Author Topic: Hollywood Laziness  (Read 13041 times)

Offline pawneefork

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Hollywood Laziness
« on: February 15, 2014, 07:26:57 PM »
I just watched 'Last Of The Dogmen' and was as disgusted as usual to see 'Indians' in smooth-side-out hide costumes, some of which have beadwork patterns painted on.  It seems that no movie ever ever ever gets it right, though they have budgets in the millions.  Dance With Wolves was one of the worst offenders.  I annoy the staff at my Blockbuster when I complain that the Coen Bros version of True Grit, set in 1871, uses an 1873 Colt with a cross pin from 1896.  It's a small thing, but apparently no one in California knows a thing about history/.  Or cares.

Offline Major 2

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Re: Hollywood Laziness
« Reply #1 on: February 15, 2014, 07:43:57 PM »
 ;D  here we go  :)
when planets align...do the deal !

Offline Bugscuffle

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Re: Hollywood Laziness
« Reply #2 on: February 17, 2014, 06:43:04 PM »
Yes, ignorance of the historical correctness of a particular piece of a movie or prop on a movie is irritating to those of us that want to use our scant knowledge of history to pretend that it just ruined the whole thing for us.
I will no longer respond to the rants of the small minded that want to sling mud rather than discuss in an adult manner.

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Re: Hollywood Laziness
« Reply #3 on: Today at 03:47:36 AM »

Offline Mean Bob Mean

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Re: Hollywood Laziness
« Reply #3 on: February 17, 2014, 07:22:27 PM »
Coen Bros version of True Grit, set in 1871 . . .

They used 1873 rifles as well did they not?  Portis said in an interview the movie took place in 1873,a s I recall, but Parker became the judge there in 1875 which he is the one portrayed no?
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Offline Shawnee McGrutt

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Re: Hollywood Laziness
« Reply #4 on: February 18, 2014, 07:20:32 AM »
Movies are stories to entertain use, if we go to every movie to nitpick this or that we lose the entertainment value.  Don't get me wrong i believe Hollyweird , produces a lot of junk that isn't worth watching.  But, in defense of the movie industry, they may have millions of dollars for their budgets, but there's other expenses besides props to consider.  Salaries, location cost, post production and promotion cost all eat up a budget quickly.  In my opinion, as long as a movie has the look and the feel to convey the story line, something's can be overlooked.  As for the movie "Last of the Dogman",if the costumes of the Native Americans bothered you, how about that they were in the 20th. Century  and still living as if it was the 1870's?  With this improbable fact of history, I found the storyline strong enough to work and enjoyed the movie.  Why ruin an evening out over something trivial
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Offline Slamfire

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Re: Hollywood Laziness
« Reply #5 on: February 18, 2014, 07:39:32 PM »
 I'v seen it (last of the dog men)at least 7-8 ttimes ,,,I keep hoping the dog will figure out which one shoot him ,,,and p__s on his face while he is asleep. I 'v enjoyed the movie every time,,and I also saw some no-no's.







  Hootnix.

Offline Grenadier

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Re: Hollywood Laziness
« Reply #6 on: February 19, 2014, 04:39:06 AM »
It's not cowboy movies alone that Hollyweird screws up, it's nearly every historical movie made since the invention of film.
Roman soldiers wearing leather armour
Vikings wearing fur vests
Using cranes to mount knights on horses
Wearing trousers in Kingdom of Heaven
Arrows piercing maile armour
Federal soldiers wearing kepis
Infantrymen wearing black boots in Saving Private Ryan

I could do this stuff all day, but at the end of that day, only nerds care about this extreme accuracy in film. General audiences don't care and that's what bankrolls Hollyweird, not a small group of nerds complaining about the shape of Iron Man's helmet.

Offline Shawnee McGrutt

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Re: Hollywood Laziness
« Reply #7 on: February 19, 2014, 09:39:05 AM »
Slamfire,  never thought on those lines about "Last of the Dogmen",  we could high jack  this thread, rename the Indian  who shoot the dog.
1. Pee Eye  :o
2. Chief  Golden Rain in Face.  ::)
3. He Who slept with Open Mouth.  :D
But if I were that dog I would be seeking a worse fate for that brave.  I would  leave a big pile right square in his face, then they would rename him,  Sweet Cheeks.  :-[
Boredom has gotten the best of me, so I won't bore you folks any longer .
Keep your powder dry,
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Offline Ol Gabe

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Re: Hollywood Laziness
« Reply #8 on: February 19, 2014, 10:12:49 AM »
S.M,
Anyone that rides a horse like that ain't boring in my book!
Best regards and good shooting!
'Ol  Gabe

Offline River City John

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Re: Hollywood Laziness
« Reply #9 on: February 19, 2014, 10:04:49 PM »


Federal soldiers wearing kepis

I could do this stuff all day, but at the end of that day, only nerds care about this extreme accuracy in film. General audiences don't care and that's what bankrolls Hollyweird, not a small group of nerds complaining about the shape of Iron Man's helmet.

Uhhmmm Grenadier, I have many tintype and ambrotype images of Federal soldiers wearing kepis in my collection.

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Offline St. George

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Re: Hollywood Laziness
« Reply #10 on: February 19, 2014, 10:27:58 PM »
Indeed, as do I.

