Cas City Forum Hall & CAS-L

Special Interests - Groups & Societies => The Barracks => Topic started by: pony express on October 21, 2018, 09:14:27 PM

Title: SAW reenacting event pictures.
Post by: pony express on October 21, 2018, 09:14:27 PM
I ran across this while scrolling down the Facebook page Sir Charles linked to in the Boer War Rifles thread:

https://www.facebook.com/FortMott/posts/1968139783204980

https://www.facebook.com/FortMott/posts/1970902782928680

Note the 2 sailors, wearing dixie cups resembling the one Grenadier shared the pic of.

Wonder where they got all those Rayadillo uniforms?
Title: Re: SAW reenacting event pictures.
Post by: smoke on October 22, 2018, 07:07:05 AM
Somewhere  I saw a link to a vendor for Spanish uniforms.  Think I saved it?  Nope. :'( 

Maybe it was here in a previous thread about the SAW.
Title: Re: SAW reenacting event pictures.
Post by: Doc Jackson on October 22, 2018, 07:27:14 AM
Talk about having your act together, they men and ladies really look the part, very dashing.
Title: Re: SAW reenacting event pictures.
Post by: smoke on October 22, 2018, 07:36:25 AM
They are some cool pics.  The Asian Spanish guy cracks me up.
Title: Re: SAW reenacting event pictures.
Post by: Grenadier on October 22, 2018, 12:04:02 PM
I know many of these guys from other eras of “Grown Men Playing War”. They are all top shelf when it comes to accurate portrayals.
Title: Re: SAW reenacting event pictures.
Post by: smoke on October 22, 2018, 12:28:20 PM
They do look good. 

I went to an event last month that could have used these guys.  There was one SPANAM guy and he was excellent.  A ww2 GI that was also.  The rest of the WW2 and later GI's were a soup sandwich.  Mixed era uniforms, half a uniform, long hair, goatees etc.  Civil war guys were pretty good.  Some very interesting units.  Other era's were pretty good.  Some good non-US ww2.  Marquis, Poles, etc.

Title: Re: SAW reenacting event pictures.
Post by: pony express on October 22, 2018, 07:33:16 PM
They are some cool pics.  The Asian Spanish guy cracks me up.

Spain owned the Philippines for 400 years, I expect a lot of Filipinos wore that Rayadillo. And than when the Spanish were gone, Aguinaldo's forces wore a similar uniform , fighting against us.



There's a vendor in Manila that makes the Spanish uniforms, but....he has a facebook page that hasn't been updated in years. Some swear by him, others at him....for really slow delivery.
Title: Re: SAW reenacting event pictures.
Post by: smoke on October 22, 2018, 08:41:19 PM
I think that they are reenacting the a battle in Puerto Rico, no the Philippines.

Spain was pretty racist and arrogant.  I doubt they would have had a native officer leading Spanish troops, native troops sure.

It's a hobby so they can do what they want to have fun but if they are intending to portray history at a public event, they need to get it right.

Same goes for guys who portray WW2 Japanese troops....no white guys need apply.

Title: Re: SAW reenacting event pictures.
Post by: smoke on October 22, 2018, 09:23:18 PM
I don't mean to give offense or criticize an other guys hobby.  If you want to reenact and run around the woods playing soldier, go for it.  Doesn't bother me in the least.  Sounds like a fun time.  Want to dress up and shoot guns...great!  I think this is the funnest shooting sport there is.  Want to dress all tactical and shoot guns....great!  Pick your hobby and have fun.

My biggest compliant is the guys who proclaim that they are honoring the vets and preserving history while presenting a picture to the public that is not in the least bit like it was.   Fat infantry men, women infantry men, old infantry men and the list goes on.   I realize that the average citizen is ignorant about history and doing a poor living history impression, furthers the ignorance.  It grinds my gears. >:(

I will climb down off of my soap box now. :-[

 
Title: Re: SAW reenacting event pictures.
Post by: pony express on October 23, 2018, 06:12:34 AM
I see your point about the old, fat, infantryman not really looking the part, but....I don't see a lot of young, fit, guys that are interested in doing it. So I'll just be an old infantryman nearing retirement, I guess. But at near 6'2 and 230lb, and white as I can be, I wouldn't try and portray an Asian, just wouldn't work.
Title: Re: SAW reenacting event pictures.
Post by: Pitspitr on October 23, 2018, 08:06:33 AM
Even when I was young and fit I was too big, or at least too tall.

As the former Coordinator for Living History and Volunteers at Fort Hartsuff, I know that from a park's perspective you're usually grateful for any volunteer you can get.  :-\

I too understand what you mean, I'm just not sure how you get around it.  ???
Title: Re: SAW reenacting event pictures.
Post by: Major 2 on October 23, 2018, 08:17:13 AM
I don't mean to give offense or criticize an other guys hobby.  If you want to reenact and run around the woods playing soldier, go for it.  Doesn't bother me in the least.  Sounds like a fun time.  Want to dress up and shoot guns...great!  I think this is the funnest shooting sport there is.  Want to dress all tactical and shoot guns....great!  Pick your hobby and have fun.

