EMF Hartford Model

[Abilene]

I may go with the Cimarron Model P and have the bushing installed right away. I know a smith who could do such a thing . How is that bushing held in place? Do y’all think VTI would carry them ?

 IMO a total waste of time and money.  But hey, your gun!

[MikeM.]

Having the bushing installed or the Uberti revolver period?

[Abilene]

The bushing.  I mean, 99.9% of the guns do not have a problem (talking Model P's.  Opentops/conversions probably a bit worse.  Some of those would get a primer sized indentation around the FP hole).  If yours turns out to be the 0.1% that does, put a bushing in then.  Just my opinion.   On the other hand, if you want to do it "just because" well, most of us can relate to that!  

Otherwise, if you do start to raise a little burr in the FP hole, stone it down flat and diagnose and fix whatever caused it so it doesn't happen again.

[Advertising]

[MikeM.]

So , don’t fix it if it ain’t broke, right ?? Pretty good advise ..... thanks

[45 Dragoon]

I agree with Abilene. I got an El Patron Comp when they first came out. It gets "exercised"  100 cycles a day (used to be 50 but I have 2 cylinders. 2x50). Had a burr appear, dressed it down and haven't had any problems since.

Mike

[Bibbyman]

The bushing.  I mean, 99.9% of the guns do not have a problem (talking Model P's.  Opentops/conversions probably a bit worse.  Some of those would get a primer sized indentation around the FP hole).  If yours turns out to be the 0.1% that does, put a bushing in then.  Just my opinion.   On the other hand, if you want to do it "just because" well, most of us can relate to that!  

Otherwise, if you do start to raise a little burr in the FP hole, stone it down flat and diagnose and fix whatever caused it so it doesn't happen again.

I'd say the chances of a Uberti Cattleman incurring the damage that I've shown is more like zero if not abused in some way.  I bought my first Uberti Cattleman in 45 Colt in early '70s and shot many hundreds of "Elmer Keith" loads through it plus thousands of factory equivalent reloads through it and it's still just fine.  Another 8 we use for Cowboy Action Shooting have not had this problem.

If the cratering was a common problem, someone would provide a service to make a repair or have a kit of sorts.  Of three major professional gunsmith services I have talked with in person,  none had see this kind of damage before.  I don't think they were aware Uberti didn't have a bushing. 

I've done a lot of research and not came up with another example of damage like this.  If the original owner knows how it happened,  he's not telling. 

Having said that,  I'd say 100% of Uberti Cattleman will develop a burr at the 6 o'clock position of the firing pin hole.  The only way to avoid this burr is not to shoot it.  It happens more often when new and diminishes as they get more use.  But the firing pin hole may be a little egg shaped after many thousand of rounds.

[MikeM.]

Awesome! Thanks guys!! Kinda off subject but would it be difficult to install an older, 1st gen style cone firing pin on a Uberti? Saw them along with the bushing we have been discussing on Peacemaker Specialist website

[Professor Marvel]

Awesome! Thanks guys!! Kinda off subject but would it be difficult to install an older, 1st gen style cone firing pin on a Uberti? Saw them along with the bushing we have been discussing on Peacemaker Specialist website

My Dear Mike -

since you askde, it is dirt simple to describe:

1) remove all parts from frame, including barrel
2) tie frame down, plumb, square, and true, on a jig on your milling table
3) turn & thread a quick brass bushing on your lathe to protect frame barrel threads, which fits end mill
4) complete mill-machine setup, measure 5 times, mill hole of approp dim to approp. depth.
5) drive fit bushing into whole, use appropriate glue or stake as desired
6) stone everyhting you touch all smooth again
7) test and fit firing pin protusion
fix everything you buggered up
9) put gun back together, retime anything that requires it.

but harder to actually do. Set-up and measurement is essentail and the downfall of many projects.

note that the measurement, fixturing , stoning and fitting are not trivial, and if you have to ask I can stear you
to several really good books of the nature:
 "how to learn apprentice-level machining on the mill and lathe at home (whilst you hold your breath) in 10 easy years."

I like to advise folks start with cheap junker C&B guns first, learn on scrap materials, and prepare to "go broke slowly"
whilst the original project is still waiting.....

BTW, I am only "competent" at silver soldering and brazing, still learning to TIG, and can't make a good strong arc welding bead to save my life. But I can sure build up molten metal into an ugly pile..... My wife claims it is "art" ....

yhs
prof marvel

[Bibbyman]

Bibbyman, it's the cylinder. Most of todays new gunsmiths have no idea hoe to get it out of the way.

You were joking but we've showed these pistols to three different gunsmiths and they all opened the loading gate and tried to turn the cylinder.    I had to point out that they were not Rugers.   

Mike, have you found the right gun yet?

[MikeM.]

Not yet .... I just bought a Cimarron Tichards type II in 44 special with 8 inch barrel though and am pretty pumped about that!!!! I will eventually run across an old EMF Hartford Model In 44-40.

[Coffinmaker]

BIBBYMAN!!

I just about fell out of my Recliner (difficult to do) laughing so hard.  No laughing at you, understand, laughing that some/most crackpots calling themselves "Gunsmith" don't know the difference between a Colt pattern SA and a Ruger.  I am however, not at all surprised.  I could just see myself taking my gun back from the said "Gunsmith" and walking back out the door without saying a word.  Just back slowly out the door.

MikeM,
Neither Uberti nor Pietta guns are intended to run a Colt Conical firing pin.  The Colt Conical will immediately pucker and burr the firing pin hole in a Uberti.  It wouldn't do a Pietta any good either.  Uberti recoil shields are intended for smaller diameter concave firing pins.  You could run the Conical as long as you are prepared to repair the Puckers and Burrs as the Firing Pin breaks through the recoil shield.

[MikeM.]

Could the firing pin hole on the Uberti be slightly opened up to accommodate the conical pin? Not a biggie , I was just wondering what it would take and I am a low budget authenticity freak with a few gun skills . Will the Colt conical pin fit into the Uberti hammer ok? Oh, and I too have encountered some of these gunsmiths myself. I had one argue with me once that the 44-40 was not an old west caliber. Needless to say, he didn’t get my business.

[Fox Creek Kid]

Well, I am the odd man out on this as both of the '72 Open Tops I owned as well as a '60 Army RM all needed work on the FP holes. Two I had recoil plates bushed by John Hooper in CA (don't know if he is still in business so don't ask me) and he could not do it on the RM as it is too thin. He had to TIG weld it up and then file down. I had a friend with an original RIC revolver who had to have it done after a mere few hundred rounds of BP ammo. In my revolvers I only shot my BP handloads.

This problem was quite obvious in the early 1870's as the Russian inspectors working at S&W demanded a recoil plate on the Russian Model. Uberti has never been good about correcting problems and I doubt they will start now.

[Coffinmaker]

Well ....... PLUS ONE to Fox Creek Kid.  Understand this, one and all ........

Uberti make what they make ..... The way they make it ..... Uberti are NOT going to change.  If you don't like the way Uberti make their guns (I DON'T - AT ALL), then buy something else (at's what I do).

[Fox Creek Kid]

Well ....... PLUS ONE to Fox Creek Kid.  Understand this, one and all ........

Uberti make what they make ..... The way they make it ..... Uberti are NOT going to change.  If you don't like the way Uberti make their guns (I DON'T - AT ALL), then buy something else (at's what I do).

What really made me mad at Uberti was their changing the ROT on their .44 rifle/carbine barrels!!