'51 Navy Squareback Triggerguards

[Niederlander]

Hello!
    Are there two different sizes of squareback triggerguards on Uberti '51 Navy pistols?  I see mention of early "small" squareback guards, and I have large fingers.  Are the current ones bigger?  Thanks!

[PJ Hardtack]

The square back trigger guard on my 2nd Gen '51 was small, even for my widdle paws. Gloves were entirely out of the question.

[Niederlander]

Yes, I remember handling one years ago, and the guard was too small for my fingers.  I'm wondering if the current ones are larger.  Thanks!

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[Major 2]

Historically speaking ...no the square back was the one size on the first & second model squarebacks.
Around 4200 , 3rd Models there was a small round back.
The larger Round back showed 85,000 and the Loudon Model always had the Larger Round Back ( so ordered and stipulated by His  Majesty's government contract for gloved hands )

Interestingly the 48 Baby Dragoon, Both with the Texas Ranger & Stage Holdup engraved Cyl. had a larger TG opening that the 51 Navy.

What Pietta etall may have replicated might, be two sizes  

[Coffinmaker]

The current Uberti square back offering for the '51 Navy is ..... One size fits all.  Some may find it a bit ... snug.

Coffinmaker

PS:  Have not worked on a Pietta so can't comment.

[Niederlander]

Could someone that has one measure the inner dimension of the squareback triggerguard, top to bottom?  Thanks!

[Sir Charles deMouton-Black]

My Uberti 1851 squareback is year coded [AH]

Inside TG measurements are 1.2inches, front to back & .84inches top to bottom.

[Coffinmaker]

My  Uberti square backs are 14/16 inside, top to bottom.  Also a bit snug to the grip frame.  They bang my middle finger a bit.  Look WAY KOOL though.  Adds lots of style to a '51 Conversion.

Coffinmaker

[Niederlander]

Thanks, gentlemen!  Just out of curiosity, how do the '51 Navy squareback guards compare for size with the Dragoon squareback guards?

[Southpaw]

The Dragoon is a much larger revolver as is the trigger guard........Southpaw

[PJ Hardtack]

Major2

Ahem .... that would be ".... Her Majesty's government ....", Queen Victoria being the reigning monarch at the time.

It is a little known fact that due to the marketing skills of Samuel Colt and the exposure his guns received at the 1851 Crystal Palace Exposition, the British Army and Royal Navy used far more Colt's of all types (but particularly the '51 Navy) than did ever the US military.
It wasn't until the Sepoy Mutiny of 1858 that the .36 Navy fell into disrepute much as did the .38 Colt used by the US Army in the Philippines, for the same reason - lack of stoping power.
It matters little that you inflicted a fatal wound on your attacker if he lives long enough to cleave your skull to the neck with his Tulwar before he dies.

All of a sudden there was interest in the Colt  .44s, but the Brit revolver makers were fast coming out with their 'self-cocking' double action .44s and .45s. Once they started coming on line and the Crimean War was over, Colt couldn't compete and folded his London operation, moving machinery and parts back to Hartford.

That created a nightmare for collectors as US assembled guns were likely to have London-made parts in them.

[Buffalo Creek Law Dog]

Interesting, PJ.

[PJ Hardtack]

I've got several articles in copies of "The American Rifleman" on the history of the US martial and naval Colts. They are full of details on numbers, problems with supply and quality control, anomalies in features, serial numbers, etc. One interesting tidbit:

"These iron strapped Navy-Navy models are also interesting because their guards were not manufactured in Hartford but in Sam Colt's London factory."
Hartford was geared to produce the brass grip frames.

The number of '51 Navy models purchased by the USN were small compared to purchases by the Royal Navy:

"Odd though it may seem at first glance, The British navy bought four times as many Model 1851 Navy revolvers as the US Navy did during the 1850s. Great Britain purchased 9,500 Colt Navy's from Colt's London representatives for the Royal Navy in five lots between Mar. 08 and Aug. 14, 1854, according to R.Q. Sutherland and R.L. Wilson in "The Book of Colt Firearms." Thousands were earmarked specifically for the RN Black Sea and Baltic fleets during the Crimean War.

During the entire period 1852-59, by contrast, the USN bought only 2,650 Colt Navy's. The answer lies, of course, in the fact that Britain was engaged in the Crimean War in 1854 while the US Civil War did not come along until and stimulate Colt sales until 1861."

One of the first USN purchases of "50 plated '51 Navy's plus 25 larger Colts of Army calibre and apparently 25 Model 1849 Colt Pocket Model revolvers in .31 calibre was for Commodore Perry's 1852 'gun boat diplomacy' trip to Japan. The US wanted to make the best possible impression on the Emperor.

If you google 'HMS Warrior', you'll see a restored/preserved British warship with racks of RN Colt Navy's.

The USN also used R-M conversions of their '51-'61 Navy models well into the cartridge era, throughout the entire 'Indian War' period, declining to adopt the '73 SAA after failing the initial Naval Ordnance tests, as was the S&W American despite the fact that USN liked the simultaneous extraction feature.

[Drydock]

Here's an original 1st variation squareback, just for lookin' at. 

http://www.antiquearmsinc.com/1851-colt-navy-squareback.htm