Antiquing "How-To"

[Indian Outlaw]

Curley, you must really like that gun. You posted it three times in this thread alone.  

[petrinal]

now..




before (revolver on top)

[ColonelFlashman]

Just to reiterate.

 WHY?

We are portraying an Era where these weapons were NEW or NEWish.
They were expensive, needed to function perfectly, so they'd have been taken rather good care of.

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[TwoWalks Baldridge]

Just to reiterate.

 WHY?

We are portraying an Era where these weapons were NEW or NEWish.
They were expensive, needed to function perfectly, so they'd have been taken rather good care of.

That might not be totally correct:   Grew up on a farm in Ohio, decided to head west and seek my fortune.  Being a poor kid, I purchased a second hand colt from the local gunsmith. This gun was inexpensive compared to new, well worn but very serviceable. 

There could be any number of portrayals were the gun would not have been New Looking.  Old man living in the Colorado area and still using the well worn revolver he bought many years back when first heading west.

[ColonelFlashman]

It would Still have the Majority of its Finish & Not look 200 years old. 

[TwoWalks Baldridge]

It would Still have the Majority of its Finish & Not look 200 years old. 

My response was not about making it look 200 years old, rather "NEW or NEWish" and it being well used and weathered.

[ColonelFlashman]

The majority of what I'm seeing, is individuals today ageing them to look like they never took care of them. Finish completely gone & rough looking.
Unless one made their living w/ Firearms, such as a LEO, Outlaw, Cavalry, etc., one would be using their Longarms more, not ones Pistole so much. 
So the majority that didn't, it resided in ones Holster, Saddlebags, Carpetbag, etc., most of the time & one maintained it so it would function perfectly when one needed it for the unexpected emergency that is was designed to use for.

[TwoWalks Baldridge]

The majority of what I'm seeing, is individuals today ageing them to look like they never took care of them. Finish completely gone & rough looking.
Unless one made their living w/ Firearms, such as a LEO, Outlaw, Cavalry, etc., one would be using their Longarms more, not ones Pistole so much. 
So the majority that didn't, it resided in ones Holster, Saddlebags, Carpetbag, etc., most of the time & one maintained it so it would function perfectly when one needed it for the unexpected emergency that is was designed to use for.

I agree that a lot of them are taken too far.  If a person wants a Nevada Smith found gun or a Josie Wales, pulled from the fire gun, just take it, stick it in a compost pile for two weeks and smile.

Holsters were not lined and just moving around in the holster will start showing rub spots in short order, same as today's guns.

[ColonelFlashman]

Muzzle & cylinder wear of the finish is what one would definitely would be seen more than anything else.
Nice to see we're on the same page, mate.

[petrinal]

Just to reiterate.

 WHY?

We are portraying an Era where these weapons were NEW or NEWish.
They were expensive, needed to function perfectly, so they'd have been taken rather good care of.

one of the main reasons is the very inadequate, modern blueing given by  the italians to their clones, with no possible comparation to the wonderful rust of heat blueings of XIX century firearms.

so many revolvers, be it Cattlemans, or be it Navies, Armys, 1858, just dont look authentic. In my UBERTI cattleman case, the casehardening was ... and the blueing was.... ..(I dont want to offend Italy´s replica gun industry and their customers, but it is the plain truth...they are light years away in finish from the real guns).

Every time that I saw the gun, I wanted to cry. I just didnt like the finish, XIX century revolvers were not finished  with those black alkaline, poorly made finish and with that chemical casehardening, period!

so we have to choices:

either refinish the gun the old way, or either "ageing it".  

 original heat and rust blueing  finishes are more affected by both light and leather than modern finishes, and tend to become "grey", in a few years time, specially if used outdoors. They develop in just 20 years a very nice patina, if exposed to elements or sunlight, and lets not forget that they used not to clean them much, and if they did, they did it with soap and water, that sometimes, if not properly oiled after, will develop rust.

in short, many guns were refinished after only some years of use, by local gunsmiths, and this professionals knew their trade well, so they  did refinish them  the old way, mainly with rust blueing. So a rust blued UBERTI like mine,  will look 1000th times more authentic that an alkaline blued, black, and chemical casehardened one.

the same applies for Pietta, with finishes that really look unrealistic. Well, they are using robots lately to manufacture them....depressing, but very cost effective indeed....

all the best

[Forty Rod]

Just to reiterate.