My biggest compliant is the guys who proclaim that they are honoring the vets and preserving history while presenting a picture to the public that is not in the least bit like it was.   Fat infantry men, women infantry men, old infantry men and the list goes on.   I realize that the average citizen is ignorant about history and doing a poor living history impression, furthers the ignorance.  It grinds my gears. >:(

I will climb down off of my soap box now. :-[

 

sure you did ...  

Sad fact is , I tend to agree


....I don't mean to give offense ...either !
Title: Re: SAW reenacting event pictures.
Post by: Pitspitr on October 23, 2018, 09:10:41 AM
Oh, I agree, I just don't know how you fix it especially given the limited resources most state parks have. Then throw in the PC BS they have to deal with and if you turned away a volunteer based on how they look, the park would be sued into closing.  ::)

Fortunately, when I worked at Fort Hartsuff all of my male volunteers were relatively trim, early middle aged or younger and the female volunteers wanted to sew and cook. Even so, we were all too big except for the early high school aged kids. Heck even my high school aged daughters were bigger than the average soldier of the IWP and they really aren't even that big by today's standards.
Title: Re: SAW reenacting event pictures.
Post by: Grenadier on October 23, 2018, 09:58:13 AM
I’m fortunate that I can find orignal uniforms from WW1 and later that fit but I tend to agree with Smoke on all points. I love playing soldier but I also realize that Billy Yank assaulting picnic shelter 14 and driving Johnny Reb back across then playground to the swimming pool is down right silly. Seeing a 60 year old confederate Santa Claus with three revolvers, Sharp’s and a Henry rifle is goofy but I understand he’s having fun just like me.
Title: Re: SAW reenacting event pictures.
Post by: Drydock on October 23, 2018, 10:39:13 AM
One of the reasons I like the SAW period is that the services at that time had a lot of old officers and senior enlisted.  Gray haired captains and sergeants were not that unusual.

BTW, that was done in Ft Mott, New Jersy!  The guy doing Vara del Ray looked damn good.
Title: Re: SAW reenacting event pictures.
Post by: Major 2 on October 23, 2018, 11:11:05 AM
and as I said I tend to agree.....

That's why I stopped retired hung up my saber...whatever, 20 years ago

to old, becoming too fat, to play mounted cavalry ... but there was a shinning time ...


30+ years  at it .... numerus invites to NPS, Chickamauga, Shiloh, to name two recurring , perhaps 10-12 films ...

I recall , a quote I heard from Ken Burns (PBS Filmmaker of some note) he said something to the point:
" he did not thing too much of Reenactors ( many were hired as background ) as they were too old & too fat to portray a CW combatant "  

Though he was correct ...it did not stop the backlash and retorts...

One in particular " that particular reenactor with a very good kit took offence ....

His reply " there was also one too many scrawny, lousy acting,  yankee gay filmmaker, in cameo roll  as well ! "  ;D
Title: Re: SAW reenacting event pictures.
Post by: smoke on October 23, 2018, 11:42:42 AM
Even when I was young and fit I was too big, or at least too tall.

As the former Coordinator for Living History and Volunteers at Fort Hartsuff, I know that from a park's perspective you're usually grateful for any volunteer you can get.  :-\

I too understand what you mean, I'm just not sure how you get around it.  ???

I'm not sure either.  I do understand the "any volunteer is better than no volunteer" thing.
Title: Re: SAW reenacting event pictures.
Post by: smoke on October 23, 2018, 11:47:30 AM
sure you did ...  

Sad fact is , I tend to agree


....I don't mean to give offense ...either !

I really did not mean to offend anyone but yes I was critiquing/criticizing them.  Again, any gun hobby is a good hobby but when interacting with the public, a higher standard is called for. 

Title: Re: SAW reenacting event pictures.
Post by: smoke on October 23, 2018, 11:51:24 AM
Oh, I agree, I just don't know how you fix it especially given the limited resources most state parks have. Then throw in the PC BS they have to deal with and if you turned away a volunteer based on how they look, the park would be sued into closing.  ::)

Fortunately, when I worked at Fort Hartsuff all of my male volunteers were relatively trim, early middle aged or younger and the female volunteers wanted to sew and cook. Even so, we were all too big except for the early high school aged kids. Heck even my high school aged daughters were bigger than the average soldier of the IWP and they really aren't even that big by today's standards.

I have been to a number of places recently that employ or use reenactors/living historians.  They all were well within spec IMHO.  A little age or extra pounds did not detract from the impression.  I don't know if it was a coincidence or the guys running the forts/programs etc had some standards. 

