I had my local gun shop order a Taylors 56-50 Spencer Rifle back in early June. I'd been debating ordering one all spring with a fellow member of my Civil War reenactment group and had finally saved up enough money for a down payment. Not to be out done, Terry ordered himself a 56-50 Carbine a few days later. Of course, his carbine showed up a week later while I waited on backorder until the middle of September. Oh well, at least by that time I'd already paid the thing off so no need for the stores lay-a-way policy and had coughed up the cash for a set of dies, a Lyman mould, and 100 pieces of brass.
Between blanks and live rounds, I've fired around 700 shots from my Spencer.
As far as the reenacting thing goes, neither of us really have much use for one, portraying CS infantry. I can deal with the cost/difficulty of obtaining 56-50 blanks for one or two events per year. Ninety five percent of the time I'm either shooting live rounds out of mine or its sitting on display at a living history event. Without going into long after action reports, I will say reenacting with a repeating rifle after using a single shot for the past 8 years is great except for the magazine running empty at inopportune moments! That and even 150 rounds of blanks disappears in short order. Forty rounds for a muzzle loader will usually be more than enough for the average "battle".
The over all fit and finish of the Spencer is great. The stock seemed rather dry when I bought it and the red stain they used began to rub off in the wrist area and forearm after one rang visit. I ended up stripping that off with denatured alcohol and refinishing the bare wood several coats of a 50/50 mix of boiled linseed oil and turpentine. The stock has some nice figure to it and looks much closer to the stocks I've seen on original Spencer's in decent condition. The case hardening looks nice and the trigger pull was good enough not to bother fiddling with.
Every Italian replica firearm I've dealt with has had issues and the Spencer was no exception.
It would be nice if Armi Sport could use screws on the bridle of the lock and firing pin plate that don't work themselves loose during use! The problem was cured easily enough with some locktite but, its irritating that I have to deal with something so silly on a $1400 rifle.
The extractor raised a burr in the chamber right at the end of the cut in the barrel for the extractor. I first noticed that when some of the plastic blanks I was practicing cycling through the action were being extracted with a 1/4" long scratch right down the middle of them. I removed a paper thin sliver of metal with a file and have not had trouble since.
Has anyone else noticed the breechblock wearing a groove on either side of the receiver right where it transitions from being curved to flat as the action is closed?
One of the hooks where the mainspring engages the stirrup on the tumbler broke after around 600 rounds so I had to order a new one under warranty. Oh well, not the first time I've had a mainspring break. I figure once the rifle is out of warranty I'll order a spare spring or two, firing pin etc to keep on hand. That way when something breaks, I'll have the parts on hand but will have forgotten where I stashed them. At least that's usually how things work.
As far as live rounds go I've been using the Lyman bullet as cast lubed with a 50/50 mix of beeswax and vegetable shortening (unflavored!) over 40 grains of Pyrodex RS with CCI large rifle primers. With an overall length of 1.555" I've only jammed the action a few times and think that can be blamed on my not cycling it briskly enough.
The sights are not great by modern standards but, work well enough. I deepened the notch in the rear sight with a needle file. The front sight was way too tall. At 50 yards I was having to aim above the target to bring my shots on paper as the rifle was shooting low, way low. Was aiming at 6 o'clock. I filed down both the blade and base of the right, firing 3 shot groups every few strokes of the file. The top of my sight is now where the bottom of the old one used to be. It looks to be nearly identical in height to the sight on an original rifle I got to look at a couple of weeks ago. My groups are averaging 2-3" at 50 yards. Forty grains of GOEX 2FFG also looked promising when I tried 20 rounds with that load several weeks ago. I doubt I'll be shooting the Spencer much more this year unless the weather warms up. Shooting in the cold is fine but, standing in a cold garage cleaning both rifle and brass is not much fun.
I was in Upstate NY in early October where one of my Uncles owns a 90 acre piece of land. I found a place selling basket ball sized pumpkins for a dollar and found that they make great targets. They can take 5 or 6 shots before there is not much left to shoot at. Old bricks and cinder blocks also make good targets. I saw several groundhogs on the drive up along I-81 but any living on the farm were smart enough to remain hidden. Darn!
