Let's Start a List: Chaparral and Uberti Production Problems

[Yance]

Well fellers, Tuesday will be 4 weeks my buddy's rifle has been at Charter with no word on progress.

Guess I should give them a holler sometime Monday to see if anyone's even seen it.

Those of you who have returned rifles to Charter for repair or replacement, what kind of turnaround time have you been seeing?

Thanks

Yance (Headed to Texas next week for a little lead slingin' and R&R)

[ljspoon]

Well I should have listened to all the people here before buying a Chaparrel.  When I received my rifle it had a very loose forend, somthing I could live with I guess. Upon closer inspection there was a large crack running with the grain on the pistol grip and the bolt lip was ground off.  I called the dealer that I received the rifle from and he stated that I needed to call Charter.  So I called charter and got a very tired sounding male who informed me that the rifle didn't leave the factory that way and I would have to take it up with the dealer. Funny it was new in the box, wrap and grease when it arrived.  After a bit of explanation about me alresdy calling them, he said that it sounded like someone (not at the factory) really screwed up the rifle and took my name and phone number that was six weeks ago and still no reply.  Good news is a friend offered me his original 1876 to me for $1000.00 so I wont EVER be buying anything from Charter again, not because of the rifle but because of the complete lack of customer service form Charter

[Hell-Er High Water]

Yance,

Turn around time on my rifle was about a month and a half.  I sent it on 1-8-08 and they shipped it back 2-20-08.

It is an NWMP carbine in 45-75 that had excessive headspace and an incorrect chamber that appeard that have been reamed much, much too deep.  Firing a cartridge moved the shoulder forward about 3/16".

After it's return, the chamber is correct and the headspace is so tight that I had to thin the rims of my 348 Win cases to 0.059".  I would say that they put a new barrel on it as the barrel is a full 22" long and wouldn't be so if they had set the original barrel back and rechambered it.

I functions and shoots properly now and I am in the process of working up a new load and breaking in the new barrel.

One thing about their return shipping is that they didn't advise me when it was shipped back.  I eMailed them asking the status and they advised that it had been shipped several days before and was in transit.  You have to keep on them to get the info out of them that you want.  I don't know if they are just so overloaded with warranty work that they don't keep the customers advised or if their policy is not to generate info but just reply to inquiries.

HHW

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[Sir Charles deMouton-Black]

I fired my Chapparel NWMP Carbine for the first time last week.  I used a modest load of HERCO under an EPP/UGG to form my .348 cases.

The diameter of fired case necks is .488 to .493

Reloaded GOEX FF with .457 dia Lyman 457192 (Gould), the diameter is .480

Is this TEN THOU clearance at the neck proper?

Has anyone had dimensional difficulties with LEE .45-75 dies?

[Grizzly Adams]

I fired my Chapparel NWMP Carbine for the first time last week.  I used a modest load of HERCO under an EPP/UGG to form my .348 cases.

The diameter of fired case necks is .488 to .493

Reloaded GOEX FF with .457 dia Lyman 457192 (Gould), the diameter is .480

Is this TEN THOU clearance at the neck proper?

Has anyone had dimensional difficulties with LEE .45-75 dies?

Sir Charles,

There have been problems with some of the Lee dies.  Check John Boy's post on this thread.

http://www.cascity.com/forumhall/index.php/topic,19552.0.html

[Joe Lansing]

The out of box problems with my 45-60, 28" barrel Chaparral were :

    PROBLEM                                                                SOLUTION

    Ammo sticking in mag. where tube meets receiver          Deburred receiver
    Half cock way too high                                              Dremmel tool
    Lever spring not properly engaged                                Re-contoured bearing point on lever
    Cartridge elevator would not snap return but hung up     Re-contoured elevator lever where spring bears
    Flats on front half of barrel had "dips" in 3 places           Turned barrel to half round(*my original plan)

    You can see my rifle on posts on SHORTENING A '76 RIFLE

[john boy]

Sir Charles ... there were problems with the Lyman dies ... not the Lee.  I use the Lee die set and no problems.  If yours are out of spec's call Lee Precision and ask for Pat.  All their dies come with a 2 year warranty ...

[Grizzly Adams]

Sir Charles ... there were problems with the Lyman dies ... not the Lee.  I use the Lee die set and no problems.  If yours are out of spec's call Lee Precision and ask for Pat.  All their dies come with a 2 year warranty ...

Opps!   Ah heck, I knew that.  I was just checking to make sure you was on the job, John!

[Sir Charles deMouton-Black]

I emailed Pat earlier today.  A few months ago, when I foresaw the problem, she had suggested "Ball Sizing" my dies to increase them about .003.  That doesn't sound like enough.

I love LEE dies.  The .44-40 dies are reputed to be the best dimensioned, and mine work very well.  My .45-70 dies work the brass minimally, just enough so the brass fits both my Pedersoli Sharps & BLR src.

BTW what is the correct length for my .45-75 cases after all is said & done?  Now they are 2.91", and just cover the driving band of the Gould bullet, after one case-forming shot.  Oal of 2.30" just runs though the loading cycle of my Chapparal.  Is that right, or should I shorten them to 2.25"?

[Grizzly Adams]

I emailed Pat earlier today.  A few months ago, when I foresaw the problem, she had suggested "Ball Sizing" my dies to increase them about .003.  That doesn't sound like enough.

I love LEE dies.  The .44-40 dies are reputed to be the best dimensioned, and mine work very well.  My .45-70 dies work the brass just enough so the brass fits both my Pedersoli Sharps & BLR src.

BTW what is the correct length for my .45-75 cases after all is said & done?  Now they are 2.91", and just cover the driving band of the Gould bullet, after one cases forming shot.  Oal of 2.30" just runs though the loading cycle of my Chapparal.  Is that right, or should I shorten them to 2.25"?

