Author Topic: loading 12ga with 777 FFG & FFFG  (Read 6827 times)

Offline Buckhorn Woodie

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loading 12ga with 777 FFG & FFFG
« on: April 19, 2014, 05:24:57 PM »
I am trying to go to the dark side and I am in need  of some 12ga recipes using 777.

what I have on hand is about a 1 1/2 pound of FF and 3/4 of a pound of FFF

AA hulls and AA pink super-light 1 - 1 1/8 oz wads

any help would be appreciated :)

Offline FlyingZebra

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Re: loading 12ga with 777 FFG & FFFG
« Reply #1 on: April 19, 2014, 06:51:25 PM »
Look at shotgun loads as 'dram equiv'

What is the gun you're shooting?
If it's antique - "have qualified gunsmith check condition for safety..." before shooting.
 ;)

3 or 3-1/2 Dram black powder, equal volume shot or weight of payload to suit your need etc.

Separate with greased wad, card over powder.
Select wad and card diameters to suit your hulls.  12ga for plastic (which will be good for at least one load) or 11 or 10 ga for the brass hulls (which can be more trouble than they're worth)
Firm roll or star crimp with good compression.

2f is fine, with your 777 start with 3 dram and see how it patterns.  Start with 2f, if patterns are ok with 3 drams go ahead and try the 3f with the same volume.  

I've shot black in 16bore shotguns and double rifles for about ten years.   The process is this simple, much easier than you could imagine.



FZ
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Offline Blair

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Re: loading 12ga with 777 FFG & FFFG
« Reply #2 on: April 19, 2014, 07:19:51 PM »
The "dark side"?
Why are you using 777?
Is that not one of those "pretend" BP powders, but different? I hope I am incorrect.
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Re: loading 12ga with 777 FFG & FFFG
« Reply #3 on: Today at 01:52:33 AM »

Offline Dick Dastardly

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Re: loading 12ga with 777 FFG & FFFG
« Reply #3 on: April 19, 2014, 07:30:15 PM »
Buckhorn doesn't say why he's using 777, but Genuine Powder can be difficult to get in some parts of our great free country.  All that said, Genuine Powder in FFg is all your scattergun could dream of using.

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Offline FlyingZebra

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Re: loading 12ga with 777 FFG & FFFG
« Reply #4 on: April 19, 2014, 07:40:51 PM »
Yes on good black -- I use Goex 2f for 12 and 16 bore
Local supply is nil.  I order from suppliers, shipped to my door.



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Offline Blair

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Re: loading 12ga with 777 FFG & FFFG
« Reply #5 on: April 19, 2014, 08:16:48 PM »
Sorry.

I must have been incorrect about 777 being a "dark side" powder.
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Blair
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Offline FlyingZebra

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Re: loading 12ga with 777 FFG & FFFG
« Reply #6 on: April 19, 2014, 09:19:39 PM »
The most significant advantage of real black (besides the super easy and consistent ignition) is that the only chemical needed for cleanup is cold water.
I even wash and re-use my cloth patches.

Not so with the substitutes.



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Offline Cuts Crooked

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Re: loading 12ga with 777 FFG & FFFG
« Reply #7 on: April 19, 2014, 10:20:53 PM »
Gang, let's try to remember the words in the link that opens the door to The Den.......Welcome to the chamber for discussing all aspects of the use of Black Powder and its substitutes in CAS.
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Offline FlyingZebra

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Re: loading 12ga with 777 FFG & FFFG
« Reply #8 on: April 19, 2014, 11:26:52 PM »
777 is definitely a gateway substance.
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Offline Pettifogger

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Re: loading 12ga with 777 FFG & FFFG
« Reply #9 on: April 20, 2014, 12:17:45 AM »
Getting back to the OPs question, you can't get enough powder in the shell with the pink wads.  Usually I give powder recommendations by volume equivalent, but since the OP is new to this I'll give actual grain weights.  What I have used for thousands of BP shells is 35 to 38 grains of 777 ffg, a Winchester or Claybuster orange wad and one ounce of shot in the AA hull.  Pleasant load that will take down any knockdown.

As far as cleaning, all I have ever used for real BP, APP or 777 is plain old warm water.

Offline The Swede

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Re: loading 12ga with 777 FFG & FFFG
« Reply #10 on: April 20, 2014, 04:44:47 PM »
When have shot 777 I have used the 4.3 cc dipper (Lee), for powder, and shot. Using fibre wads. Works great. Easy clean up with water. No lube needed.

Swede

Offline hellgate

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Re: loading 12ga with 777 FFG & FFFG
« Reply #11 on: April 20, 2014, 05:03:21 PM »
Pettifogger and Buckhorn,
The AA type wads are great for various loads. You can load the wad "as is" if it'll fit OR you can cut the "legs" or struts out from between the OP wad part and the shot cup and load the maximum powder and shot that will fit in the case OR you can cut across the "legs", rotate one half the wad 90 degrees and push them together for a mid length wad. That gives you 3 wad lengths in one: full length, mid length, and shortest. Just be sure to pattern it against a box with a sheet of butcher paper stapled to it at about 10 yards to see what load/shot/powder/wad gives the best pattern. Mark an aiming point onto the paper so you know where each barrel actually hits, you might be surprised how high,low, or wide it shoots.
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Offline Pettifogger

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Re: loading 12ga with 777 FFG & FFFG
« Reply #12 on: April 20, 2014, 05:38:09 PM »
All kinds of things can be MADE to work.  If I started cutting plastic wads it would take more time than its worth to load a box of shells.  Like I said, Winchester orange wad, 777 and an ounce of shot.  No chopping, hacking or fitting.  Just fill up the shot and powder hopper on my progressive press and start pumping out hundreds of rounds.  The OP sounds like a beginner.  My advice was a way to do the job simply, not how to do it the hard way.

Offline Sir Charles deMouton-Black

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Re: loading 12ga with 777 FFG & FFFG
« Reply #13 on: April 21, 2014, 12:52:20 AM »
All kinds of things can be MADE to work.  If I started cutting plastic wads it would take more time than its worth to load a box of shells.  Like I said, Winchester orange wad, 777 and an ounce of shot.  No chopping, hacking or fitting.  Just fill up the shot and powder hopper on my progressive press and start pumping out hundreds of rounds.  The OP sounds like a beginner.  My advice was a way to do the job simply, not how to do it the hard way.

I think the "orange"wad is the bulk-bag version?  I found that the AA114... wad works with about 60 gr of powder & 1 oz. of shot, "yor mileage may vary!) i. e. adjust the quantities until you get a suitable load-stack to crimp properly.

Samewise, using a shorter version of your favorite wad works when you shorten and rollcrimp for 2 1/2" loads.
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Re: loading 12ga with 777 FFG & FFFG
« Reply #14 on: April 21, 2014, 11:28:46 PM »
There are so many variables depending the size of the shot and the application you just need to experiment around to find which load works best for you.
I would also suggest using real BP if you can find it.
 
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Offline Blue Wolf

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Re: loading 12ga with 777 FFG & FFFG
« Reply #15 on: April 30, 2014, 08:19:54 PM »
Pettifogger's load is a good load for this sport. Simple and easy.

Offline Lefty Dude

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Re: loading 12ga with 777 FFG & FFFG
« Reply #16 on: May 01, 2014, 12:59:17 AM »
45-50 gr's of Goex fff gets the job done, real well

 

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