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Special Interests - Groups & Societies => The Barracks => Topic started by: Drydock on November 13, 2017, 06:46:22 pm

Title: The Trowel Bayonet: Better than it sounds?
Post by: Drydock on November 13, 2017, 06:46:22 pm
https://www.full30.com/video/fc8b64c1a7acb80d79015a706f3494a7?utm_source=system&utm_medium=email&utm_content=forgottenweapons&utm_campaign=subscribers
Title: Re: The Trowel Bayonet: Better than it sounds?
Post by: Coal Creek Griff on November 13, 2017, 10:21:28 pm
Trowel bayonets were used during the 1877 Battle of the Big Hole in Montana.  Remnants of the entrenchments are still visible at the site.  I've attached a photo I took in 2015.  The entrenchment isn't super easy to see, but it is also market with flags by archeologists.

Of the two bayonets up for auction, I think that I'd have to take the one with the free rifle.

CC Griff
Title: Re: The Trowel Bayonet: Better than it sounds?
Post by: Pitspitr on November 15, 2017, 10:14:55 am
They were also issued at Fort Hartsuff. Capt. (Bvt. Col.) Coppinger wasn't very impressed by them.

I've had 2 trapdoors with barrels bent in front of the upper barrel band and the one appears to have been from using a trowel bayonet improperly.
Title: Re: The Trowel Bayonet: Better than it sounds?
Post by: 1961MJS on November 15, 2017, 01:37:53 pm
Hi

My not all that mechanical grand dad had a collection of short handled round nosed shovels from trying to pry up roots.  The other grandpa was much more mechanical and had one long handled, very sharp round nosed shovel.  Just don't see a shovel bayonet being a good concept.

Later Y'all
Title: Re: The Trowel Bayonet: Better than it sounds?
Post by: St. George on November 15, 2017, 04:29:34 pm
It wasn't - troops hated them - both styles - that's why when they're found, they're generally in great shape.

They do make a neat accessory - like the little-issued Krag Bayonet does - but the one thing they all seemed to like - whether issued the Trapdoor or the Krag - was the Model 1880 'Hunting Knife'.

'Those' you can find having been sharpened, because the troopers were using them.

Scouts Out!
Title: Re: The Trowel Bayonet: Better than it sounds?
Post by: kwilliams1876 on November 16, 2017, 03:08:42 pm
just wondering how many bulged barrels are out there from a plug of dirt in the the muzzle? surely the idea was over looked by a few 1st. sergeants after the "dig".
Title: Re: The Trowel Bayonet: Better than it sounds?
Post by: Drydock on November 16, 2017, 03:43:17 pm
The Sgt's would have been too busy telling the troopers to take the Frickin bayonet off the rifle, you do not use it that way.  Though I'm sure some tried, thus Pitspitr's bent barrels.  That was probably the biggest reason the army quickly moved away from the idea.  Though, as the video explains, used as intended it's not that bad an idea.
Title: Re: The Trowel Bayonet: Better than it sounds?
Post by: pony express on November 16, 2017, 05:55:51 pm
I expect that in most Indian fighting, a bayonet that could be used as for digging would have been more useful than one for "sticking" the enemy. Just doesn't seem to me that there would be many bayonet charges in that type of fighting.
Title: Re: The Trowel Bayonet: Better than it sounds?
Post by: Niederlander on November 16, 2017, 05:56:42 pm
As I understand it, the Army strictly forbid their use as a digging implement while on the end of a rifle.  Of course, Privates (and Lance Corporals) being what they are..............
Title: Re: The Trowel Bayonet: Better than it sounds?
Post by: Drydock on November 17, 2017, 05:55:52 pm
The most fascinating part of the video to me is the opinions of the officers at the time (early 1870s) that considered the bayonet obsolete, wanted to get rid of it, and thus were willing to try this.