NRA on the Wane?

[Sir Charles deMouton-Black]

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I stumbled onto this article in the ECONOMIST;

http://www.economist.com/blogs/democracyinamerica/2012/04/guns-america

The biggest indicators according to the writer is that gun ownwership has suffered from
1. greater urbanization, and
2. The NRA hasn't been able to spread interest in firearms out of the white male demographic

Why they fix on the NRA when it is only a part of the firearm lobbying community

[Camille Eonich]

They probably fix on the NRA because they are the largest and the richest.  If NRA membership is declining it probably due to their extremism and to their fund raising tactics.  They called me recently and wanted me to join but refused to hand over their privacy policy until after I paid a membership fee.   Stump is a member and gets the rifleman and the only part that I can read is the reviews and the armed citizen.  The articles in there are too extreme and come off sounding very absurd and very the sky is falling Chicken Littleish in my opinion.

Then there's the whole thing about shipping you items that you didn't order or request in any way and then trying to demand that you pay for those items.  Poor use of supporters money if you ask me.  On top of all of that they got to where they were calling the house two or three times a day at all hours of the day.  How many times does it take them to figure out that Stump isn't here during the day, he has a job outside the home?  I finally had to tell them, then they started calling after 5.  he finally told them to quit calling.

[Old Doc]

They probably fix on the NRA because they are the largest and the richest.  If NRA membership is declining it probably due to their extremism and to their fund raising tactics.  They called me recently and wanted me to join but refused to hand over their privacy policy until after I paid a membership fee.   Stump is a member and gets the rifleman and the only part that I can read is the reviews and the armed citizen.  The articles in there are too extreme and come off sounding very absurd and very the sky is falling Chicken Littleish in my opinion.

Then there's the whole thing about shipping you items that you didn't order or request in any way and then trying to demand that you pay for those items.  Poor use of supporters money if you ask me.  On top of all of that they got to where they were calling the house two or three times a day at all hours of the day.  How many times does it take them to figure out that Stump isn't here during the day, he has a job outside the home?  I finally had to tell them, then they started calling after 5.  he finally told them to quit calling.

Not sure about your issues. I have been a member of the NRA for many decades. They call once in a while and we have a nice chat. They have never sent me any unsolicited merchandise. Were it not for the efforts of the NRA, cowboy action shooters would be using airsoft pistols. If you think that is extreme and that the sky is not capable of falling, see what happens if the current POTUS is given the opportunity to appoint a few more supreme court judges.

[Camille Eonich]

I'm a firm believer in that if you just present the truth you come out sounding a whole lot more believable than if you exaggerate it.  IMO the NRA tends to over exaggerate things which is a huge turn off for many people.


You may not feel that way and that's fine but I'm not alone in my opinion and if they would moderate themselves a little more they would gain more support and there are ways to support our rights other than the NRA.  My lack of monetary support for them in no way means that I don't appreciate what they do and that I don't recognize what they do but they could do it without appearing so loony to so many people.


And what's the deal with them not providing their privacy policy until after you have paid for membership?  Doesn't that kind of make the entire policy useless?

[River City John]

I was sent a DVD unsolicited where in the fine print they state you are under no obligation to pay nor return the material. Even the Postal Service says that you're under no obligation when sent unsolicited materials.
To date I've received three "Amount Due" notices that look real official and that hint that I'm somehow delinquent in my obligations.

Quite frankly, I've had it. It's to the point that I could care less about the NRA because of these tactics, and I'm a Life Member.

I know no matter what media is used to contact me, whether by mail or telemarketing, that any message or intent is nothing more than trying to put their hands into my pocket. I'm tired of feeling that I'm just a mark to them.

They would save thousands if they'd just stop wasting funds on marketing me. I particularly resent that they have sold my name to third parties to market me and claiming it's associated with, or endorsed by, the NRA. 

RCJ

[RickB]

A few years ago they started sending me junk mail. I called them and told them to quit and they apologized and the mailings stopped.  You just have to communicate with them.  They can't read your mind. 

