Boss, VV320, VV 330, VV340 and Swiss 3.

I am looking for a good target load for 50 and 100 meters.  (For hunting only BP would be my choice)  ;D.

Any loading data hints are very very welcome.

greetings from sunny Bavaria

Palatine Tom
Do unto others as they would
do unto you, but do it first." Amen

Online doketx

  • Very Active Citizen
  • *
  • Posts: 53
Re: Loading Data for the 45-60 WCF
« Reply #91 on: May 15, 2014, 09:00:46 pm »
Palatine Tom,
     Herzliche Grusse aus Texas.  Lyman's 49th loading book suggests 10-13 grains of Trail Boss for the 330 grain H.P., cast.  The best load for the 45-60 that I've found is 9 grains of Unique under a 300 grain cast flat nose, but that doesn't seem to be one of the powders you have.  Try this and let me know how it works for you.  By the way, where in "sunny Bavaria are you?  I was an exchange student in Regensburg back in the Dark Ages.
                                                                                                         Alles gute,
                                                                                                         Dave

Offline Palatine Tom

  • Active citizen
  • *
  • Posts: 39
Re: Loading Data for the 45-60 WCF
« Reply #92 on: May 16, 2014, 02:33:35 am »
Thanks Dave so  lets start with TB and see...

I live close to Augsburg and work in Munich - so live could be much worse  ;D

This weekend its 1866 and 1886 time :D :D



Greetings

Tom
Do unto others as they would
do unto you, but do it first." Amen

Online doketx

  • Very Active Citizen
  • *
  • Posts: 53
Re: Loading Data for the 45-60 WCF
« Reply #93 on: May 20, 2014, 06:13:38 pm »
Palatine Tom,
     Please let me know how the Trail Boss worked out.

                                                               Dave

Offline Rowdy Fulcher

  • NCOWS
  • Top Active Citizen
  • ***
  • Posts: 2716
Re: Loading Data for the 45-60 WCF
« Reply #94 on: May 21, 2014, 09:18:55 pm »
Howdy
Trail Boss is a Excellent choice for plinking around . I have used it and like it . Was stationed in Germany from 1984 to 1986 loved it . The Beer was Great and the people were Friendly .

Offline Palatine Tom

  • Active citizen
  • *
  • Posts: 39
Loading Data for the 45-60 WCF
« Reply #95 on: May 23, 2014, 05:33:09 am »
Dear all,
Nothing changed here in Bavaria people and beer still fine :-* :-*

1. I have a RCBS 45-70 die set. What is your advice to reload 45-60 with this set? How do you do it properly
2. Ditto but how to reload properly the 45-90 ?

Greetings

Tom
Do unto others as they would
do unto you, but do it first." Amen

Offline Sir Charles deMouton-Black

  • THE ANCIENT SUBSTANCE ENDURES - ALL LESSER PROPELLANTS SHALL FIZZLE
  • NCOWS
  • Top Active Citizen
  • ***
  • Posts: 5992
Re: Loading Data for the 45-60 WCF
« Reply #96 on: May 23, 2014, 10:00:41 am »
Dear all,
Nothing changed here in Bavaria people and beer still fine :-* :-*
1. I have a RCBS 45-70 die set. What is your advice to reload 45-60 with this set? How do you do it properly
2. Ditto but how to reload properly the 45-90 ?
Greetings
Tom

I have done neither, but for .45-70 I only size just enough to firmly hold the bullet. My thoughts are to try various sizing settings on your .45-70 sizing die until you get a round that will stay together and chamber properly.

If you insist on a correct die set, there may be regular dies at regular prices, but MY choice of specialty die makers is C-H 4D;

http://www.ch4d.com/

I think specialty dies will be harder to find in Europe, so try adapting/adjusting what you have before spending the big euro's!

P.S: Here is the LEE set;  http://leeprecision.com/v-ltd-3-die-45-60.html
« Last Edit: May 23, 2014, 10:07:40 am by Sir Charles deMouton-Black »
NCOWS #1154, SCORRS, STORM, BROW, 1860 Henry, Dirty Rat 502, CHINOOK COUNTRY
THE SUBLYME & HOLY ORDER OF THE SOOT (SHOTS)
Those who are no longer ignorant of History may relive it,
without the Blood, Sweat, and Tears.
With apologies to George Santayana & W. S. Churchill

"As Mark Twain once put it, “History doesn’t repeat itself, but it does rhyme.”

Online doketx

  • Very Active Citizen
  • *
  • Posts: 53
Re: Loading Data for the 45-60 WCF
« Reply #97 on: June 18, 2014, 05:35:55 pm »
Mr. Silver Rings,
      ??? I'd like to pick your knowledgeable brain concerning some 45-60 loads I've tried.  The best powder I've ever found is Unique, but it's terribly hard to find around here, so I've tried 2400 which I have great success with in my 45-70.  I've also tried Reloder 7, which I've had no luck with in either caliber.  My question:  The unique is no problem and is extremely accurate.  When I shoot the Reloder 7 or the 2400 in the 45-60 the cases come out sooty, as if the case isn't sealing against the chamber walls.  Can you perhaps tell me why?  What can I do?  Any help would be greatly appreciated.  Thanks!

                                                                                                                 Dave

Offline Silver_Rings

  • Top Active Citizen
  • *
  • Posts: 459
  • Gunfighter who shoots for fun.
Re: Loading Data for the 45-60 WCF
« Reply #98 on: June 18, 2014, 08:52:10 pm »
Howdy Dave,

If the loads shoot accurately I would not worry about the soot.  The soot could come from a load that is too light to fully expand the case and seal the gases in.  What size bullets are you using?  They should be in the range of .457-459.  If they are too small they may allow gas leakage.

If the load is accurate and powerful enough for what you are planning on using it for, the brass polisher will clean the soot off.

Silver Rings   
Gunfighter, SASS 27466, NRA Life, GOFWG, BOSS, RO 1, RO 2

Online doketx

  • Very Active Citizen
  • *
  • Posts: 53
Re: Loading Data for the 45-60 WCF
« Reply #99 on: June 18, 2014, 09:02:35 pm »
Silver rings,
     Thanks for the prompt reply.  Yes, the soot comes off after polishing, no problem.  I was just wondering why I got soot with Reloder 7 and 2400 and not with Unique.  The accuracy with the Unique is great, so I know it's not the bullets.  I just can't find any Unique,  so I'm having to make do with what I can find.  I guess I'll just load up a few rounds a little bit hotter, and maybe that will help.  Thanks again for the help.

                                                                                                     Dave