Author Topic: Trapdoors and collar-buttons  (Read 1152 times)

Offline LongWalker

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Trapdoors and collar-buttons
« on: December 03, 2022, 09:11:03 PM »
Today I received via USPS a LEE 6 cavity mould for a collar-button bullet.  These will hopefully replace the .457" round balls I've using for plinking.  Has anyone tried these out?   Looking for thoughts on loads etc, and if anyone has done anything special to the brass (reamed flashholes etc)?  I"ve got an order of new brass on the way, not sure if I should budget for some of these to become designated plinking brass or not. 
In my book a pioneer is a man who turned all the grass upside down, strung bob-wire over the dust that was left, poisoned the water, cut down the trees, killed the Indian who owned the land and called it progress.  Charles M. Russell

Offline pony express

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Re: Trapdoors and collar-buttons
« Reply #1 on: December 04, 2022, 08:59:00 AM »
What load do you use for the round balls? I would think it'd be similar.

Offline LongWalker

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Re: Trapdoors and collar-buttons
« Reply #2 on: December 04, 2022, 01:07:38 PM »
What load do you use for the round balls? I would think it'd be similar.
That's kind of what I'm thinking, but I figured maybe someone had some tricks.  I tried these (from a Lyman mould) back when I was a kid but had lousy luck with them. 
In my book a pioneer is a man who turned all the grass upside down, strung bob-wire over the dust that was left, poisoned the water, cut down the trees, killed the Indian who owned the land and called it progress.  Charles M. Russell

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Re: Trapdoors and collar-buttons
« Reply #3 on: Today at 02:41:45 AM »

Offline wildman1

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Re: Trapdoors and collar-buttons
« Reply #3 on: December 05, 2022, 05:54:32 AM »
457 rb and 23gs of OE or Schuetzen 2f works very well for Plainsman events. My wife uses 457 rbs and I use 300 g Desperado conicals with 32gs of OE 2f. The max distance we have tried with the rb load is 100 yds, works fine. Max distance I have tried withe 300 g bullet is 300 yds, reasonably accurate at that distance. Chrono for the 300 g conical is about 1600 fps. Wifes rifle is an H&R Officers model and mine is an H&R Buffalo Classic or my original trapdoor.
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Offline Pitspitr

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Re: Trapdoors and collar-buttons
« Reply #4 on: March 01, 2023, 11:39:18 AM »
When I worked at Fort Hartsuff, we hosted shooting events for our volunteers during the winter. We had a steel plate target with the X-ring cut out and another angled plate behind it. We shot it indoors at 25' using the gallery load of 4-7gr of 3F under a .457 Round ball. The load made no noticeable smoke, and had just enough velocity to mare the paint on the target and flatten the bullet. When you hit the "Bullseye" it sounded different.
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Offline Professor Marvel

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Re: Trapdoors and collar-buttons
« Reply #5 on: March 02, 2023, 06:45:03 PM »
Posted this in the wrong thread.
So here it is again, hope it helps

Article with some history

https://gunsmagazine.com/discover/collar-buttons-for-the-45-70-gentleman/

Much discourse from the ubiquitous cast boolet site
https://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?176855-45-70-collar-button-loads

I would like to warn against use of fillers - that much filler such as cream of wheat, etc
Would weigh almost as much as the bullet and seriously change the dynamics, ie pressure.

If using SMALL AMOUNTS of smokeless, and one insists, a tiny pick of TP or kapok or dacron would be preferable but not advised by many.

This is a specialty cat sneeze load and due to small amounts of powder elevating the firelock to vertical and a little thump might provide a more harmonious outcome.
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Offline LongWalker

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Re: Trapdoors and collar-buttons
« Reply #6 on: March 18, 2023, 08:02:12 PM »
Thanks for the info guys.  After trying out the-collar button bullets, I realized I go to the same range to shoot collar-button loads and full-power loads.  Since I'd rather practice with full-power loads, I listed the collar-button mould for sale. 

I understand the idea behind them, but other than economy I don't really have a need for reduced loads.  When I was a kid I did: I got the opportunity to shoot one of my first trapdoors on the indoor range used by the local Guard detachment.  Let's just say that BP 45-70-500s may be a little overkill on an indoor 25' range.  Had I approached shooting on the indoor range with a good smokeless collar-button load at maybe 800fps, it could have been a different story. 

But omigod it was funny--they thought something exploded and evacuated the place!   ;D

In my book a pioneer is a man who turned all the grass upside down, strung bob-wire over the dust that was left, poisoned the water, cut down the trees, killed the Indian who owned the land and called it progress.  Charles M. Russell

 

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