Author Topic: Estimated number of Colt copys manufactured by Confederate gun makers.  (Read 7219 times)

Offline St8LineLeatherSmith

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I had researched this some time ago and just forgot the numbers right off the top of my head luckally I kept it wrote down for such occasions as this. i am being specific to the confederacy's manufacturers who were producing 1851 navy copy's but I also included some data of Spiller and Burr and Cofer who made copys of the Whitney Revolver.

Griswold & Gunnison, also known as Griswold & Grier made Brass-framed copies of the Colt Navy 1851 in .36", estimated 3700 made

Leech & Rigdon and Rigdon, Ansley Steel-framed .36" copies of the Colt Navy 1851, 2400 made

Augusta Machine Works Steel-framed .36" copies of the Colt Navy 1851, estimated 100 made

Colombus Firearms Manufacturing Company .36" Steel-framed copies of the Colt Navy 1851, less than 100 made

Revolvers made in the Confederacy, however not on military contract

Cofer: .36" copys of the Whitney, only 13 known
Schneider & Glassick: .36"colt navy copy's, 50 recorded
Sisterdale: steel framed .36" 1851 Colt Navy copy's only 6 made

Texas-made revolvers

The J.H.Dance & Brothers actually made estimated 360 .44" Colt copys and 135 .36" colt copys
130 Tucker & Sherrard, and 400 Clark & Sherrard 3rd model Dragoon copys made

L.E. Tucker & Sons made .36" Steel-framed copies of the Colt Navy 1851 no data on the numbers manufactured
 Laban E Tucker worked in Marshall, TX in the 1850s, Lancaster, TX in 1861 - 1864, and Weatherford after 1864..


add the estimated total of 1500 Spiller and Burr models
brings the  estimated total to 9969
this is an estimate not a definitive number.
The factory ceased production at war's end with slightly more than 1,500 revolvers fabricated, fulfilling only one tenth the number called for in the original contract.
   snippet from http://www.csarmory.org/spiller/spiller.html

European-made revolvers

Le Mat 9 rounds + 1 shot barrelA total of about 3,000 Le Mat's revolvers were made, but the exact number of them that reached the Confederacy is unknown


Kerr Sidehammer british-made revolver
Serial numbers of the revolvers delivered to the Confederate army situate between 3000 and 10000.

Lefaucheux 1854  Pinfire 12 mm  French revolver

Liège-made revolvers  - 2.000 to 5.000 French Lefaucheux 1854 revolvers (estimated)

- 5.000 or more revolvers of the same type, or of the 2nd and 3rd type, in 12 and 9 mm calibers, of Belgian, Spanish and British origin

- 9.000 British Kerr percussion revolvers (serial between 3.000 and 10.000, plus the pre-war deliveries)

All these guns were supplied by the London Armoury Co to Caleb Huse

- 8.000 LeMat percussion revolvers, including 3.000 for the Navy (an estimated number of 3.000 reached the South. Delivered by LeMat & Girard)

- An unknown number of various European made percussion revolvers, including Liège copies of the Colt 1851 Navy made by N. Gillon and other Liège gunmakers.

According to some authors, the 20 very first LeMat have been produced in the US y John Krider, while the first 450 serial numbers of the 1st Model were made at Liège. This is possible but highly doubtful, as only one Liège-made LeMat, contemporary of the Civil War, is known to be in existence today. It is a 2nd model with a high serial#, and its condition is close to mint. The maker is still unknown today, and no mention of a possible Liège contract has been found in the LeMat & Girard archives. However, the gun is of high quality and strictly identical to those made by LeMat & Girard.

Between 1858-59 and 1865, no trace of any increased activity can be found in the Liège gunmaking industry, which could indicate any war production effort, nor mass exportations to the United States.

We can conclude that the few thousands of Liège-made revolvers that found their way to Confederate hands were only parts of lots purchased on the European market by the LAC agents. No order from the Confederacy was ever placed by any Liège gunmaker, and it seems that none of the Liège gunmakers was interested in the potential market generated by that distant conflict

                                                                    

 http://www.littlegun.info/arme%20americaine/revolver%20confedere/a%20a%20revolver%20confedere%20gb.htm

Sam Colt shipped 2,230 of his new .44 Army revolvers to Southern Agents. He did this on the eve of the war 1860-1861.

http://www.hansenguns.com/TorC.php
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Offline Shotgun Franklin

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Re: Estimated number of Colt copys manufactured by Confederate gun makers.
« Reply #1 on: January 24, 2014, 09:33:12 AM »
Many, at least 25, years ago I was at a gun show in Houston. A Dealer was stopping people at the door who were bringing old guns into the show and buying some of'm. A man brought in an old BP revolver which the Dealer snapped up at the asking price of about $200, if I recall correctly. Anyway the Dealer was really happy and showed of the original Dance Revolver, a .44 I think. I think it was an excellent buy.
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Offline St. George

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Re: Estimated number of Colt copys manufactured by Confederate gun makers.
« Reply #2 on: January 24, 2014, 10:50:10 AM »
Looks like the information found in:

'Confederate Handguns' - Albaugh, Benet, Simmons.

