Percussion Revolver Nipple/Cone-Percussion Cap Trials and Tribulations

[Crow Choker]

WOW-Since the Marshall and his crew got thee Ol Forum back on track, the Ol Darksider section has been dead, other than Scrubby' postin about goin deer huntin in the 'Guns of the Darksiders'. Back last summer (2017) I got in a lather to change over the nipples (some's say cones-I prefer nipples) and I recall all the posts generated on the forum over the years. Couple were mine. Mako several times posted his in depth posts and CAM pictures that are still viewable. There's been a lotta posts asking what nipples are best-what caps are best-what combinations are best. So's-last summer I decided to change the nipples on a few of my favorite percussion revolvers and was in a quandary as what to use. I've always got along fine with whatever the manufacturer installed (don't fix unless broken is supposed to be the rule) using Remington #10's. I'll give CCI #11's a favorable 2nd.  I recall when Treso's were the rage of the gun range's, then along came SlixShots, with Track of the Wolf's Treso style in stainless steel. The Slix's seem to be the hot one now-Treso's are harder to find, but got to thinking, probably to much, what if I get A and B would have worked better, but C would have been better than A or B. ? To much 'what if', esp when I had no major problems with the factory nipples.


The only cylinder I had with anything other than factory was a cylinder I bought off of a guy for my Pietta 51 Navy 44 that had a set of Treso's installed. Besides that Navy I have one other Pietta, a ROA, and 8 Uberti's, all with factory nipples. Soooo'-after checking the required nipple size and threads on what I was going to change (most all interchange as to frame size), I bought several sets of SlixShots, several sets of Track Treso style, and already had some Treso's. What I've done is for example left two factory nipples on my 2nd model Uberti Dragoon, also installed two Slix's, and two Track-Wolf Treso style. Did the same with a Whitneyville Dragoon, and Walker. With the Navy Uberti frame size revolvers, left two factory and installed two Slix's and two Track-Wolf (1860/1851). Did the same with Pietta branded revolvers, but used factory, Slix's, and original Treso's. None of the guns are altered as far as external modifications to the hammer or frame slot, ie. JB welded hammer slot or cap rake posts. Internal parts were long ago smoothed up and arbors adjusted. Each gun will eventually get one complete set of one type after all is done.


I have on hand Rem #10, CCI #11's and Dyn Nobel RWS 1075 caps. I did buy once upon a time CCI 10's, they're useful for nothing except saying ya have some-way to tight of a fit for anything I have. The plan is to fire/shoot/try all of the various caps with the guns I installed the combination of nipples to see what stays on the best, ignites, the whole bowl of beans. This won't be any fancy cornographed fps, what cap sets off the FFF with more power, boom, and/or smoke in any measurable factor. Just what alot of readers have axed' over the years, what nipple works best and with what cap. Be done to the best of my ability and observance. I "ain't" no expert as far as however a 'expert percussion hogleg shooter' would be graded, but have been burning black powder in them since believe in was '72 when I purchased my first percussion revolver. Snapped alot of caps since then-have noticed and observed a lot of what works and what doesn't.


Yer all probably 'axin' why post this when ya haven't tried it yet. Just leavin us hangin out to dry with information but no results. The Darksider section of this forum looked a little lonely, no posts except Scrubby's since the Marshall debugged everything. I had too many irons in the fire last summer (2017) after I got the nipples to do my trials, same this year, just haven't taken the time. Busy with kids, grandkids, my Mothers estate, two nasty weather related winds necessitating alot of wind clean up from downed trees and/or limbs, some damage to out buildings (near tornado with one, at least not confirmed), hot humid weather, house remodel, and just plain Ol Procrastination.

 Besides, right now as I type this at 0943 hrs Central time (09-18-18) here in NorthCentral Iowa, the sky is black, the wind is blowing, rain is fallin heavy, I can hear the walnuts hitting steel roofing in outbuildings (spent 4 hrs yesterday pickin them things up), and figured ya'll needed something to read. Coffinmaker is always mentioning at time's he was bored so he'd post something. Anyway, before the snow flies, I'm gonna do it, test them nipples/cones with three different caps and report back to ya. Postin all this info now will save me anyway from 'splainin' it all then as to what and how I did it.  Maybe if all my efforts come to any great and needed conclusion a few of ya might even say "I god Woodrow, that's interestin to know"!

[Lefty Dude]

Good luck on your quest. Some day let us know how it all turns out.

After reading all that, well it's time for a nap. I am exhausted !!!!

[Coffinmaker]

Well Hey Choker     

I must say I await your test results on tender hooks.  Or with Bated Breath.  Or with great curiosity.  Wonderment as it twer.  It's always nice to see someone go to all the trouble to find answers to Life's serious questions.  Let's get on with it will ya    That fluffy white stuff is gonna fly pretty soon and then I won't be able to get out to the range to bust some of those Caps   

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[Crow Choker]

Good luck on your quest. Some day let us know how it all turns out.

