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Special Interests - Groups & Societies => Uberti, Pietta and other SAA Clones => Topic started by: Sharky on February 01, 2018, 11:50:56 AM

Title: SAA Old Model or Pre-War ?? What to do ...
Post by: Sharky on February 01, 2018, 11:50:56 AM
Guys,
          Just getting started in Cowboy Action Shooting and I know I don't want the " NEW " Hammer design on the Uberti guns but as of right now the Pietta Frontier is offered in Old Model and Pre-War with the old style hammer so NO crazy floating firing pin nonsense that Uberti has gone to. My question is should I be looking at the Old Model or the Pre-War  ? Pro's Vs Con's

Thanks in advance
 
Title: Re: SAA Old Model or Pre-War ?? What to do ...
Post by: Cholla Hill Tirador on February 01, 2018, 12:49:49 PM
  I talked to Chip at Cimarron a couple of weeks ago. He said as of right now, none of the Pietta's use the retracting firing pin and the Model P and Old Models made by Uberti. He gave the the exact model numbers of their firearms made by UbertI that still have the original type firing pins, but I've misplaced that info!

  CHT
Title: Re: SAA Old Model or Pre-War ?? What to do ...
Post by: Abilene on February 01, 2018, 01:11:52 PM
Howdy Sharky,
I answered on the SASS Wire, but for CHT will mention that all the Cimarron Old Model (BP frame) Model P's will retain the original firing pin and hammer for 2 years (so they are currently saying).  Also they are importing some of the Evil Roy competition models now with the Old Model frame so they also have the standard hammer.
Title: Re: SAA Old Model or Pre-War ?? What to do ...
Post by: hatman on March 06, 2018, 11:42:28 AM
FYI - I just got off the phone with Longhunters.  I was wanting to buy an Old Model and was told that Cimarron just informed them at all new Old Model/BP frame guns now have the new firing pins.  :(
Title: Re: SAA Old Model or Pre-War ?? What to do ...
Post by: Cliff Fendley on March 06, 2018, 01:17:17 PM
FYI - I just got off the phone with Longhunters.  I was wanting to buy an Old Model and was told that Cimarron just informed them at all new Old Model/BP frame guns now have the new firing pins.  :(

Sad news if that's true.
Title: Re: SAA Old Model or Pre-War ?? What to do ...
Post by: Jake C on March 06, 2018, 01:18:27 PM
FYI - I just got off the phone with Longhunters.  I was wanting to buy an Old Model and was told that Cimarron just informed them at all new Old Model/BP frame guns now have the new firing pins.  :(

That's a genuine shame. At least my wife'll be happy; this puts the end to my plans to buy a few more BP Frame repros.
Title: Re: SAA Old Model or Pre-War ?? What to do ...
Post by: LonesomePigeon on March 07, 2018, 02:31:12 AM
That's a bummer if the Old Models have the retractable firing pin. You'd think anyone wanting an Old Model(key word being "old") with the screw in cylinder pin retainer would be willing to load 5 and put the hammer on an empty chamber. I can at least sort of understand the crosspin framed Model P having a retractable firing pin since the crosspin might be more likely to fail a drop test if the crosspin breaks.
Title: Re: SAA Old Model or Pre-War ?? What to do ...
Post by: Major 2 on March 07, 2018, 04:42:20 AM
I have 3 - 2 BP frame  3 1/2 "  &  a 7 1/2"    and one Cross Pin. without retractable firing pins

 I don't think I'll be ever in any market for a retractable firing pin model.  Might,  at some future juncture run across one without retractable firing pin, if'n' the price is right or the fancy suits me it might come home.

But I highly doubt, any New Uberti retractable firing pin model is in my future, nor would I knowingly buy one.

I don't think they ( like Transfer bars , tang safeties or two notch base pins )  are a particularly bad idea, they are just not for my liking.
I change or shorten my Base pins....don't own any Tang Safety or transfer bar models of any make.