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Offline Tsalagidave

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Re: Estimated number of Colt copys manufactured by Confederate gun makers.
« Reply #3 on: January 24, 2014, 11:38:31 AM »
Great topic St8line. I've thought about buying the repro Dance Bros. pistol for years but the real ones were so sparsely distributed, it would limit my options on an impression to carry one so I stuck with the 3rd gen Colt stuff.

I do love it when I see Trans-Mississippi CW officers carry a correct homespun CS pistol here and there though.

-Dave
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Online Mogorilla

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Re: Estimated number of Colt copys manufactured by Confederate gun makers.
« Reply #4 on: January 24, 2014, 02:28:20 PM »
I just bought a Dance Bros. Repro, present to myself for graduation, MBA from KU.  Could only justify the JayHawkness if I rounded it out with a Reb revolver. ;D

Luckily my experience at those Gun Shows prevented a similar tale being told.  Buddy had traded a next to nothing vcr for a mid sized Samurai sword, they guys dad brought it home in WWII.  He offered it to me for a better VCR, but I thought I would be taking advantage of him.   We went to one of those Gun/Knife shows offering money for real swords.   Offers flew at us when we walked in.  Luckily for him a guy pulled us over, gave us a document tube to put it in and showed us in a book that he had an 18th century okinawan samurai sword, they were distinctive in their use of bamboo.   He gave my buddy a list of reputable dealers.  On the way home he asked me to keep the information between us.   His then finance, later wife ran off leaving him with loads of debt.  He called one of the collectors, a Japanese business man.  Debt paid off, new car bought and sword back in Japan.   

Offline Tsalagidave

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Re: Estimated number of Colt copys manufactured by Confederate gun makers.
« Reply #5 on: January 24, 2014, 03:22:22 PM »
Mogorilla,

You're a good man and a good friend. If there's anything I hate about the militaria shows are the bottom-feeding scum sharks who offer nothing for treasures while playing the person's ignorance against them. They always shrug their shoulders with a "Hey, he didn't know" concept of absolution. I had a friend sell me an original Colt "Thunderer" for $100. At the time they were going for around  $500 in that condition. I told my friend that he could get a lot more taking this to an antique gun dealer or show. He said he just inherited it with a lot of other stuff and hated having a gun in his house. (apparently he didn't like guns) So he said rather than "deal with all that" he'd gladly take the $100 just to be rid of it. Best deal I ever had but I gave him a chance.

-Dave
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Offline Fingers McGee

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Re: Estimated number of Colt copys manufactured by Confederate gun makers.
« Reply #6 on: January 25, 2014, 12:50:18 PM »
Quote from: st8LineLeatherSmith
add the estimated total of 53 Spiller and Burr models
brings the known estimated total to 8522

Don't know where you got this number for S&Bs; but Albaugh's book 'The Confederate Brass-Framed Colt and Whitney' lists known S&Bs with serial numbers above 1225.  This would lead me to believe that there were well over 1000 made; not 53.
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Offline St8LineLeatherSmith

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Re: Estimated number of Colt copys manufactured by Confederate gun makers.
« Reply #7 on: January 25, 2014, 01:19:38 PM »
I made a really bad typo didnt I  :-[
that number was supposed to be 1500
I have never read the book you mentioned
i got all my info researching the internet
here is where i got my info for the Spiller&Burr
http://www.csarmory.org/spiller/spiller.html
My numbers might need some tweaking. and i will edit my OP so it is a more accurate count.
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Offline Fingers McGee

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Re: Estimated number of Colt copys manufactured by Confederate gun makers.
« Reply #8 on: January 25, 2014, 01:54:02 PM »
I made a really bad typo didnt I  :-[
that number was supposed to be 1500
I have never read the book you mentioned
i got all my info researching the internet
here is where i got my info for the Spiller&Burr
http://www.csarmory.org/spiller/spiller.html
My numbers might need some tweaking. and i will edit my OP so it is a more accurate count.

You're forgiven for the typo  ;D  I've got the Norman book also.  Both are good reads
Fingers (Show Me MO smoke) McGee;
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Offline St8LineLeatherSmith

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No matter where ya go there ya are
Society Of Remington Revolver Shooters (SCORRS)
Brother Artisan Master At Large Of TEH BROTHERHOOD OF TEH SUBLYME  & HOLEY ORDER OF TEH SOOT, (SHOTS)
The St8 Line Leathersmith
ChattownLeatherheads

Offline Tsalagidave

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Re: Estimated number of Colt copys manufactured by Confederate gun makers.
« Reply #10 on: January 27, 2014, 11:32:09 AM »
I have been pining away for a Kerr pistol ever since I saw one for the first time as a teen. I always thought that a mounted "Secesh" impression carrying a wrist breaker, Maynard and Kerr would be a crowning moment in this hobby for me.

-Dave
Guns don't kill people; fathers with pretty daughters do.

 

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