Author Topic: Paper Cartridge for cap and ball revolvers  (Read 1734 times)

Offline Pappy Myles

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Paper Cartridge for cap and ball revolvers
« on: July 25, 2019, 04:04:18 pm »
When you absolutely have more time on your hands than necessary.........I always wanted to play around with these.   Figured out how to make them myself.    The charge is 17 gn 3fg with a Eras Gone reproduction of a colt 36 cal conical.   And 1851 Uberti Navy London model.  I'll be needing to open up the conical opening frame to get the cartridge to load as intended.

Enjoy,

I'll post more pictures on how to nitrate and roll the papers later
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Offline Professor Marvel

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Re: Paper Cartridge for cap and ball revolvers
« Reply #1 on: July 25, 2019, 06:28:05 pm »
My Good Pappy

Nice job on the paper cartridges, and a really good group on that target!
Might I inquire as to the distance you shot it at?

Now you need some repro wooden cartridge blocks to put them in!

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Offline Montana Slim

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Re: Paper Cartridge for cap and ball revolvers
« Reply #2 on: July 26, 2019, 08:47:27 am »
I've been using similar cartridges in my stock Uberti Navies for several years. In fact, I'm also using 17 gr 3f with either the Lee 380 RB or conical. The difference I see is that my cartridges have a bit more taper than yours. You might try making a new forming tool to make a paper tube approximately .26" diameter at base & about .95 high. I worked out the approximate dimensions using 3D CAD back in my day as a weapons & ammo engineer.

I also heavily nitrate my rolling papers.. They still leave residue, but not bad. I will say the paper adds noticeable "stink" to the otherwise sweet smell of BP.

I've not used the eras gone bullet,  but as reference the Lee bullet heel diameter is about  359 to 360 & tucks into the chamber fully, even when wrapped with paper.

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Offline John E.B. Rawton

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Re: Paper Cartridge for cap and ball revolvers
« Reply #3 on: July 27, 2019, 10:27:02 am »
I have been using Cliff Manley formers in .36-20gr and .44-30gr. They were made for round ball, however, I seal the cartridge with no bullet and seat them separate. That way I can add lube if I want. I just made another block which fits the .44 mandrel. Now I can make 40gr charges for the Walker. Curling papers have worked really well and for the most pat burn up. A small ring may be left if not blown out.

Offline Sir Charles deMouton-Black

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Re: Paper Cartridge for cap and ball revolvers
« Reply #4 on: July 27, 2019, 05:39:12 pm »
I learned how to make paper cartridges from the forum "thehighroad", I think it was called. I live on the WET coast and half of the year is definitely soggy. In such conditions my paper cartridges, if not treated with extreme care and under shelter, turned into a soggy mess. I'm sure there are ways to do it, but ideal conditions are a rarely found in real life.

I switched to "mongoose" reloads, based on the experience of a fellow that posted on "thefrontierspot" under that name, for about a week!  He used fired cartridge cases to hold your preferred charge, with the roundball pressed on top to seal it. lubed wad and caps need to be managed separately.

For .36 cal., I used 18-20 gr of 3f in a .357 Mag case. (My lube wads are punched from egg carton and dipped in a home brew lube.)

For .44 cal., I used 25-28 gr of 3f in a .45 Colt case. The cases had to be outside sized, or the ball would just slip down onto the powder.

Store in regular large pistol boxes, ball end up. For a walk-about, wrap 5 or 6 in some aluminum foil and carry in a cap pouch.

To load , pinch off the ball and tuck it in your fist while pouring the powder into the chamber, all of it. Grab a wad, if you are using them (Optional) and thumb over the powder, press in the ball and ram.

NOT histronically corrupt(sick), but works better in the damp, and Robert's yer Father's Brother.
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Offline Pappy Myles

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Re: Paper Cartridge for cap and ball revolvers
« Reply #5 on: July 29, 2019, 11:14:02 am »
Sorry for not getting back sooner,   the distance was about 12 yards.
I've played with the template a bit also and tightened the cases up some.

Attached are some more pictures
I use these curling papers and soak in the pan.   the solution is satiated.  I add a little at a time until the potassium nitrate start to go to the bottom and not dissolve.   Drop in several papers,  swish around, pull out and hang to dry.    I'll post more pictures later.
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Offline Pappy Myles

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Re: Paper Cartridge for cap and ball revolvers
« Reply #6 on: July 29, 2019, 11:26:52 am »
I did load up about 100 with lee RB mold.  they cast out at .380.   Took them to the Thunder river renegades match last Saturday.   I also use a uberti 66 in 44-40.   its an older model and a TTN 1878 12 ga mule eared.     Shot a clean match too,   the round ball works like its suppose too.  Loaded via cylinders and the rammer on the guns.   I like very much.    I'm using the MTM red hard plastic case for 45 acp and the holder until I can clean up my shop and get to my wood working equipment to make proper cases.

I placed 16 out of 24.    not necessarily a speed demon but I had fun and got a lot of attention.   Have arthritis in left thumb so its a lot slower shooting.

I'm hooked
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Offline Bunk Stagnerg

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Re: Paper Cartridge for cap and ball revolvers
« Reply #7 on: July 29, 2019, 01:05:55 pm »
Those paper cartridges are pretty neat, but when iI go out to practice it is going to be 30 to 40 rounds down range and that would take hours of work making them. if I was a woods walker plinking a few shots here and there they would be great, but for me not so much.
I do use paper tubes in my Sharps but loading them is pretty easy and I don't shoot the Sharps a lot at any one time.
Bunk

Offline rbertalotto

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Re: Paper Cartridge for cap and ball revolvers
« Reply #8 on: July 29, 2019, 02:33:35 pm »
I got some of that "More Time on My Hands" stuff too! Been playing with paper cartridges and nitrate paper. Great fun! Looking to shoot Frontiersman in SASS meets.
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Offline Drydock

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Re: Paper Cartridge for cap and ball revolvers
« Reply #9 on: July 29, 2019, 05:37:07 pm »
I like to use roll printer paper, (think cash register) rolled around a wood dowel, glue stick.  Twist one end, pour in 20 grains 3f, drop a .375 ball dipped in Beeswax/olive oil lube on top, twist the other end closed.  At the range, bite off the powder twist, pour in the powder, shove the wadded paper and ball on top, ram home.  The ball seems to carry enough lube, and the wadded up paper gets blown out each shot.  Cigarette paper works even better, (no glue needed) but costs more.
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Offline will52100

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Re: Paper Cartridge for cap and ball revolvers
« Reply #10 on: September 28, 2019, 10:28:34 pm »
I love the Era's gone Johnston and Dow, both for making paper cartridges and with loose powder.  However, I'm thinking of ordering the Lee conical since I can get the mould in a 6 cavity and I don't load that many paper cartridges.  I despise double cavity moulds at the best of times and really wish Mark Hubs would offer his recreations in 6 cavity moulds as I'd love to have one for 36 and the dragoon bullet loos very interesting.
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