From a bean counter &/or liability stand point, I'm glad Uberti/Beretta  is willing to continue to do the R&D and continue to support the Product line in safety ..... just not for me.   
I suspect Pietta will not be far behind....  and get ahead of any possible liability question in this day and age ....

my 2 cents .... and worth just that  ;)
Title: Re: SAA Old Model or Pre-War ?? What to do ...
Post by: Jake C on March 07, 2018, 07:00:17 AM
I don't think they ( like Transfer bars , tang safeties or two notch base pins )  are a particularly bad idea, they are just not for my liking.

Exactly my thoughts. Just not for me.

I emailed Cimarron yesterday, and they confirmed that the Model P 'Old Models' will be made with retractable firing pins. The change over should be done by the middle of this year. So if you want one without the new firing pin then now is the time to get it.
Title: Re: SAA Old Model or Pre-War ?? What to do ...
Post by: Cholla Hill Tirador on March 07, 2018, 08:28:00 AM
[quote author=Major 2 link=topic=60732.msg723413#msg723413 date=1520419340p
I don't think they ( like Transfer bars , tang safeties or two notch base pins )  are a particularly bad idea, they are just not for my liking.
I change or shorten my Base pins....don't own any Tang Safety or transfer bar models of any make.

From a bean counter &/or liability stand point, I'm glad Uberti/Beretta  is willing to continue to do the R&D and continue to support the Product line in safety ..... just not for me.   
I suspect Pietta will not be far behind....  and get ahead of any possible liability question in this day and age ....

my 2 cents .... and worth just that  ;)

[/quote]

  I think all the safety devices are a terrible idea. We're reaching a point in our litigious society where devices are being designed to remove human error and negligence which in turn lessens, and in some cases eliminates our need to take safety as a personal responsibility.

  CHT
Title: Re: SAA Old Model or Pre-War ?? What to do ...
Post by: Baltimore Ed on March 07, 2018, 10:14:53 AM
Been going down that road for a long time in this country. Damn zero radius lawnmower's got so many interlocks it won't hardly start. Gotta make '??' fool proof or else the fool that buys it hurts himself using it incorrectly and sues the maker for a defective product. Maybe a defective operator would be more correct.
Title: Re: SAA Old Model or Pre-War ?? What to do ...
Post by: Major 2 on March 07, 2018, 10:35:24 AM
[quote author=Major 2 link=topic=60732.msg723413#msg723413 date=1520419340p
I don't think they ( like Transfer bars , tang safeties or two notch base pins )  are a particularly bad idea, they are just not for my liking.
I change or shorten my Base pins....don't own any Tang Safety or transfer bar models of any make.

From a bean counter &/or liability stand point, I'm glad Uberti/Beretta  is willing to continue to do the R&D and continue to support the Product line in safety ..... just not for me.   
I suspect Pietta will not be far behind....  and get ahead of any possible liability question in this day and age ....

my 2 cents .... and worth just that  ;)



  I think all the safety devices are a terrible idea. We're reaching a point in our litigious society where devices are being designed to remove human error and negligence which in turn lessens, and in some cases eliminates our need to take safety as a personal responsibility.

  CHT

CHT.... It depends on your point of view....

It is a good Idea I suppose for the manufacturer, if they produce even in a draconian environment ....Massachusetts comes to mind,
will more follow suit ?  Ha,   I said LawSUIT !
and as you point out...
Remove human error and negligence ....
Which, If you consider Safety is not a bad thing... for some  ::) many...

However, I don't care for them (retracting firing pins,  Transfer bars , tang safeties or two notch base pins )
nor do It care for S&W's safety lock ....  or for that matter the LAW Card roll engraved on the firearm ( I:E: RUGER and others )


Title: Re: SAA Old Model or Pre-War ?? What to do ...
Post by: hatman on March 07, 2018, 11:49:10 AM
Exactly my thoughts. Just not for me.

I emailed Cimarron yesterday, and they confirmed that the Model P 'Old Models' wil lbe made wih retractable firing pins. The change over should be done by the middle of this year. So if you want one without the new firing pin then now is the time to get it.

