Now it's about AIRCRAFT ... it was about BACKUPS

[Professor Marvel]

I drifted the topic so bad,  I put the "BACKUPS" on its own thread
but the Aircraft part was so fun I am leaving that part here.....
prof marvel

[Coffinmaker]

And Hallaluya Prof.

Same thing with Airplanes.  So often, it's "Pilot Error" and "Controlled Flight into Terrain."  Some lustrum ago, my flight instructor told me "Never, Ever stop Flying the Airplane."  Doesn't matter what Blinks, Beeps, Honks or Yells.  FLY THE AIRPLANE.  All too often there is/was a failure of some sort and the crew was too busy finking out "What" "Precisely" was wrong.  Going through manuals and check lists instead of Flying the Airplane.  I'll never understand that.

I will also never understand giving up control to an electronic device that may not want to fly that day.  I don't fly anymore.  Period.

[Professor Marvel]

And Hallaluya Prof.

Same thing with Airplanes.  So often, it's "Pilot Error" and "Controlled Flight into Terrain."  Some lustrum ago, my flight instructor told me "Never, Ever stop Flying the Airplane."  Doesn't matter what Blinks, Beeps, Honks or Yells.  FLY THE AIRPLANE.  All too often there is/was a failure of some sort and the crew was too busy finking out "What" "Precisely" was wrong.  Going through manuals and check lists instead of Flying the Airplane.  I'll never understand that.

I will also never understand giving up control to an electronic device that may not want to fly that day.  I don't fly anymore.  Period.

OMG Coffin - you are describing the newest 737 engine design, the software needed to make it fly, and the crashes that software caused.

I've been out of THAT business ~ 30 years and I still can't stop caring.....

yhs
prof sad

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[Coffinmaker]

I was also at one time closely employed to one of the most advanced Nav/Attack systems on the planet.  The system did unbelievable things.  Controlled the Airplane better than ANY human pilot.  I still don't trust flight control computers where the pilot is not actually connected to the flight control surfaces.  Just old fashioned I guess.

Actually, I have faith in the Military Nav/Attack systems.  I feel the commercial applications are somewhat sketchy.  I vote no confidence.

[Professor Marvel]

I was also at one time closely employed to one of the most advanced Nav/Attack systems on the planet.  The system did unbelievable things.  Controlled the Airplane better than ANY human pilot.  I still don't trust flight control computers where the pilot is not actually connected to the flight control surfaces.  Just old fashioned I guess.

Actually, I have faith in the Military Nav/Attack systems.  I feel the commercial applications are somewhat sketchy.  I vote no confidence.

Yeah. Fly-by-wire sucks. No feedback to the pilot. I worked on the iforget part of the f14, f15,
F16 and the cool one was the f4g update - they  Lengthened the airframe and we gave the electronics an upgrade: weasel attack signal processor aka wild-weasel.

The F4G  was the "best" of the wild weasel program. The first ones used F105 Thuds and expected the
lead bird do be the "radar decoy" and dodge the incoming :-(  ... By the time we did the F4G, they had a dedicated back-seat EWO
and electronic radar-magic - it electronically sent out a "ghost image" about a mile ahead of itself. so when the adversary radar lit up,
the EWO was able to target it and send out a "fire and forget" gift pack assortment and any incoming was off target by over a mile  :-)


I always wanted to ride in one of those buckets, even knowing the pilot would try to make the civvy ralph in his mask ....
but when an opportunity arose on an 4fg  I COULDNT FIT! Just too damn tall...

twintail tomcat flash


wild weasel flash


Prof mrvl

[Professor Marvel]

oh look ...
turns out the crap we built worked pretty good
https://theaviationgeekclub.com/incredible-story-f-4g-wild-weasel-dodged-6-sams-seconds-operation-desert-storm/

but now they switched over to F-16's and a computer replaced the EWO.

prf mvl

[Bryan Austin]

you guys can have your computer generated flying apparatus...lol  I'l stick to flying the 185!!!

[Coffinmaker]

Professor,  Funny you should mention the F-16.  Was a time a few Lustrum ago when there were those of us whom called the F-16 the "Electric Lawn Dart"     Them things dug more holes than Gophers.

Bryan, where did I EVER say I liked "Computer Generated Flying Apparatus??"  Of course the mantra of "Never Stop Flying The Airplane" is useless when the flight controls of the Pilot are in no mechanical way connected to the control surfaces.  Ejection Seat Anyone??

[Bryan Austin]

You didn't nor was my reply meant as condescending......I just better stick to the simple stuff myself!! 

[Kent Shootwell]

I don' t believe this fellow had a problem with computer aided controls, simply tried to hoover in his own rotor wash. The cook that had hitched a ride jumped out at the last moment and was the only one injured.

  001 by Oliver Sudden, on Flickr

[Bryan Austin]

never mind   

[Coffinmaker]

Hey Bryan 

Take no offense.  Not at all pickin onya.  I learned to fly in a proper airplane myself.  Very proper, Two Wings, Covered with Fabric, Fabric onna fuselage had multi-color'd patches.  Big 'ol 450 HP Round Engine out front.  "Bull Sterman."  Crop Duster.  Some of the most fun flying there is.  Also some intense.  Caught all holy ned when I came back with plant matter stuck inna wheels.  Oh, almost forgot.  Real airplanes have tail wheels 

Kent:  Just gobs of fun when you ride an "auto-rotation" in.  Helicopters DO NOT fly.  The beat the atmosphere into submission.  Pulled a tour as a professional target standing inna door of an Air Force Rescue Helicopter.  Adrenalin Junkie was I (still am, actually)

[Bryan Austin]

Hey Bryan 

Take no offense.  Not at all pickin onya.  I learned to fly in a proper airplane myself.  Very proper, Two Wings, Covered with Fabric, Fabric onna fuselage had multi-color'd patches.  Big 'ol 450 HP Round Engine out front.  "Bull Sterman."  Crop Duster.  Some of the most fun flying there is.  Also some intense.  Caught all holy ned when I came back with plant matter stuck inna wheels.  Oh, almost forgot.  Real airplanes have tail wheels 

Kent:  Just gobs of fun when you ride an "auto-rotation" in.  Helicopters DO NOT fly.  The beat the atmosphere into submission.  Pulled a tour as a professional target standing inna door of an Air Force Rescue Helicopter.  Adrenalin Junkie was I (still am, actually)

We had a WACO ASO, fAIRCHILD 24g, cubs champs and flew a bunch more....Now I get paid to fly a 185 and I think I want to stay simple....thats really was I was referring to but.....lol