As for them being extreme I say bull. They have been fact checked by numerous organizations and have been proven to be more factual than any of the other organizations especially those who oppose the NRA like Handgun Control,  the Million Mom group and the Violence Policy Center. They are even more accurate than the bull squat coming out of the anti -gun government.

If it wasn't for the NRA CASE/WAS would not exist.  Private gun ownership would be a thing of the past.

[bowiemaker]

I too got the unsolicited DVD with demands that I pay for it or return it. I will do neither. That has me ready to cancel my membership.

[Stu Kettle]

I continue to send my yearly membership fee because I appreciate the work the do on my behalf. When they call I ask them to please not spend so much of the money I send them soliciting me for more of it. I tolerate the extremism because I think it probably does http://www.pixelofink.com/help them generate more money, much of which they spend in defense of my rights. Right, by the way, that I believe are threatened, and that I believe we would no longer have without the efforts of the NRA.

[Gen Lew Wallace]

I stumbled onto this article in the ECONOMIST;

http://www.economist.com/blogs/democracyinamerica/2012/04/guns-america

The biggest indicators according to the writer is that gun ownwership has suffered from
1. greater urbanization, and
2. The NRA hasn't been able to spread interest in firearms out of the white male demographic

Why they fix on the NRA when it is only a part of the firearm lobbying community

Sir, Does the article state that gun ownership has suffered for the various reasons?  I find that curious in relation to the many articles talking about how high gun sales are in all history; not just in a "so many year" period, but all time highs. 

Whatever the arguments are the facts are pretty simple.  NRA has and will always be the premier lobbying group in Washington for gun owners' rights.  They also have a very fine museum. I highly encourage everyone to make a visit. My wife and I have been twice and found something different each time.  And while I, too, have received a few phone calls and unsolicited junk mail from them over the years, I am still a proud life member and that will not change.  I worry a little more about some of the newer groups popping up with a hint of extremism to their motives.  Common sense is all too often overlooked in the 21st century.

[Ranch 13]

I stumbled onto this article in the ECONOMIST;

http://www.economist.com/blogs/democracyinamerica/2012/04/guns-america

The biggest indicators according to the writer is that gun ownwership has suffered from
1. greater urbanization, and
2. The NRA hasn't been able to spread interest in firearms out of the white male demographic

Why they fix on the NRA when it is only a part of the firearm lobbying community

 Why do they fixate on the NRA?
 Well the NRA is not only the lead lobbying outfit around the country, the also provide lawenforcement training, military training, self defense training.
 It's thru their efforts the concealed weapons laws have changed drastically.
 The specifically tailor shooting programs of all types to women and children.
 They were the principle backers and early founders of the hunter safety program.
 They are the chief backers and originators of the Eddie Eagle, find a gun tell an adult,the 4-H shooting sports and appleseed projects.
 They are the only "gun" group that sanctions and finds sponsor's for local,state,regional and national tournament and shoots in just about every venue of shooting sports there is.
 While they may get a bit obnoxious about the calls and letters soliciting for money, they also never send out the absolute ignorant emails about how if you don't join the NAG Obama and co are going to sign the UN treaty banning private ownership of firearms... (Comeon people read the constitution.....)
 Anybody here ever won a rifle or handgun at a friends of the GOA banquet?
 How about anybody ever seen a shooting range built or improoved from a NAG grant...
 You stack all that together and they are the group ,that those that will take away not only the 2nd ammendment but the 1st and the rest thru 10, are most afraid off.
 The NRA has been here since the 1870's, it's record is clear.
 

[Shotgun Franklin]

And if you really want to change some things that the NRA does then get active.
If they had more active members then it wouldn't be a handful of guys doing all their business including everything from showing up at a protest to teaching. The more active we get the less money they need to beg.

[RickB]

The NRA is the oldest civil rights organization in the world.  I'm proud to be a member. 

[joec]

Actually more guns purchased, more CCW permits issued and more states relaxing their gun laws over the last three years than perhaps the last 25 years. Now as to the NRA, I've been a life time member (birthday gift from grandfather) and 65 now. I hadn't heard a word from them until 3 years ago when all of a sudden I started receiving the American Rifleman again after years of not. Constant calls for surveys from them as well as junk mail asking to give to this or that. If I could resign I would flat and simple I'm not impressed just another get rich scheme to me with them raking it in.

