44 Russian STD smokeless loading. Need advice

[Black River Smith]

I have search the web and here for loading this round with smokeless 'Unique' but I feel I am seeing conflicting info.

To start, while shooting CAS I strictly used BP or sub for all my cartridges.  But now I do most of my shooting at an indoor range that only allows smokeless.  I am using these rounds in a new Uberti Cattleman with a 44spl cylinder only, I would not use them in my Cim 1872 Open Top(unless you have personal experience doing so).  I am only looking to reproduce the standard BP load velocities of about 760fps as Mike Venturino has produced in his books.  He does not show working up 44 Russian in his smokeless section only the 44Spl.

I have the Lyman 429251 bullet mould that was listed as the suggested russian bullet in the 39th edition of Lymans Reloading manual but I would not use their Unique MAX suggested load.

About a year ago I started looking at all my sources and the web compiling powders and loads, then decide on something between 4.5 and 5.0 grains.  But now that I am finally ready to load them I am 'feeling' somewhat uncertain about this range.  Seems somewhat high.  Since I do not have a chrongragh and shoot mainly at an indoor range I cannot do the normal 'work up' and have to live with published loads.

The Lyman 49th edition list a range of 4.0(607fps) to 4.5(711fps) with the 245 grain bullet (429383, which I use as my 44Spl bullet) but that seems low for this cartridge.

Does anyone have a good working load that is near the original BP load velocities of about 760fps?  Or do I stay at the sub 4.5 grain level and just accept that I cannot reach 760?  If so then I may just use them in the Cim Open Top too.

Thanks
BRS

[Drydock]

Often you will not get BP performance out of these calibers with smokeless. The pressure curve is just too different.

THUS: Using your published data, use the starting load and work up,  you do not need a Cronograph.  Work up to a load that shoots to the desired impact point at the desired range using your desired sight picture with your desired bullet.  A load that hits to your point of aim is more important than duplicating exact velocities.  

Because of the different mass ejection taking place, a smokeless load that hits to the same point of aim as your BP load most likely will have a lower velocity.  

[Trailrider]

I have search the web and here for loading this round with smokeless 'Unique' but I feel I am seeing conflicting info.

To start, while shooting CAS I strictly used BP or sub for all my cartridges.  But now I do most of my shooting at an indoor range that only allows smokeless.  I am using these rounds in a new Uberti Cattleman with a 44spl cylinder only, I would not use them in my Cim 1872 Open Top(unless you have personal experience doing so).  I am only looking to reproduce the standard BP load velocities of about 760fps as Mike Venturino has produced in his books.  He does not show working up 44 Russian in his smokeless section only the 44Spl.

I have the Lyman 429251 bullet mould that was listed as the suggested russian bullet in the 39th edition of Lymans Reloading manual but I would not use their Unique MAX suggested load.

About a year ago I started looking at all my sources and the web compiling powders and loads, then decide on something between 4.5 and 5.0 grains.  But now that I am finally ready to load them I am 'feeling' somewhat uncertain about this range.  Seems somewhat high.  Since I do not have a chrongragh and shoot mainly at an indoor range I cannot do the normal 'work up' and have to live with published loads.

The Lyman 49th edition list a range of 4.0(607fps) to 4.5(711fps) with the 245 grain bullet (429383, which I use as my 44Spl bullet) but that seems low for this cartridge.

Does anyone have a good working load that is near the original BP load velocities of about 760fps?  Or do I stay at the sub 4.5 grain level and just accept that I cannot reach 760?  If so then I may just use them in the Cim Open Top too.

Thanks
BRS

For what cartridge is your M1872 Open Top chambered? Is it .44 Russian or .44 Special? I have very little experience with the .44 Russian cartridge, although in looking through my records I found loads somewhat hotter than those listed, which apparently were okay in a S&W New Model #3.  My recommendation is that you go with the Lyman listed loads. If the Open Top has the 8" barrel, you might be surprised at the velocity...if you had a chronograph.  In any event, I wouldn't worry about the velocity if the loads will shoot to the same general point of impact with the same hold. About the only way to increase the MV with Unique would be to go to a lighter bullet.  That would probably lower the point of impact.  Best of luck!

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[Black River Smith]

Drydock,

The cattleman has never had BP in them an probably won't.  So I do not know where BP russian would hit for a comparison as you discribe.

Trialrider,

My Open Top was an earlier model that was chambered in 44Colt but will handle the larger rims of the standard 44.  I am not really worried about these smokeless rounds for the OT but strictly for the Cattleman.

Because of only having acess to an indoor range I cannot attempt the suggested shooting comparison.