Special Interests - Groups & Societies > Shotguns
Change barrel Winchester 1897
McCrower:
--- Quote from: Abilene on October 02, 2021, 05:42:04 PM --- Howdy McCrower. You mentioned it being an import barrel. Chinese? I'm not certain but think those threads will be different unless possibly the TTN brand?
Edit: just occurred to me those chinese guns were all solid frame, so probably not one of those.
--- End quote ---
Barrel bought in the US, www.classicoldwesternarms.com :)
McCrower:
--- Quote from: Professor Marvel on October 02, 2021, 04:58:52 PM ---My Good Monsiuer McCrower
Hei, hvordan har du det?
It looks like the old barrel does not line up either? Or am I confused?
How good are your skills at hand fitting machine parts?
That will decide if you need a gunsmith.
You will need to measure the threads and shoulders of the old barrel and compare to the new barrel.
Without seeing the parts, I would "guess" that you may need to take "a little" off the shoulder of the new barrel to allow it to turn further.
If this does not make sense , you may need the help of a gunSmith or machinist.
I can offer one or two people who might be able to advise you, one is a skilled machinist in Sweden the other fellow is a black powder shooter in ( I think) Norway.
Hope this helps
Prof Marvel
--- End quote ---
Takk Professor Marvel. Jeg har det bra, hvordan har du det? :)
I understand your confusion about the old barrel. The extension on the old barrel lines up if proper tools are used. It's an old shotgun, from 1912, I have used it for years. So when the barrel got a serious dent, I had to fabricate tools for getting the old extension off. See image.
But is seems like the old extension on the new barrel is to tight to get lined up, even if I use tools. I'm afraid to tighten too much, and to break the old extension. Impossible to get hold of parts for a 97 in Norway, and very expensive to buy from the US for me.
I makes a lot of sense what you are saying about taking off some metal on the new barrels shoulder, my thoughs exactly too :)
Great if you know someone in Norway that could help me.
McCrower
Professor Marvel:
Hilsen Herregud McCrower -
Jeg gjør det bedre enn jeg burde!
First, let us ask the Winchester 1897 Takedown specialists here and make sure we are headed in the right
direction.
However, based on the what I have managed to do and learn so far, the fitting of a threaded barrel (takedown or otherwise)
almost always involves slowly and carefully fitting the shoulder of the barrel to the frame so that the final fraction
of a turn (often only 1/16 or 1/32 of a turn) brings the sights to vertical without too much force. This holds true
for most all barrels, whether shotgun, rifle, or revolver.
Let us hope some Win '97 specialists chime in, and I will reach out to my Swedish and Norwegian friends
and see what they say.
Oh, and I need to make sure that Len (in Norway) is actually still alive!!! I have not heard
from him since Covid started...
I cannot rememeber what town in Sweden my machinist friend is in, but recently he has been
rebuilding a lot of "basket case" percussion guns, using his TIG welder, large metal lathe, and large milling machine.
He is getting particularly good at rebuilding percussion rrevolvers and breechloading percussion rifle, with the
intention of obtaining the best possible lockup and accuracy so as to use them in target matches!
I won't bother my Finnish friend, he would probably shout "perkele" and throw his beer at me LOL .
please "stand by" and we will see what kind of help we can get for you!
Med Vennlig Hilsen
Professor Marvel
Advertising:
Professor Marvel:
My Good McCrower -
I did a little research and have some bad news, it seems the Winchester 1897 is
one of the more difficult shotguns to fit a barrel.
fitting an 1897 barrel:
https://www.shotgunworld.com/threads/winchester-97-barrel-question.195389/
re takedown adjustment
https://www.shotgunworld.com/threads/win-12-97-takedown-adjustment.138067/
interesting thread about tools required
https://www.gunpartscorp.com/forum/shot-guns/shotguns/i-have-a-winchester-97-takedown-back-end-and-a-model-12-barrel-212338
here is a good discussion:
https://www.thehighroad.org/index.php?threads/question-re-vintage-winchester-model-12-barrel-swap.831550/
note the comment from user Crawdad1
snip----------------------------------------
" You couldn't get a repeating shotgun that is more difficult to swap barrels.
You'll need special tools and probably a lathe to do this.
Good luck.
Crawdad1, Jan 22, 2018 "
endsnip----------------------------------------
and from CoalTrain:
snip-------------------------------------------
Model 12's were certainly the Cadillac of pump shotguns. One of the reasons they were discontinued in the 60's was the 870 was just a simpler, more useful and less expensive design. I have a 97 that was the fore runner of the 12. I have several barrels for it and have changed them a few times. Both of my barrels have extensions on them as the gun was fitted at the factory for both barrels. I know this because the receiver and barrels have the same SN.
If you find another barrel you will want the extension that goes with it or find an extension to put on it. That isn't going to be easy. Once you have the barrel and extension a smith is going to be needed to mate them together to fit your receiver. The extension has to be on the new barrel and properly mated to the receiver before a barrel swap can be made. You are correct in thinking you don't want to remove the extension from your short barrel. If you remove it your barrel becomes useless until it's extension is again properly fitted to the barrel and receiver. That requires a special barrel wrench and some skill
....
Last edited: Jan 23, 2018
CoalTrain49, Jan 23, 2018
endsnip--------------------------------------------
finally, from a gunsmith who does this A LOT
https://www.shotgunworld.com/threads/model-12-barrel-replacement.129927/
it sounds like it is not a job for the amature gunsmith!
snip------------------------------
Your first problem would be to unscrew the extension without damage, and then fit it to the new barrel, but the bead has to be on top,
so lathe work is almost a given. Then it needs to have the fit into the frame made proper, and the adjusting sleeve that you have will
probably not work right, either.
Then you need to make sure that the barrel chamber aligns with the specially mated chamber ring that we hope hasn't been overly
cut large or offset to fit the aftermarket barrel, or else you need one of those to be fit, also.
Parts possibly needed: adjusting sleeve, chamber ring
Tools possibly needed: chamber ring fitting set
Tools almost certainly needed: barrel extension wrench, lathe
Experience is necessary to minimize the possibility of ruination of something, and lucky amateurs will have a loose barrel and/or
one that doesn't extract, and may feed with difficulty with a mis-aligned chamber.
Yes, I am a Model-12 specialist, and have plenty of spare parts.
Right now I have just posted a Black Diamond Model-12 for parts salvage, but if someone wants to get the complete set, realize
that the frame has been battered to the point of being useless without a rebuild. This has very nice figure in the wood and a solid rib
30" full barrel. I would rather fit all of the parts to a replacement frame from the Nickel Steel era, and use the matching extension
that hopefully was with the frame.
...
kirbythegunsmith@hotmail.com
endsnip-------------------------------------------
let us see if our members have any other opinions and I will check with my Scandanavian friends.
best regards
Prof Marvel
Coffinmaker:
I would be more inclined to make up a mandrel and remove the dent from the original barrel. Or cut the original barrel behind the dent, depending on how far back the dent is.
Coffinmaker
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