I still have not headed out west. :(
Title: Re: SAW reenacting event pictures.
Post by: smoke on October 23, 2018, 11:52:16 AM
I’m fortunate that I can find orignal uniforms from WW1 and later that fit but I tend to agree with Smoke on all points. I love playing soldier but I also realize that Billy Yank assaulting picnic shelter 14 and driving Johnny Reb back across then playground to the swimming pool is down right silly. Seeing a 60 year old confederate Santa Claus with three revolvers, Sharp’s and a Henry rifle is goofy but I understand he’s having fun just like me.

Thanks.
Title: Re: SAW reenacting event pictures.
Post by: smoke on October 23, 2018, 11:53:58 AM
One of the reasons I like the SAW period is that the services at that time had a lot of old officers and senior enlisted.  Gray haired captains and sergeants were not that unusual.

BTW, that was done in Ft Mott, New Jersy!  The guy doing Vara del Ray looked damn good.

True.  The recent time line event we went to had a lone guy doing SAW.  He was probably 60-70 but took care of himself and seemed younger.  He did an excellent job of it.  A shame more people weren't talking to him.

Title: Re: SAW reenacting event pictures.
Post by: smoke on October 23, 2018, 11:54:53 AM
Well, I seem to have taken this well off track.  I am sorry! :-[
Title: Re: SAW reenacting event pictures.
Post by: Pitspitr on October 23, 2018, 11:57:39 AM
Well, I seem to have taken this well off track.  I am sorry! :-[
Not to worry. It's good to have a conversation sometimes!  ;)
Title: Re: SAW reenacting event pictures.
Post by: Doc Jackson on October 23, 2018, 01:37:01 PM
I'm a fit younger guy, but going off of the descriptions of recruits in Rickey's and Utley's books, I dont I would be typical of the average IW recruit, Im in too good of shape, I've had medical care and regular meals most of my life.

In reality unless you go to Afghanistan and get actively campaigning soldiers, it wont be right. Even most fit guys in they're 20's and 30's are too well built. They aren't lean enough and they lack the prerequisite stress fractures in their feet.

All that aside I really enjoyed those pictures and I think those guys did a nice job. The young man portraying the officer was particularly convincing.
Title: Re: SAW reenacting event pictures.
Post by: pony express on October 23, 2018, 06:14:15 PM
I guess that's one reason I never considered doing a cavalry impression-my size would have disqualified me from cavalry, even in my "younger, fitter" days I was probably 50lb too heavy. Well, that and the fact that almost all of my milsurps are full length rifles.
Title: Re: SAW reenacting event pictures.
Post by: Doc Jackson on October 23, 2018, 08:01:11 PM
Well, that and the fact that almost all of my milsurps are full length rifles.

Not always though, the 2nd Cavalry reported to Fort Phil Kearny in 1866 armed with a mixture of M1861 Springfields and Starr Carbines. I though that was neat.
Title: Re: SAW reenacting event pictures.
Post by: Pitspitr on October 24, 2018, 06:01:54 AM
I guess that's one reason I never considered doing a cavalry impression-my size would have disqualified me from cavalry, even in my "younger, fitter" days I was probably 50lb too heavy. Well, that and the fact that almost all of my milsurps are full length rifles.

For me you could add to the list "Doesn't like horses"  ;D
Title: Re: SAW reenacting event pictures.
Post by: 1961MJS on October 24, 2018, 12:50:37 PM

For me you could add to the list "Doesn't like horses"  ;D

Hi

I have NO DESIRE to be in the cavalry, but "a large one" I ended up with a Sharps Carbine and a Krag Carbine, therefore I wear yaller stuff. 

On the subject of old fat guys reenacting, scrawny 18 year olds ain't got $2000 minimum disposable income to buy our toys.  It's only 50 year old fat guys who's scrawny 20 year olds finally left the house that have disposable income. 

Back in the 1980's I was in a Rebel group in Wichita, John Beck said that there were some Rebels back East that actually went to the trouble of starving themselves from say January until the summer campaigns.  They also didn't wash for a week or so before the events so they'd smell authentic.

Not volunteering....

Later

 
Title: Re: SAW reenacting event pictures.
Post by: Major 2 on October 24, 2018, 02:43:23 PM
Back in the day, there were FARBS, Mainstreamers & hardcore ....  may still be called that  :-\

I was very good mainstreamer... Kit wise ....  ;)  Horse & rider .... course both the horse & rider were... um.... not famished as it were !  

Of course, if we had weeded out all the plus size combatants,  you had maybe doz. show up !

The 125th, 130, and 150th national events had many thousands !  near 10,000 @ the 150th Gettysburg !
Title: Re: SAW reenacting event pictures.
Post by: Niederlander on October 25, 2018, 05:25:55 AM

For me you could add to the list "Doesn't like horses"  ;D
In my case, I realized early on the Cavalry didn't have a lot of Clydesdales to carry me...……..Infantry it is!