C and B Revolver Loading Preferances

[Dick Dastardly]

The new batch of EPP-UG bullet molds drop bullets with a smaller rebate than the first batch.  So for my ROAs, I don't have to load either them or the DD/ROA bullets backwards.  They load very easily frontwards just as they were intended.

Some 44 Cal front stuffers have chambers smaller than .450 at the mouths.  Next time I order a batch of EPP-UG or DD/ROA molds I'm going to specify a .447" rebate.  The ROAs won't benefit from this, but a lot of undersize chambered 58s will.

FWIW, my brace of open top 60s load both Big Lube™ C&B designs easily with no problems.

DD-DLoS

[Big Matt]

Sorry to tack onto this thread, but this is the first time I've seen mention of lubed boolits for the C&B guns.  I'm brand new to C&B. 

I recently bought a used Navy Arms imported Uberti 1851 Army (I think) - It's a .44 caliber with a brass frame and non-engraved cylinder.  The profile matches the 1851 navy exactly.  Based on the proof stamps, it was manufactured in 1972.

How do I determine which diameter bullet to order?  I'd like to try some of these.

[Cactus Cris]

Been shooting C&B exclusive for 10yrs. I use a dental irrigation syringe filled with my lube mix to put lube over the ball after loading.  Keeps the fouling soft and sparks can't get past it.  Can send the link to where you can get them via email.

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[Capt. JEB]

I put powder in all, then wad in all then ball in all.

I just leave one cone {nipple} out so it is real easy to see the empty cylinder for me and saftey officers. I just carry the spare nipples in a old cap tin so if there is a stage with a reload I put them in and go.

[will52100]

Best bet is to mike your chambers, you'll probably need .454 round balls, the bigger the better that you can ram home.  The more lead shaved off(with-in reason) the better the seal, the more rifling contact.

I haven't tried DD's cap and ball conicles, but have had great luck with the other big lube offerings.  I cast my conicles from Lee moulds and they work great.  I've had to open the loading port a hair on a couple, nothing a little time with a file or dremal and a Q-tip of cold blue doesn't fix.  I pan lube them with a mix of tallow, bee's wax and parrifin.  I love them, the base is a couple thou smaller than the lube groves and the base slides rite in and makes seating square pretty easy.

[Montana Slim]

I'm a bit ol' fashion, I reckon. I use the rammer that came on the revolver 
My 1860s and NM 1863 get 25 gr FFF and a SOFT, .454 Round ball (thats at least 2 thousandths over sized for the chamber).
My Dragoon gets 40 gr of FF and the same .454 ball.
best practice is to charge a chamber with powder, then ram a ball home. repeat.
A tight-fitting (soft lead, oversize) ball is all that is needed to completely seal the chamber.
I add a over-ball lube to keep the bore-fouling soft.

Cleanup with soap/water followed with a water-displacing lube (I use WD-40).
Been doing it this way since I was a boy.

Proper fitting caps, and your GTG.
Regards,
Slim

[Leo Tanner]

Again, this has been great!
     Lots of techniques to try and see what works for me.  It ain't Christmas yet, so I don't have the gun in my hands, but when I do I won't be going in blind.

     One more question just for historical sake...does anyone know how this was commonly done in the field when these revolvers were actualy used in the service?  If the Army was anything back then like it is now, weapons handling is drilled with specific proceedure.  Not that there aren't better ways to do it now, but I'm curious.

     Thanks again to all.


Leo

[Dalton Masterson]

Paper cartridges were common back in the day. Some of the others will have a nice link to how to make them I am sure. My link is gone. DM

[Capt. JEB]

What Dalton said...

usually the cylinders were loaded in camp or barracks. In battle cylinders were changed out, if there was time. A lot of your Confederate Cavalry carried mutiple revolvers.

[Fox Creek Kid]

What Dalton said...

usually the cylinders were loaded in camp or barracks. In battle cylinders were changed out, if there was time. A lot of your Confederate Cavalry carried mutiple revolvers.

I've never seen a primary historical document evidencing that any soldier switched cylinders in battle. These guns were issued with ONE cylinder per Army regs. Regular soldiers were not issued revolvers, only cavalry & officers mainly. Guerillas did what is termed today a "New York" reload, i.e., grabbed another loaded revolver as it's impossible to switch cylinders on a moving horse with Colt style revolvers.

[Leo Tanner]

I imagine there was a lot of weapon scavanging going on at such close quarters.


Leo

[hellgate]

I'm with Fox Creek Kid: I've never come across any references to swapping out loaded cylinders to reload C&B revolvers during warfare or shootouts. I'm now wishing that scene from Pale Rider where Eastwood swaps out a Remington cylinder during the final shootout never was filmed. If you needed more shooting you brought along another fully loaded revolver or pulled out a big knife that many carried. One of the reasons we spend so much time on these forums discussing how we cope with fouling is because the guns were never designed to be shot more than six times. They were shot dry and then put away. When they were designed people were so happy to get SIX shots in a row that a fast reload was never a consideration of the inventer. Remember the predecessor to the six shooter was a single shot patched round ball gun. Once they got a six shooter it was figured that things would be settled by the time the gun was empty. There may be the occasional presentation case with a spare cylinder but it was unlikely intended to substitute for a second gun.