[St. George]

Back in the '70's - during the era when Dodd was espousing the idea that 'Handguns Are Evil' - the NRA was ready to give them up, if only they could keep long guns.

Then, some wise soul told them that once the camel's nose is in the tent...

Following 'that' - they decided to push Raton - a place that pretty much no one was interested in visiting in the first place, but they managed to make it even more difficult.

They relocated from their Washington Headquarters - imposing, and so  so conveniently placed for lobbying - and anyone with half a lick of sense knows that you don't give up ground - especially when that ground was so beneficial to you in the past, so it 'looked' like a retreat.

The 'jack-booted thugs' comment did them zero amount of good - regardless of the context.

As a magazine - the 'American Rifleman' offers me nothing - I don't like plastic in weapons, already know how to hunt and don't enjoy the hyping of new products, like the writer's shilling for the manufacturer - just like they do in all other gun magazines - I expected better from the NRA's house organ.

It's true that America's gotten more urbanized - but city kids do want to learn to hunt and shoot - the biggest problems the NRA faces are the 'perceptions' folks have of them all being rabid survivalists and separatists, because that's the public's idea of them, due in large part to the media.

When I was a young Officer, on the weekends, you could find the Old Man and the Staff and pretty much every Company-Grade not pulling OD out at the Rod and Gun Club or the Trap Range - you'd see a lot of older EM, too - and everyone took pride in marksmanship and competition.

Today, there's none of that, and they seem to pride themselves on a more 'evolved' sense of who they are.

Someplace along the line, we need to establish that the term 'gun nut' isn't derogatory or dangerous, and then, maybe folks will re-embrace the Shooting Sports, and the NRA can serve them better.

Vaya,

Scouts Out!

[litl rooster]

I don't know who has the most pathetic begging tactics, NRA or DucksUnlimited.. neither one need my money

[Shotgun Franklin]

OK, let's start our own Gun Rights group with Lobbyists, Legal Aid and Government Contacts. Who here is willing to throw in the first $1000. Opps forgot, we’re not allowed to ask for money. So much for that.

[Will Ketchum]

I am an Endowment Life Member and have been active on the Madison Friends of the NRA, one of the oldest such group in the Nation.

As Shotgun Franklin mentioned if you don't like what they do become active.  If you are a voting member, VOTE for the NRA leadership.  Attend the NRA convention and make your opinions known.  Don't just bitch on the Internet.  Just like being a citizen and not voting.  If you don't exercise your right to vote then you can't complain about  the direction things are going.  If you don't like the content of the magazine write and tell them what you would like.

Our country is heading in the wrong direction and we need strong organizations to help us get what is needed to get us back on course.

We cannot afford to fight amongst ourselves.

Will Ketchum

[Camille Eonich]

They missed on the first step when I asked what their privacy policy was and they told me that they couldn't tell me that until I joined.  I informed them that I didn't give me personal information or join any group without knowing the privacy policy in advance.

Have they changed that?  I don't know they won't tell me unless I am a member.


BTW, I'm not just bitching on the internet.  Everything that I have said here HAS been said to them.  In addition I always check to see what charities spend their money on before I donate.

[Gen Lew Wallace]

Well said Bro Will.  I do exercise my life member vote and try to keep up on current events.  I personally feel that the NRA has become so large that it suffers somewhat from the bloated syndrome.  Hence the permanent executive vice presidents and the rotating presidents that go to other executive positions.  I don't like that, but it won't change now once they have the system in place.  Kind of like the U.S. government system. 

[Deadeye Don]

I encourage people who have so many complaints about the NRA that you do not join to start their own 2nd ammendment/shooting group. Once you become as effective as the NRA let me know and I will join your group.

[Camille Eonich]

I encourage people who have so many complaints about the NRA that you do not join to start their own 2nd ammendment/shooting group. Once you become as effective as the NRA let me know and I will join your group.