The correct length for the 45-75 case is 1.89.  The original factory OAL of the 45-75 is 2.25 on the example I have.

[larryo_1]

Grizz:
just a note here.  According to Ken Howell who wrote "designing and forming Custom Cartridge Cases", he stated that the correct case length should be 1.885" which is close to what you stated.  Nonte said 1.88" and the one cartridge that I have was made by UMC and it is 1.868 inches.  I make all mine to be 1.88".  That original case OAL is 2.251".  I seat mine just a "smidge" under that mainly because of the shape of the bullet.  The dies that I use are LEE dies and I don't FL just neck size only.  Don't know if this is of any use to you guys but there it is.

[Grizzly Adams]

Grizz:
just a note here.  According to Ken Howell who wrote "designing and forming Custom Cartridge Cases", he stated that the correct case length should be 1.885" which is close to what you stated.  Nonte said 1.88" and the one cartridge that I have was made by UMC and it is 1.868 inches.  I make all mine to be 1.88".  That original case OAL is 2.251".  I seat mine just a "smidge" under that mainly because of the shape of the bullet.  The dies that I use are LEE dies and I don't FL just neck size only.  Don't know if this is of any use to you guys but there it is.

Thanks, Larryo.  Great information.  I was unaware the Kenny H had written a book on forming custom cartridges!   I know him only in the context of the conversion revolvers and cylinders that he has produced! .......but I don't get out much!

[Yance]

Well, after about 6 weeks  Charter 2000 shipped "a" rifle back to me. 

At first I was excited/disappointed that it was a totally new rifle rather than the one I'd sent.  No harm really since I'd not done anything to the action itself.

When I delivered it to its rightful owner he said, "That's nice, but mine was a 28" barrel, not a 26".  BAHHH!!!!!!

Been right at 2 months now since I called Nick to report the mistake and after checking manufacturing and shipping records he agreed that it was a 28" but had been logged in as a 26" when received.

I've already made two more calls checking on progress, but it seems that there have been no 28" barrels coming out of Italy.

I'll make another call today and plan to be put off and disappointed again.

The saga continues.

[Grizzly Adams]

Well, after about 6 weeks  Charter 2000 shipped "a" rifle back to me. 

When I delivered it to its rightful owner he said, "That's nice, but mine was a 28" barrel, not a 26".  BAHHH!!!!!!

Bummer!

I know that a fella has a right to the barrel length he wants, but if that replacement was right in all other respects, I think I would be tempted to say, "good enough.!"

Hope Nick makes it right, and does so in a timely manner.

[swbohler]

I bought a Chaparral 1876 in .45-75 about a month ago and just got the ammunition last week.  So today was my day to take it out for some shooting.  I had the same problem that several others here have mentioned: I pulled the trigger, but no bang.  The hammer is not hitting the center of the primer.  Only 4 fired out of the first 9 I tried; given what I had read here, I figured it didn't make any sense to keep on trying.  Too late to call the shop where I bought it anymore today, so I will do that tomorrow.  I'm just wondering if this is something I should try to have fixed locally?  I like the gun, and she sure is a beauty, now if only she would do what I was paying her to do...

I will say this, though: it sure was fun those 4 times it worked!  I had to settle for shooting my Uberti 1866 (old reliable!) and then the beaten-up .32 auto I got when I bought the Chaparral.  THAT was fun!  And cheap, compared to the .45-75 and even the .44-40. 

[Chris Wildhunter]

Hi, i’ve had many problems with Chaparrall sights, pins, who fall down  . Pins of toggle action who’s made too small and also side plate opening when gun fire.
Also i buyed for me two Uberti i’ve one in 45-75wcf who shoot great and now a new one in 50-95 wcf  who are twice more expensive but without problems.

[Russian]

No probs so far with my Cimarron/Uberti, except the rear sight is a hair left fo centre.

[swbohler]

It has been almost two weeks since I wrote to Charter Arms and I have heard nothing from them about my problem (not even an acknowledement of receiving my complaint).  Given what others have written here, am I to take it that this is SOP for them?  Any suggestions as to whom I might contact about fixing this on my own?  Thanks.

[Grizzly Adams]

It has been almost two weeks since I wrote to Charter Arms and I have heard nothing from them about my problem (not even an acknowledement of receiving my complaint).  Given what others have written here, am I to take it that this is SOP for them?  Any suggestions as to whom I might contact about fixing this on my own?  Thanks.

Discouraging.   Check your bolt face.  Does it have the small lip (cartridge rim support) on the bottom?  Sometimes it is missing on the Chappies.

Check this post, which has pictures of both the original and the Uberti.  Reply #30.

http://www.cascity.com/forumhall/index.php/topic,17987.30.html

If that's the problem, I would call those boys and tell them to send you a new bolt.

[Yance]

It has been almost two weeks since I wrote to Charter Arms and I have heard nothing from them about my problem (not even an acknowledement of receiving my complaint).  Given what others have written here, am I to take it that this is SOP for them?  Any suggestions as to whom I might contact about fixing this on my own?  Thanks.

Been a week and a half since my last e-mail to Nick. Still no reply.

I need to give them another call and this time try to talk directly to Chris who handles the repairs.

The times iIve talked to Nick it's always been..."We've got another shipment coming in about two weeks", and the time I talked to Terry, (shop boss) it was "7-10 days and we'll have it out".

Hard to believe that Chaparral Italy hasn't made any 28" barrels in the past 5+ months. They HAVE managed to roll out their 1873 copy, and the Model P release is close at hand.

Seems like they could take care of  folks who already OWN their product.  Don't think I'd gamble my $$ on a repeat purchase of a Chaparral product with this kind of customer "SERVICE?".

A bit disillusioned? Yup!

My 2¢