Think of it. If bullets are whizzing around you and whoever is trying to kill you is clearly near,  you want another loaded gun to pull not a cylinder you have to knock the gun apart to install while he's drawing down on you. Just pull another gun and blam the guy, end of fight (or RUN LIKE HELL!).

[Capt. JEB]

While not a historical drama, fairly accurate though watch Gettysburg.

It is not during battle per say, but between Confederate charges the union officer swaps out cylinders on a Colt revolver.

There were issue cylinder holders and I believe the Pattersons originally came with two cylinders with the intent of being able to change cylinders during a lull in action as reloading a cylinder was not feasible, time wise.

I would say it was more expedient to carry multiple guns.  or RUN!!!

[Fox Creek Kid]

...Remember the predecessor to the six shooter was a single shot patched round ball gun...

Going to a six shooter from a caplock single shot for 19th century people must have been like us going from rabbit ears to a satellite dish!! 

Jeb, no offense but Hollywood movies are just that, movies and hardly a primary historical source. "Ride With the Devil" showed cylinder changes as well, but just like Bruce Willis 20 mag change shootouts & zombies, it's Hollywood.

[Noz]

In most cases the revolver was considered a "back up" to the sabre. In use, you dumped 6 shots into the oncoming enemy and dropped the gun and drew the sabre.

[Fairshake]

I was given a 58 in 71 by the owner of the gun store that I worked at. He gave me everything needed to load and fire the gun.I was so excited to go out that first Sunday and shoot the gun. Well after just two cylinders of firing, I looked at him and said "Now I know why the cowboys in the old movies that I watched growing up would always throw the gun at the other one when it was empty".

[Leo Tanner]

That's why I plan on always bringing the cartrige guns too on a trip the range.  I can save the 51 as a grand finnaly.   I'll probably get more serious about reloading Holy Black cartiges too so there'll be lots of smoke for the afternoon.  My loading bench should be complete by the first of the year.


Leo

[Leo Tanner]

OK, nother question cause now I'm gettin nitpicky (I have the gun now).
     Sprue facing the powder or the muzzel?  Read about it being done both ways an some don't seem ta care as long as it's not contacting the chamber wall.  Proponents for facing it toward the powder say the bullet will fly truer, those who say to have it face the barrel don't give a reason.  I'm guessing it's so they can ensure it did not turn sideways. 
     Hornaday balls don't have a sprue, but I am wanting to cast at home so I will have to deal with this sooner or later.
   
      Hope you all had a great holiday!  Thanks in advance,


Leo

[hellgate]

Whenever accuracy tests on deformed bullets are done the results show that deformations of the BASE of the bullet more readily affect accuracy than deformations of the tip of the bullet. The test I have seen involved jacketed bullets with filing or gouging being done to one end or the other of the bullet. If I have the time I try to put the sprue UP but I doubt there is any measureable difference at our ranges with the ROUND BALL plus, I use a lube wad under the ball so there is likely no affect of the muzzle blast on the ball as it exits the barrel as would occur with a naked ball. Because of the wads I just drop the ball in any old which way and ram 'em. If I miss at 7 yards it my own fault for not aiming.

It would be nice to get a comment from a skirmisher that shoots C&B in the accuracy matches. Now, there'd be a valid opinion as to whether the ball placement has much of an effect. My guess is for the real matches they use swaged balls and for practice their own cast ones but I have never attended a N/SSA shoot so I'd like to know what the accuracy boys do o wring out every last bit of accuracy besides the gunsmithing/accurizing.

[Fingers McGee]

Whenever accuracy tests on deformed bullets are done the results show that deformations of the BASE of the bullet more readily affect accuracy than deformations of the tip of the bullet. The test I have seen involved jacketed bullets with filing or gouging being done to one end or the other of the bullet. If I have the time I try to put the sprue UP but I doubt there is any measureable difference at our ranges with the ROUND BALL plus, I use a lube wad under the ball so there is likely no affect of the muzzle blast on the ball as it exits the barrel as would occur with a naked ball. Because of the wads I just drop the ball in any old which way and ram 'em. If I miss at 7 yards it my own fault for not aiming.

It would be nice to get a comment from a skirmisher that shoots C&B in the accuracy matches. Now, there'd be a valid opinion as to whether the ball placement has much of an effect. My guess is for the real matches they use swaged balls and for practice their own cast ones but I have never attended a N/SSA shoot so I'd like to know what the accuracy boys do o wring out every last bit of accuracy besides the gunsmithing/accurizing.

+1

I don't pay that much attention to where the sprue nub is.  Some of the balls I use just have a slight flat spot anyhow.

Fingers (Show Me MO smoke) McGee