Hey thanks Jake!
As a result of your info I called Longhunters again.  Courtney re-checked with Taylor's and Cimarron.
She was able to obtain the 'old style' BP model and it's now on order!!  :P
Get 'em while you can, fellas!
Title: Re: SAA Old Model or Pre-War ?? What to do ...
Post by: Jake C on March 07, 2018, 11:58:21 AM
Hey thanks Jake!
As a result of your info I called Longhunters again.  Courtney re-checked with Taylor's and Cimarron.
She was able to obtain the 'old style' BP model and it's now on order!!  :P
Get 'em while you can, fellas!

Glad you were able to get what you wanted! I would love to jump on one too, but I just finished paying off my Uberti '73 Sporting Rifle, so I'll need to wait a while before I can get something else.
Title: Re: SAA Old Model or Pre-War ?? What to do ...
Post by: Coffinmaker on March 07, 2018, 01:28:57 PM

Best Hurry Up   :D   It ain't gonna be too long you won't be able to buy a car YOU can drive   :o
Title: Re: SAA Old Model or Pre-War ?? What to do ...
Post by: Abilene on March 07, 2018, 02:16:15 PM
Best Hurry Up   :D   It ain't gonna be too long you won't be able to buy a car YOU can drive   :o

They can take my car when they pry the steering wheel from my cold dead fingers.  :)
Title: Re: SAA Old Model or Pre-War ?? What to do ...
Post by: quickdraw58 on March 07, 2018, 05:23:47 PM
I'm going to order a Cimarron 7th Cavalry model and contacted Cimarron this afternoon and was advised that this model does Not
have the retractable firing pin.
Title: Re: SAA Old Model or Pre-War ?? What to do ...
Post by: The Pathfinder on April 07, 2018, 12:13:35 PM
OK, I just received a Cimarron  Pietta Frontier from Sportsman's Guide, it's the laser engraved nickel plated 45 with the 4 3/4" barrel. Date code is CT so 2018 and it doesn't have the retractable firing pin. Is that only going to be on Cimarron's Uberti guns or all their offerings?
I did pull the original two position cylinder pin out and replaced it with a Colt nickel plated pin. fit like a glove. Also while the gun is listed as nickeled, I strongly suspect it is Stainless Steel. Other than the lack of patent dates on the frame, it is a beautiful piece and hard to tell in the hand from my 1880s Colt. Can't wait to put her thru her paces when I get the chance.
Title: Re: SAA Old Model or Pre-War ?? What to do ...
Post by: Coal Creek Griff on April 07, 2018, 12:22:55 PM
Well, we'll certainly need pictures!

My understand is that the new firing pin safety is a Uberti addition.

CC Griff
Title: Re: SAA Old Model or Pre-War ?? What to do ...
Post by: yahoody on July 04, 2018, 02:48:44 PM
"Exactly my thoughts. Just not for me."
Title: Re: SAA Old Model or Pre-War ?? What to do ...
Post by: greyhawk on July 04, 2018, 06:20:18 PM
Been going down that road for a long time in this country. Damn zero radius lawnmower's got so many interlocks it won't hardly start. Gotta make '??' fool proof or else the fool that buys it hurts himself using it incorrectly and sues the maker for a defective product. Maybe a defective operator would be more correct.

Yeah - here too - we bought a Huskvarna mower - got a recall on the Hydrostatic transmission - whats the problem ? No problem - some fool in the USA tipped hisself A over T down a steep bank then sued em cuz the transmission shoulda stopped it - we never did the recall - son has the mower its all good - we bought a bigger one second hand two years back - slow as a wet week in reverse - call my mate at the dealers whats wrong with this thing ? Ahh some fool backed over his kid in the yard and sued em so they shut the reverse down to creeper speed - cutoff switch under the seat is an easy fix - other stuff we put up with .
Rebounding firing pin in my Browning model 71 x 348 failed at about 200 rounds --- for a plinker at a CAS match this is a PITA - out in the sticks with a charging Grizzly ??? whole nuther deal - call the undertaker please. !
Title: Re: SAA Old Model or Pre-War ?? What to do ...
Post by: Darto on February 10, 2022, 05:15:30 PM
" I'm going to order a Cimarron 7th Cavalry model and contacted Cimarron this afternoon and was advised that this model does Not
have the retractable firing pin. "

