Author Topic: Clone "build" types  (Read 49099 times)

Offline Abilene

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Re: Clone "build" types
« Reply #40 on: September 12, 2012, 09:32:31 PM »
Just thought of another.  Texas Longhorn Arms.

Offline Harley Starr

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Re: Clone "build" types
« Reply #41 on: September 12, 2012, 11:37:16 PM »
American Western Arms Ultimate 1873.
"I went out there"
"In search of experience"
"To taste and to touch"
"And to feel as much"
"As a man can"
"Before he repents"
Johnny Cash-- The Wanderer

Offline sack peterson

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Re: Clone "build" types
« Reply #42 on: September 13, 2012, 08:44:06 AM »
TLA is a unique beast.  As a scholarly matter, I’d say it’s not really a clone, but a post modern, perfected single action.  I do understand that its cylinder frame blank was cast by Pine Tree Casting, IE, Ruger.

Just thinking in terms of frames and components, AWA ultimate is a Pietta build.  They are rightfully said to be made in America, but Pietta renders the raw components.

Offline CraigC

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Re: Clone "build" types
« Reply #43 on: September 24, 2012, 11:11:08 AM »
IMHO, if you're gonna count TLA, then you have to count every other single action revolver manufacturer. They made some fixed sight guns that looked like Colt SAA's but as far as I know, all of Grover's guns were on a large, .44Mag sized frame. They were also mirror image guns with the loading gate and ejector on the wrong side.  ;)

Same for the big J.P. Sauer and Herter's sixguns. Similar but larger. Different enough to NOT consider them a Colt SAA replica.
Graveyard Jack SASS #81,827

Offline llanerosolitario

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Re: Clone "build" types
« Reply #44 on: February 20, 2016, 11:20:31 AM »
I would add the clones made by the basque manufacturers from the 1881's until well into the XX century, until the 1920's.

So I would add:


-Larra?aga, Garate y Compa?ia

-Garate y Compa?iaa (sucessors).

-Garate e Hijos (Garate and son).

-Hermanos Quintana (a Mexican gun dealer importing Colts 1873 clones and later making them in their own factory in Spain).

-Anitua y  Charola.

-Orbea Hermanos y Compa?ia

You can see some of them here:

http://www.catalogacionarmas.com/public/30-colt-1.pdf


http://www.catalogacionarmas.com/public/31-colt-2.pdf


they even patented later a simplified  version of the COLT SAA, with one piece frame and two screws for mechanism, known as "Sistema COLT´S (reformado)".


Some of these revolvers were of good quality, others so so. Orbea at that time was the largest factory making pistols in SPAIN, so not all of the mentioned above were small manufacturers.


There were other brands in both Spain and Belgium making and selling these revolvers in Mexico and South America, so it was not the italians the firts ones making clones of the Colt SAA in the XX century ouside  the USA.


In the late XIX century and the begining of the XX there was a big market in Mexico for firearms of affordable prices, so I would assume that many revolvers that we see in photos of the Mexican Revolution, could, in fact, not be Colts, but european clones of basque and Belgian origin.

The market was big in Argentina also, thought this was no place for the Colt SAA, but fot the Smith clones.

With a certain dismay, I have seen some respected authors writing reference  books  about  Colt clones where they fail to recognize Garates,  Orbeas, etc as spanish commercial revolvers, labelling them as "of unknown origin", despite being clearly marked with Orbea or Garate Hermanos logo, or with spanish and  basque legends in the  barrels,  which shows that even expert authors  can make mistakes when it comes to investigate guns made in a foreign non english speaking country.

many revolvers deliberately included  barrels legends in English or Spanish, mentioning Colt or Winchester cartridges, in order to fool potential buyers into thinking that they were buying the original product. Most users would not speak english but would surely recognize  the words "Colt" or " Winchester".

all the best

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Re: Clone "build" types
« Reply #45 on: Today at 07:49:22 AM »

Offline Abilene

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Re: Clone "build" types
« Reply #45 on: February 20, 2016, 05:26:05 PM »
Very interesting!  Thanks for the info and the links.

Offline llanerosolitario

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Re: Clone "build" types
« Reply #46 on: February 20, 2016, 06:49:24 PM »
you are welcome.

we must admit that it is really difficult to investigate about foreign guns when the info avaible is not in english...be it spanish gun makers, or russian, balkanic, etc...that is why not much has been written about these pre 1920´s clones and they remain unknown for most european and american gun enthusiasts and collectors, except in  Belgium and Spain.

 let me add that I have been told by a very important collector, here in SPAIN, who lived many years in Mexico, of several local gunsmiths in the Mexican area of PUEBLA, who made copies of american guns,  mainly of  the Colt 1873 and the  Winchesters 92 rifle, for the domestic market there, until the 1960´s.

Offline Virginia Gentleman

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Re: Clone "build" types
« Reply #47 on: February 23, 2017, 09:05:17 PM »
Many licensed and unlicensed copies of Colts, Winchesters and others were made all around the World.  The patents on the Colt SAA ran out long ago, so thankfully we have European manufacturers making them now.

Offline Abilene

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Re: Clone "build" types
« Reply #48 on: February 23, 2017, 09:38:58 PM »
I guess we can now add Standard to the clone list (yeah, Coffinmaker, I said "clone"  :D )

Offline Coffinmaker

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Re: Clone "build" types
« Reply #49 on: February 24, 2017, 12:05:50 PM »
Gadzooks but I hate that wurd  :(

Coffinmaker

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Re: Clone "build" types
« Reply #50 on: Today at 07:49:22 AM »

Offline llanerosolitario

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Re: Clone "build" types
« Reply #50 on: April 26, 2017, 04:22:41 AM »
The Argentinian Bisonte Revolver, made by Establecimientos Venturini, in Buenos Aires, Argentina, in 357 mg and 22 lr.

http://www.tirito.com.ar/Venta/ArmasCortas/html/Bisonte_CL13.htm


Revolver Forastero, in 22 lr, also made in Argentina


http://www.fullaventura.com/foro/viewtopic.php?t=6950

Offline willy

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Re: Clone "build" types
« Reply #51 on: December 21, 2017, 08:55:24 PM »
Allen Firearms

Offline Abilene

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Re: Clone "build" types
« Reply #52 on: December 21, 2017, 11:18:26 PM »

 

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