 WHY?

We are portraying an Era where these weapons were NEW or NEWish.
They were expensive, needed to function perfectly, so they'd have been taken rather good care of.

FLASHY!!!  You're still alive!   

Where have you been hiding for the last couple of years? 

[Roshi]

I've been to more museums than you can count and have looked at thousands of pictures of old guns.  It's pretty rare that any that were well used look anything close to new.  Wild Bill's 1851 in the Autry Museum was one of the best maintained "user" pistols I've ever seen.

I have a Colt 1911 Government Model that I bought used in 1998.  It left the factory in 1913 with a rich coat of Colt blue.  By 1998, while mechanically perfect, it only had about 5% blue left, all inside.  The remaining "finish" is all a nice gray patina. 

Who's to say how long it took for that delicate blue to wear off?  The SAA's and C&B Colts had a similar finish.

In the end it's a matter of personal taste.  You may prefer that your revolver look like it just came from the factory and had never been used.  I prefer mine looks like a well used hand tool. 

We're both right.

[Riot Earp]

Just to reiterate.

 WHY?

This thread was intended for people who like the antique look. I don't understand why people who *don't* like the antique look, want to throw cold water on a thread like this, and thus start a debate. I enjoy antiqued guns. I don't feel I should have to defend what I like.

I tell you what ... Buy a new gun and then carry it on a couple of six-month cattle drives, in a holster, out in the elements, and then tell me how it has changed.

[GunClick Rick]

I'd be surprised if you could find 3 guns on a cattle drive and those would most likely be owned by the cook and the boss~

[Palatine Tom]

Dear all,

Interessting topic.

This is how my ElTigre made in 1917-1925 looks like today. (And traveled through the Spanish Civil War as well)

I think it just looks great 


Tom

[St. George]

Don't try to compare weapons seen in museums as being representative of finish wear - or the lack thereof.

Museums aren't given pristine examples - they get what donors don't want or can't dispose of any other way.

The really nice stuff either goes to a relative or to friends - or gets sold.

Vaya,

Scouts Out!

[GunClick Rick]

I disagree a tad,i have givin local museum items in nice condition of course on loan for about a year,but i would agree with you long term,nice El Tigre   But then again we are talking weapons aren't we..You should see what my Lt PD cousin gets turned into him after a husband passes or something,you would cry!

[dusty texian]

There is a place for well used gun's and a place for near new looking gun's in our sport. I like to think a brand new looking Winchester,with all it's beauty and shine would look out of place in the hand's of a SouthWestener , say in the Texas badland's . Just as a, Well used gun may look out of place in the hand's of a Town Dude, Gambler or Storekeep .I can tell you from experiance in the desert S/W . oil  on your firearm is a No No . In a day or less, on the range ,if oiled your gun will look white. And when you wipe it off there goes that nice blue job. It goes away soon enough just being handled with that fine dust on them. I think locality had a lot to do with the condition of firearm's of this period as it does today. Say a Floridian of the time would prob. oil his gun regular ,and that finish may last decades.I for one have found this thread interesting. I have seen the time that a part must be replaced on an original gun and being able to get input fron some here has helped me match the old look on a new part on ocassion. Look's like about 2cent worth,,,,,,,,,Dusty Texian

[Mean Bob Mean]

There is a place for well used gun's and a place for near new looking gun's in our sport.

Nicely said mate.  I think if you develop a persona in this sport, and that persona is on the Frontier in say, 1874, why would his 1873 and cartridge pistols look beat up?  Really, unless your character is rough and tumble, likely most were kept up since they were expensive, important tools.  I like the idea of a worn shotgun as I think that would get the most use as a game and self defense firearm. 

[Indian Outlaw]

I'd be surprised if you could find 3 guns on a cattle drive and those would most likely be owned by the cook and the boss~

Read "Log of a Cowboy," by Andy Adams. 19th Century cowboys carried revolvers on cattle drives.

Having said that, this topic is titled "How-To," not "Debate." This thread has gotten off track. Since there are few guns being displayed, perhaps the thread has run its course and should be closed??