Loading Data for the 50/95WCF

[SiringoMN]

Referencing my post about my 50-95 saga, I clocked three loads I had used in that post. I’m using  330 grain bullet and WLRM primers.

(CORRECTIONS TO VELOCITY 10/21/21)

20 grains of Trail Boss - 1373 FPS
35 grains of 5744 - 1443FPS
52 grains of pyrodex “P” - 1452 FPS

To date, “P”, gives the best accuracy.

[SiringoMN]

Adding to my post of velocities (corrected 10/21/21), I've added 3 velocities measuring by volume. I used 72 grains by volume of Triple 7 2f, Triple 7 3f snd Pyrodex "P". Loads still used the 335 grain bullet and WLRM primer.

T7 2f - 1548 fps
T7 3f - 1631 fps
"P" - 1473 fps

I only fired one shot each across the chronograph just to get a rough idea on speed. The weight of those volume charges of all three powders was between 53 and 54 grains. Even between the 2f and 3f.

I only fired 4 shots of each string at 50 yards. I had vertical stringing which was me (3 inches) but the horizontal dispersion hovered around 1.5 inches. Another issue is cases in my old Uberti barrel were 1.94 inches long. The new Winchester Barrels chamber seems to have a shorter neck compared to the Uberti. So my cases should be 1.88 inches long, which is the exact length of TenX cases I procured.

ADDITIONAL INFORMATION - I fiddled with some  50-90 cases and during the forming process I came up with a case length of 1.93 inches. Probably it would be prudent trim to 1.92 inches.

[ndnchf]

Nice - thanks for the update.

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[King Medallion]

Thank for the info. Loading up some rounds now myself.

[King Medallion]

Referencing my post about my 50-95 saga, I clocked three loads I had used in that post. I’m using  330 grain bullet and WLRM primers.

(CORRECTIONS TO VELOCITY 10/21/21)

20 grains of Trail Boss - 1373 FPS
35 grains of 5744 - 1443FPS
52 grains of pyrodex “P” - 1452 FPS

To date, “P”, gives the best accuracy.

Did you use any filler with your 5744 load? How did it work?

[SiringoMN]

Sorry for the late reply. Sometimes I use a filler. I have a batch that I am going to try this week. I’ll let you know.

[SiringoMN]

The filler does not all burn up. I fired ten shots and had 3 circumference neck splits. I’m pulling my loaded rounds apart.

[King Medallion]

What do you use for filler? I've found laundry lint from a load of towels works real well, just a thumbnail size pinch.

[SiringoMN]

Polyester fill for pillows.  That is what I was told to use by the internet. I failed to mention that at 100 yards the accuracy was not as good as without the filler. My guess is that since it is not consumed, it affects the base of the bullet exit. I am not an expert on fillers at all.

NOW, lint is a great idea. I never would have thought about that.

Got me wondering about navel lint too!  Haha.

[pinto beans]

Some years back when I started down the road of trying a filler, I came across the PuffLon product and tried it.  Have stuck with it and had good results.  To my knowledge it is the only product sold as a filler and seems to do the job well.  I use it in couple different cartridges for cast loads, including the 45-75.  Just a suggestion. 

keep us posted on how things go on the load work.

P.B.

[SiringoMN]

I have been trying to buy puffalon for the last year. Never available. I have only heard good things about it.

[Roundsworth]

I use Kynoch (Kynamco) Nitro Express foam wads for my 'nitro for black' loads. Kynoch uses them in their loaded ammunition. Trader Keith sells them, here in the U.S. A few years ago, an extensive article was done for the Double Gun Journal about filler materials. Pressure testing was done using different materials. The Kynoch wads faired well in the tests.

[DTS]