After reading all that, well it's time for a nap. I am exhausted !!!!

Hey Lefty, You were shot just reading it, I had to change clothes as what I had on were all in a sweat, went back to bed and just got up thinking this was still Tuesday.

Gonna Do it Coffinmaker, Gonna do it. Have to monitor my good friend and shootin friend Jubal Starbuck though, as he may have shock symptoms when I do, as he's been inquiring for some time when I'm goin to do the trials. He knows of my procrastination tendencies.

[Navy Six]

Crow Choker, thanks for having the ambition to at least consider this lengthy experiment. Your results should be real interesting. Been trying to get out myself to test a 120 gr heel bullet(.375) from a new Accurate Mold. Plan is to use the one bullet for both percussion and 38LC conversions. We'll see, but there's been too much darn rain, weddings and visiting relatives to get out and shoot. Cowboy match scheduled for this Sunday and you guessed it--forecast is rain!!

[Bunk]

Hello the Camp!
I solved the problem with ignition and cap jams by installing Slixshot nipples and cap rakes onj the guns..
I have a pair of Uberti 1860 Army fitted with cap rakes (thanks 45 Dragoon) and Slixshot nipples along with Remington #10 caps (thanks Coffinmaker) and presently have about 300 rounds through the pair without a mis-fire or cap jam except occasionally with CCI or RWS caps and that is not included in the count.
They work OK with CCI#11 and RWS 1075 but for social events (matches) I go with the Remington cap.
The CCI and RWS caps occasional take a second strike but with the Remington cap the guns are very reliable
At least that is my experience take it for what it is worth.
Yr' Obt' Svt'
Bunk

[Coffinmaker]

Often, different components and after-market parts are optimized by their designers and manufacturers to provide optimum performance when combined with certain "other" products and or components.  Function with other than those "matched" items may result in less than a harmonious experience.  Once found, those components can provide a most pleasurable result.  Change one of the components and that wondrous performance can often just go inna toilette.  Burma Shave

[Crow Choker]

Often, different components and after-market parts are optimized by their designers and manufacturers to provide optimum performance when combined with certain "other" products and or components.  Function with other than those "matched" items may result in less than a harmonious experience.  Once found, those components can provide a most pleasurable result.  Change one of the components and that wondrous performance can often just go inna toilette.  Burma Shave

Ifin' I'm readin ya right Coffinmaker that's why I'm doing the different combinations, to see what works best with each revolver, although if I'da just bought some Slicks, Track/Wolf, or Treso's, using Rem 10's I'da been a happy camper and never thought otherwise, but I was curious. My CCI #11's were bought when Rem 10's were hard to get and the RWS's bought from estate sale because they were a good price. Then to, as I penned, I was getting pretty fair and constant results with the factory nipples. Just had to try and see. A lot of years of reloading for centerfire revolver/pistol and 'high power' rifle has shown me, as anybody else who has and/or has read gun mag authors, that if a particular primer, powder, bullet load that shoots 1/2 to 1 inch MOA at 100 yds in one rifle may not work worth a hoot in another rifle of the same caliber or even one of same caliber and model. Same with handgun. although most of my handgun work isn't from a rest trying to get tight groups on paper, in fact very little. I'm a combat handgun shooter-point shootin, double action, double tap stuff depending on what I'm firing, although I do take slow aimed shoots too. No shootin today, by the time it cleared off from rainin, to late to start anything else, raining again now. 6.3" so far and coming down in lard tubs.

[Bunk]

Hi Crow Choker,
Frankly I don't care if my percussion revolvers shoot MOA  or minute of moose all I want then to do is to hit an 18" target at rock chunking distance.
But it is imperative that they each work 5 times each one EVERY TIME for 6 stages...and so far they do. I will admit thre were some problems with a pair of .44's I have, but good advise and common sense has them now working like Swiss watches.

I did take some experimenting and burned up considerable powder, ball, and caps but they work.

That is my experience for what it is worth.
Respectfully submitted,
Bunk

[Crow Choker]

Minute of paper plate works for me with my cappers and conversions for fast work, minute of bean can for slower aimed shots OR ifin I'm shooting along a river area I stroll up and down shootin, minute of stick,  small rock rock, or carps head ifin one makes itself available.

[riflee]

I think the worst problem with nipples and caps is with the Colts. Remington designed their revolver with caps in mind and left abundance space for caps to fall off and little space for caps to fall in the action.  Colt did the opposite.