They are available right now at most local Sportsmans Warehouse stores. You can check availability online by putting in the online cart.
Youtube has lots of videos on the Cimarron 7th Cavalry.
I just bought a 7th Cavalry (Custer) Cimarron and they still do not have the new type firing pin. It is still the traditional firing pin that folks here seem to all prefer.
By the way Cimarron makes a Custer model by Pietta  PP514M00 and a Custer model by Uberti  CA514M00. The one I bought at Sportsman is the Uberti made model and as far as I remember Sportsmans Warehouse has only ever carried the Uberti made 7th Cavalry model.
 
Title: Re: SAA Old Model or Pre-War ?? What to do ...
Post by: Drydock on February 11, 2022, 07:25:01 AM
Uberti does sell a conversion kit with conventional hammer and trigger.
Title: Re: SAA Old Model or Pre-War ?? What to do ...
Post by: Dave T on February 11, 2022, 11:32:24 AM
Does anyone other than me have a problem with a manufacturer stopping production of a particular model, that people want, and only making a model people don't want?

And how is it that Colt (when they occasionally make a SAA) have fixed firing pins, and Standard Manufacturing's single actions have fixed firing pins.  Those two companies don't seem to be cowering behind their lawyer's desks in fear.

I sure don't understand the gun making business...any more than I understand anything else going on these days.

Dave
Title: Re: SAA Old Model or Pre-War ?? What to do ...
Post by: Coffinmaker on February 12, 2022, 11:08:43 AM
 :)  Dave T  ;)

Can't disagree at all.  Nope.  No way.  Colt (when they make ONE), Standard (When they make a couple) and Pietta all serve up fix'd Firing Pins with no qualms.  Pietta has offered a Transfer Bar gun for those who just absolutely and completely have to be able to carry with 6 up.  I doesn't sell particularly well even though it's a well built gun.

Uberti??  I simply can't figure them out.  Their two position Base Pin was  completely functional and simple.  Was/Is also really easy to make Coltish if desired as well as eliminate our sweethearts going to the line and getting click, click. click . . . . . . .  The new "retractable" Firing Pin is dumber than a box of rocks.  Why Uberti did it, I don't know.  Cowering behind their lawyers??  Probably.  Maybe.  Just to give their engineers something to do??  Still, really really STUPID.

Play Safe Out There.  Don't need no retractable Firing Pin to be Safe neither.

PS:  Would that I had a Time Machine, go back and throttle the ham hock that coined the term "CLONE" for SAs.  Horrible individual.  STUPID too.
Title: Re: SAA Old Model or Pre-War ?? What to do ...
Post by: Coal Creek Griff on February 12, 2022, 09:57:26 PM
I don't know if it was a factor, but Uberti faced at least one lawsuit claiming an unsafe design for the fixed firing pin. As I recall, the owner loaded 6 rounds in the revolver, wrapped it in a rag and put it under the seat of the car. When another person needed a rag, they pulled it out from under the seat. That caused the gun to fall on the hammer, discharging it and entering a child if I'm recalling it correctly. The plaintiffs cited Ruger pistols as being safer and proving that the original design was outdated and unsafe. Again, I don't know if that's what prompted Uberti's new design.
Title: Re: SAA Old Model or Pre-War ?? What to do ...
Post by: Abilene on February 12, 2022, 10:17:04 PM
Yes, there have been lawsuits by stupid people, and yes Uberti is going to save a lot of money on their liability insurance.  At least we have options.  Taylors is currently out of the old style hammer/triggers, but their price is only half of VTI.  I truly do not know how they did it.  Maybe it was part of a negotiation with uberti, who knows.  But I bought two sets just to have in case I need them!