Guys - not a good idea to use a filler with 5744 - as noted by Accurate Arms- "no filler necessary, may cause high pressure" of words to that effect.
If you are going to use a filler, fill the space between the powders surface and the base of the bullet, with dacron, kapok or better yet, as the loaders
of NE (Nitro Express) rounds now do, with backer rod. Backer rod is the foam rod sold for insulation around windows. The 5/8" backer rod should work in .50 cal. cases. 1/2" might also work, I don't know. My bro was using 1/2" backer rod with small charges of smokeless powder in his .45/60 M76, to good effect(accuracy).
In my 1876, (likely back on the 2nd or 3rd page of this thread) I loaded 52gr. of N44 ("marked use 3031 data") with a 368gr. Lyman bullet. I got really good accuracy
& with the Smith Sight, was able to get into the dirt right below the 1,000 meter buffalo at our long range. Yeah - .50/95 M1876 Uberti. Velocity was 1650fps.
N44 is/was an AmmoMart powder from years gone by. I came across a couple pounds of it & it is wonderfully clean burning powder, much better than 4895 and 3031.
I will never use a perchlorate or chlorate powder based powder in any of my guns. The fouling forms an acid when coupled with moisture.(just from the air) T7 does not have
 perchlorate in it even though the MSDS sheet says it does. Pyrodex is some 17% perchlorate.  Corrosive primers of the WW1 were chlorate based. Now you know. It's your rifle.
here's that Smith Sight. 3 detents between 100 yard marks so zero's are easily marked in your "sight/range book" and thus, are repeatable.

[DTS]

I saw the mention of using Pyrodex. Do so at your own risk.
Real BP will cause oxidation of the bore if not cleaned properly.
Pyrodex fouling, on the other hand, seems to have the characteristic that with the addition of moisture (from the air is enough) to become seemingly acidic in nature and
dissolves the iron molecules out of the steel, creating craters, not simple rust pitting. If you use it, clean your rifle VERY carefully using water, lots of water, then clean it
again with water the next day. Repeat as necessary. You also have to clean it well if using real BP. It's just that Pyrodex is the "gift" that keeps on "giving" - like STD's.
A gun smith friend of mine, said using a bore scope, he could tell if someone used Pyrodex in their ctg. rifle, even if they had cleaned the barrel well after it's use. Go figure!!
T-7, apparently, in spite of the MSDS sheet, does not contain perchlorates. The perchlorates used in Pyrodex compose something like 17% of the volume. Chlorates produce
excessively corrosive fouling. Many of the corrosive primers of the past, used chlorates. Perchlorates, I've been told, just produces more oxygen to the mix, something like 3 times
as much. It's still chlorates.

[DrummerBoy]

Gents, et al,
If y’all don’t mind I’d like to reenergize this series somewhat.
I don’t have enough equipment to reload just yet, so I got some Steinel ammo from Cimarron in 50-95…350 grain cast projo, but that’s all the data…expensive.
I shot up a box last week with my Presidio. I have a little bitty Caldwell barrel brace and a t-shirt, shooting at 50 yards…I should have gone to Cabelas and got a limb saver before going to the range…..shame.(couple weeks before I shot without the muzzle brace…worthless for really assessing accuracy)..i might be repeating some things here but what I want to get to is that despite my worst efforts this rifle and this ammo CAN BE AC-CU-RATE!! Shoots rather high at 50 so the combination must be regulated at 100.
Has anyone shot this Steinel 50-95 over a cronograph??
This is a really good rifle/ammo combination!

[ndnchf]

I've never even heard of that ammunition. Is it black powder or smokeless? If smokeless, it is likely a very mild load.

[King Medallion]

I had to change my front sight to a higher one, a Marble 41w I believe it was. I really don't like Uberti front sights.

[DrummerBoy]

Thanks ndn and King!
I also got some Steinel in 45-60 with a 300 grain projo.. 1380 gos on the box…

[SiringoMN]

Gents, et al,
If y’all don’t mind I’d like to reenergize this series somewhat.
I don’t have enough equipment to reload just yet, so I got some Steinel ammo from Cimarron in 50-95…350 grain cast projo, but that’s all the data…expensive.
I shot up a box last week with my Presidio. I have a little bitty Caldwell barrel brace and a t-shirt, shooting at 50 yards…I should have gone to Cabelas and got a limb saver before going to the range…..shame.(couple weeks before I shot without the muzzle brace…worthless for really assessing accuracy)..i might be repeating some things here but what I want to get to is that despite my worst efforts this rifle and this ammo CAN BE AC-CU-RATE!! Shoots rather high at 50 so the combination must be regulated at 100.
Has anyone shot this Steinel 50-95 over a cronograph??
This is a really good rifle/ammo combination!

I have purchased several boxes primarily for the brass. This ammo is specifically made for Cimmeron rifles. Its loaded with 350 grain hardcast bullets (from Montana bullets). If i recall they are sized to 0.509 inches. The powder is Trailboss. 18 grains.  I would suggest you slug your bore, so when you start loading you can get the proper diameter.

[King Medallion]

.509? Wow, that would not be good for my Presidio. Mine slugged out at .513, I cast at .515. Most definitely you'd need to slug your bore.