Best trick I've seen and used is the little pin not far from the cap (in a small hole in the frames hammer recess)  that stops the cap from falling in the action.  I just did one to a brass frame Colt type revolver. I used the smooth part of a small drill bit and put it press fit in a little hole at the end of the hammer recess (the hole didn't go clean thru the area it's drilled into) . Sturdy.

I deepened the notch in the hammer so the pin wasn't hit by the hammer. Works well.  The press fit eliminated threads or thread locker or JB Weld or any of that type of things. I used the smooth part of a small drill so the pin would be sturdy.  I got the idea of the small pin to block caps falling in the action from someone with the compassion and empathy to share a good idea.  That's honorable.


I have some Treso nipples but most of my cap&baller revolvers have stock manufactured nipples.


I imagine it would work well with any brand and size caps and nipples.

[Crow Choker]

Jest for all you wondering if I ever did my trials and tests of cap/nipple tribulations and didn't post the results. Nope, haven't yet. A cold rainy Iowa fall filled with a whole bunch of other activities kept me from doing. Seems the days I could have, rain, wind and such was always present. I could do it now I suppose, we're having a mild January for Iowa, but prefer to do in warmer sunny conditions. I shoot my percussion and other guns throughout winter with snow blanketed conditions, but believe the warmer coming spring will give more realistic conditions as to what most shooters shoot in. Be nicer doing anyway. Soooooo……… Will report when I do.

[Bunk]

Hello CC,
Cold weather sucks big time and I don't blame you.
Same here in central Texas and I have not gotten to shoot much either. No snow, but plenty of cold wind and rain.
My pair  of .44 1851 "Navy" Piettas snubbies have cap guards and reworked actions. They are set up with Slix nipples and are as reliable as cartridge guns with Remington $10  caps and target weight powder loads.
They are pretty reliable with CCI#11 or RWS #1075, but I have not done anything as complete or complex as you have planned.
We will be all very interested in your results and thank you for the effort.
Cap Gunz are fun!
Bunk

[Oregon Bill]

Rats, and here I was hoping to have mysteries of the universe 'splained by Crow Choker, but I, too, understand how life and lousy weather can derail a pressing inquiry. I keep an eye on central Iowa, as my daughter is a scientist for the USDA in Ames -- and on furlough just now. Paid my first visit to Iowa in October and it rained the whole time. Thought I was back in Oregon.
I may just go ahead and order SlixShots for the Pietta Remington New Model Army I have inbound, just in case ...

 

[Bruce W Sims]

I put far more stock in outcomes by the end users than the results documented by some marketing department.
Personally I don't think American enthusiasts do enough individual investigating unless there is the chance to bag a trophy
hanging in the balance. Of course, I tend to be a bit more academic than some, but I like to be able to reproduce an outcome
for myself before taking it as gospel. FWIW

Best Wishes,

Brucel

[Lefty Dude]

Lets all send him a Round Tuit, maybe that will get him excited enough to start this Year long project.

[Crow Choker]

Lets all send him a Round Tuit, maybe that will get him excited enough to start this Year long project.

Wish I could, but the cold and snow here in the Midwest just doesn't seem to wanta go away. Just had another 8-15" (Fri-Sat) here in North Iowa, 40 mph winds for 24+ hrs, with gusts 50-60 mph. Visibility down to 'O' much of the time. Some schools are on their 2nd day of cancelling, major roads were closed (I35/90), were just reopened late Mon PM, state and county plows still working at opening roads, major roads still frozen snow/ice covered, some area's along roads look like a junk yard with vehicles all positioned in different way's, travel not good, businesses closed. My gravel road had 2-3' drifts, took me 4 hrs Mon to blow snow that normally takes 1 hr to do around the place. 30-36" drifts in my 100' driveway that had to be knocked down with a grain shovel so my blower could handle em. Sub 0* temps with windchill in the minus *F. Another snow storm slated for this Friday with heavy snow......…! The "WOE" could go on, but we're one day closer to spring today than we were yesterday. (I hope not just by calendar).

Not much was reported in the main line media about the Iowa/Minnesota blizzard, as ususal, you won't hear about any bad snow/blizzard conditions unless it hits Chicago and/or the east coast, esp New York City---then they whine and cry and think the end is coming, even if they only get half or less of the snowfall we get here in the Midwest with far less mph winds. Guess we have more bark on our hides here in good Ol Iwaa' and Min-ni--sota!!!!!! 

All I can say is tighten yer seat belts, check yer saddle cinch, keep the coffee a-brewin', and keep feedin the chickens----spring is a-comin'!

[Pappy Myles]

Howdy CC

I was up in Minnesota for 2 years and just got back to my home state in Texas.   Burrrrrr   chilling experience..........so I'm back in the heat of things      Any progress on the Cap study?   inquiring minds want to know...........