Blanks. I bought 200 of the plastic ones that Dixie Gunworks sells at $20/50. I'll rate these as being acceptable but nothing to get excited over either. I had to place them nose first in the chuck of my cordless drill and bevel the base with a file so the magazine tube would slide over them. Other than that, they feed through the magazine fine. I loaded them with a 209 primer and 5 grains of 3fffg. Loaded full of powder they tend to split. I consider them good for one more use, closing the mouth of the case with green floral foam. I had to borrow a ram rod a couple of times in a "battle" where the case broke and left part of it in the chamber requiring that it be pushed out. They make enough of a bang that I would not risk firing off a couple in the backyard without inviting a visit from the police but, are not the most impressive sounding things in the world either.
I also got instructions for making brass blanks from 45-70 brass. They are time consuming to make, only want to cycle through the action about 85% of time but, when loaded with 25 grains of 2ffg will ring your ears upon firing. I'm getting some gas blowback into the action with these so its a wise move to keep my hand well forward of the action. It also makes cleaning the rifle lots of fun. If I open the action slowly, I can easily pick the spent round from the action and pocket it for reuse. I think I'll use the brass blanks for living history demonstrations and the plastic ones that I'm not as worried about loosing for battle reenactments. I'm not planning on using the Spencer for but one or 2 fights a year as it is.
I surprises me that Starline is not offering reusable 56-50 brass cases for blanks formed along the lines of the Dixie Plastic Cases. Even priced at say $1.25 each I bet they could sell a bunch of them. I can't be the only one with a 56-50 Spencer that would like to use some good sounding, safe, brass blanks from time to time without going through all sorts of time and money creating their own.
I did see that Midway USA sells reloading dies with pilot holes pre drilled in them used for making custom die sets. I'm thinking that perhaps drill bits in sizes corresponding to the good cycling plastic blanks could be found and a forming die created with aid of a drill press that would easily make cases for blanks from perhaps .50-70 or .500 Linebaugh brass. The main issue seems to be besides overall length, is that nose of the case must be rounded so it clears the extractor and slides into the chamber easily but, not so closed up that the burning powder blows it back open.
I might give that idea a try next year.
The Blakeslee Box that Blockade Runner sells for $100 does not strike me as the highest quality leather good in the world but, works well enough. Or at least I can't see spending $200 or more on an item that I'll be using infrequently when the $100 one seems to be doing the job ok.
Enough on the Spencer for one day.
Stephen
Stephen,
Thank you very much for a very interesting and easy reading post! Do you have any comments regarding the Armi Sport Spencer sights which usually bring out discussion/concern from new Spencer shooters. Accuracy??? acceptable??? and at what distance?
Very much appreciate your comments. Happy Holidays!
Two Flints
Those damn screws on the side of the breech block are an abomination...
Was your firing pin block blue'd or just case hardened? I have now talked to 3 different shooters who had the exact same problem as me... soft firing pin block was peening and causing shallow strikes on the primers. (I fixed mine... others just order a new block at $60)
As far as the loading mechanism gauling the inside of the reciever, its not uncommon. Use a honing stone in that area and then apply a heavy coating of mil-tec1 and heat it up with a hair dryer. That should help.
I have been waiting 3 months now for a replacement main spring from Taylors... don't feel bad.
I thinned out my main spring on the bottom and just lightly on the top. (very little on the top) My trigger is MUCH better. Also have a look at the "Often Inquired About" section. I loosened some screws and tightened others and Loctite is my best friend. ;)
These things are not PERFECT when they come from the factory... that much I know. But, they get better with use and after a breakin period, and some upkeep, they settle into a VERY reliable gun.
I've been holding 2-3" inch groups with it from the bench at 50 yards. The doofus behind the buttplate looses concentration now and then and will end up with a "flyer" enlarging things. In any event I'm pleased with the accuracy. I'm sure more practice would help me out. If I must fire nothing but one hole groups, thats what my BSA 12/15 .22 target rifle is for.
The sights, as nearly everyone has noted are less that ideal. The main issue being that the notch in the rear sight with the elevator in the down position is so shallow that it might as well not exist. I took a needle file and made the notch a bit wider and cut it as deep as I dared to go without cutting into the screw. That helped. I still can't say that they are the best things in the world, but should do. I can't see myself shooting much past 100 yards with it anyways.