Roman 'greaves' were made of boiled leather, and woodcuts illustrate heavily-armored knights being lifted onto their destriers.

And a bodkin point launched from an English longbow could quite easily penetrate mail...

And a form of trousers was in use long before the Crusades...

And the prop men for 'Saving Private Ryan' contracted with the Corcoran Boot Company to provide brown jump boots with the correctly-marked soles...

'Getting it Right' has become a watchword for some directors - but older movies didn't reflect that happy fact.

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Offline Grenadier

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Re: Hollywood Laziness
« Reply #11 on: February 20, 2014, 04:44:29 AM »
Uhhmmm Grenadier, I have many tintype and ambrotype images of Federal soldiers wearing kepis in my collection.

RCJ

You might have photos of them wearing forage caps, but I would bet you breakfast they are not wearing kepis. Kepis were worn by officers as private purchase, but the Federal government never issued kepis to enlisted during the American Civil War.

Kepi

http://www.njsekela.com/images/confederatekepi.jpg


Forage Cap


http://www.fighting69th.org/images/eq_cap.jpg



Offline Grenadier

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Re: Hollywood Laziness
« Reply #12 on: February 20, 2014, 04:59:32 AM »
Indeed, as do I.

Roman 'greaves' were made of boiled leather, and woodcuts illustrate heavily-armored knights being lifted onto their destriers.
Been a student of Roman military equipment for a decade, studied original examples in many museums and collections in Europe. There is NO evidence the Romans used leather for armour, not even one extant example of a leather greave for nearly 700 years if history. As for illustrations showing knights being hoisted in to their mounts with cranes, these are for tourney suits of armour, not combat.

And a bodkin point launched from an English longbow could quite easily penetrate mail...

There is no conclusive evidence that an arrow launched from an English longbow will "easily" pierce properly constructed maille. Bodkins will pierce yes, but typically only the points themselves. With that, the wearer would be protected by the gambeson underneath. There are accounts of Crusaders emerging from battle "bristling with as arrows as porcupines" I can happily share information with you if you are interested in the "arrow vs. armor" debate.

And a form of trousers was in use long before the Crusades...

Just because something existed before, does not mean it was still in use later.  Linen boxer shorts (braies) and long wool stockings (hosen) were the norm for make legwear from the Viking Age through the 16th century. Trousers are virtually unheard of in this prior in Western Europe.

And the prop men for 'Saving Private Ryan' contracted with the Corcoran Boot Company to provide brown jump boots with the correctly-marked soles... I know, I owned two pairs and two complete screen uniforms at one time. However, watch the film again, there are plenty of black boots being worn. The reason is many of the soldiers you see in the background are modern day Irish Arm soldiers hired as extras. The Germans were largely played by a re-enacting group out of England, The Second Battle Group.

'Getting it Right' has become a watchword for some directors - but older movies didn't reflect that happy fact.

Scouts Out!





Offline Camille Eonich

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Re: Hollywood Laziness
« Reply #13 on: February 24, 2014, 07:34:12 PM »
You might have photos of them wearing forage caps, but I would bet you breakfast they are not wearing kepis. Kepis were worn by officers as private purchase, but the Federal government never issued kepis to enlisted during the American Civil War.

Kepi

http://www.njsekela.com/images/confederatekepi.jpg


Forage Cap


http://www.fighting69th.org/images/eq_cap.jpg




Does that mean that they couldn't pick them up and wear them if their heads were cold?

Women never wore britches either.  We know this because photographs from that era never showed them wearing britches.
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Offline Grenadier

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Re: Hollywood Laziness
« Reply #14 on: February 25, 2014, 10:06:07 AM »
Federal cavalry could have been mounted on unicorns  ;)

Offline Shawnee McGrutt

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Re: Hollywood Laziness
« Reply #15 on: February 25, 2014, 07:01:01 PM »
The pixie dust that unicorns leave behind would have made it easy for the Indians , to follow.  Only  fair maidens rode unicorns in Medieval 
Europe. ;D
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Offline Stu Kettle

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Re: Hollywood Laziness
« Reply #16 on: February 26, 2014, 07:00:24 AM »
Now this just getting silly. Everyone knows there haven't been any unicorns since the time of the big flood. They missed the boat.

Offline Mean Bob Mean

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Re: Hollywood Laziness
« Reply #17 on: February 26, 2014, 01:39:26 PM »
Now this just getting silly. Everyone knows there haven't been any unicorns since the time of the big flood. They missed the boat.

Those that did not were killed by Noah's sons.  They used 1892s almost exclusively.
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Offline FriscoCounty

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Re: Hollywood Laziness
« Reply #18 on: February 26, 2014, 02:36:51 PM »
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Offline Hill Beachy

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Re: Hollywood Laziness
« Reply #19 on: March 09, 2014, 04:05:12 PM »
Now this just getting silly. Everyone knows there haven't been any unicorns since the time of the big flood. They missed the boat.

That sir, is a blatant falsehood.  Everyone knows that unicorns are from what is now north Korea!

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2012/nov/30/unicorn-lair-discovered-north-korea

http://newsfeed.time.com/2012/11/30/unicorns-existence-proven-says-north-korea/ 
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