Stephen
Dear 1816flintlock:
Thanks for the info. I just got a .56-50 ArmiSport Spencer from Dixie Gun Works and also purchased some of their plastic blanks. My plastic blanks also were not accepted by the magazine follower and I may try beveling the edges of mine as you did. They were also a good bit longer than the Ten-X .56-50 live rounds, which cycled well. The plastic blanks also seemed to have a slightly larger head diameter, hence the feeding problem.
I am having a real problem with the lever jamming when I try to push it back up. Any suggestiions?
Irish Dragoon.
Problems with Lever Jamming...
I'm guessing as to the cause - but the Spencer likes to double feed, especially really light things like blanks.
Q1) Is the jam caused by a double-feed on the second round, or a interrupted feed on the first round out of the tube?
Q2) Double-feed: Are you working the action 'sharply'? As the block rises when you close the lever, you're racing the spring to catch the next round and NOT catch the second. With pointed bullets, this is eashy, but with shorter, flat-nosed blanks and CF rounds, its a race.
Q3) Interrupted Feed: Does this feed with just one round in the tube? If not you're probably looing at an OAL issue, or an 'ogive' issue; If the block rises into the back end of the next round, then it's either stopping on something too soon (ogive/curve on the nose problem) or its just too long (OAL).
'Hope this helps a little.
Great report Stephen. I use a .44 Russian for Reenacting and will second the need for more ammo. Prior to the spencer, I had a smith and with 40 rounds, I would come back in with extra ammo in my pouch. Of course, on horseback, most or our shots are with pistol.
Once I got the Spencer, I used it when the rest of the group was shooting their pistol and when they switched to carbine. It is kinda neet riding at a canter and pulling the lever on the Spencer and shooting again when they least expect it. I carry a homemade blakeslee loader with about 56 rounds, about 20 loose in my hip pouch and about 130 in a larger (homemade) blakeslee loader attached to my saddle. I usually come back empty. From studying Wilson's raid on Selma, I shoot more in one two hour reenactment than they carried for the whole raid. I guess if we want to be period correct, we would dump the extra pistols and limit our battle to about 20 - 30 rounds, but then what would I do with all those blanks I make through the winter?
Bead Swinger:
It jams when it is EMPTY. I CAN, however, easily get the breechblock to go back up if I push the breechblock itself (NOT the lever) from the FRONT. Still, you shouldn't have to do that.
Irish Dragoon,
I had a similar problem whereby the block would not move back up into the receiver. It seemed to be catching on one of the ends of the block at the receiver opening. What worked for me was I removed the block spring and pushed the two ends towards each other (decompressing?? the spring). What I did was put each end inside my palms and just brought my open hands towards each other; had to do it several times to get the correct ??decompression of the spring; maybe I was just shortening the spring without actually cutting it?? But, it worked for me and now when I work the action the block moves into the receiver without any problems.
Two Flints
I bought a Taylor spencer rifle back in october and took it to 3 reenactments and the hunk of junk started misfiring using both brass and plastic blanks. After taking apart the block I found the firing pin mushroomed and slide behind it all boogered up! The action was never as smooth as my original Rifle and the mag. retaining clip screw kept working loose! After trying to get parts for it and no one having any I traded it out of frustration for some mule harness. Seems like you pay $1500 for a rifle you would get better a better rifle .Oh well Ill just stick to my henry till they work the bugs out. :'(
Hello wildersbgd,
No need to read the same comments twice, so I deleted one :( of the posts.
Did you contact Taylor's for a possible return of your rifle? Did you buy it from them originally or one of their dealers? A return of the rifle to the seller, since it is still under warranty, would have been my course of action? Who did you contact for replacement parts? I think any bad parts you had were still under warranty.
Did you modify your Spencer rifle in any way to void the warranty?
The Armi Sports Spencer has it problems and this has been discussed on SSS.
Not sure what else I can write, but for $1500.00 I would have contacted the seller to make things right, or as right as I could, unless I had done something to the rifle to void the warranty.
Two Flints