No group is ever so effective that it can't become more effective.  Maybe some of the members should take into consideration some of the criticisms and bring them to the attention of the powers that be so that more people feel more comfortable backing them.  That would be a much more constructive way to address the situation rather than shrugging off valid concerns that people have about the organization.


It's also really hard to get behind any organization monetarily when a person feels that they are being wasteful with contributions.  It's not just enough to say that they are the most effective.  It's my hard earned money they want and I need to see that they aren't taking it for granted.

[GunClick Rick]

Just go to Vegas and you can see millions of voters pi$$ed off about paying taxes~ I have to agree with Camille here if the NRA was more dilegent alot of this crap would never gottin on someones desk.I am very proud to have them and i am not a member yet,still sittin on the fence but leaning in the right direction,i keep my donations local so i can ring necks when needed

[Old Doc]

It's also really hard to get behind any organization monetarily when a person feels that they are being wasteful with contributions.  It's not just enough to say that they are the most effective.  It's my hard earned money they want and I need to see that they aren't taking it for granted.

I'm not sure that you have provided any evidence of them wasting money. Nothing surprising in their using some of their donations and dues to obtain even more money by mail and phone solicitations. Do you have any idea how much money it takes to combat the media and liberal politicians who are using your tax money to attack your gun rights. Do you have any concept of how much money the NRA spent winning victory for you and me on the Supreme Court Heller decision. I'm proud to say that some of that money was mine but apparently none of it was yours.

Back in January, I was at the SHOT show in Vegas and came across the ATF booth, there was this big shot ATF official surrounded by bodyguards with wires hanging out of their ears. You're paying those guys salaries and you don't get a choice. Later in the week, I was at a gunshow and recognized the Executive Director of the NRA walking the aisles, all by himself. No entourage, no bodyguards, no evidence of a waiting limo. Quite a contrast with the ATF official. I introduced myself and expressed my appreciation for all that he and the organization do for gun owners. He could not have been more gracious.

In my book, anyone who has any stake in the personal ownership and use of firearms and does not support the NRA is getting a free ride. As for the issue of the Privacy Policy, hard to understand the alleged secrecy. A Google search would have taken you to the NRA website. It's there in black and white.

[Will Ketchum]

I'm not sure that you have provided any evidence of them wasting money. Nothing surprising in their using some of their donations and dues to obtain even more money by mail and phone solicitations. Do you have any idea how much money it takes to combat the media and liberal politicians who are using your tax money to attack your gun rights. Do you have any concept of how much money the NRA spent winning victory for you and me on the Supreme Court Heller decision. I'm proud to say that some of that money was mine but apparently none of it was yours.

Back in January, I was at the SHOT show in Vegas and came across the ATF booth, there was this big shot ATF official surrounded by bodyguards with wires hanging out of their ears. You're paying those guys salaries and you don't get a choice. Later in the week, I was at a gunshow and recognized the Executive Director of the NRA walking the aisles, all by himself. No entourage, no bodyguards, no evidence of a waiting limo. Quite a contrast with the ATF official. I introduced myself and expressed my appreciation for all that he and the organization do for gun owners. He could not have been more gracious.

In my book, anyone who has any stake in the personal ownership and use of firearms and does not support the NRA is getting a free ride. As for the issue of the Privacy Policy, hard to understand the alleged secrecy. A Google search would have taken you to the NRA website. It's there in black and white.

Well said Old Friend

Will Ketchum

[RickB]

To those <snip> about the NRA but not members. You are letting others fight your fight for you.

The NRA has only it's 4 million members to help support it against the liberals in government who have unlimited tax money to use to take away our right to keep and bare arms. They say that their is over 60 million gun owners in America yet only 4 million are doing anything about keeping the federal government from doing away with the 2nd Amendment.

I know that some who own guns are themselves gun control supporters. I've talked with them and they think that the sport they favor will never see their guns banned because they aren't "assault weapons", but they are ignorant to the facts. The likes of Chuck Schumer, Diane Finestien, Harry Reid and hundreds of others are working under the table to get the 2nd Amendment turned into a memory. The gun owners who support assault weapon bans and more gun control are our worst enemies. They don't understand that once the "bad" guns are made illegal then the next thing will be their chosen models and calibers.

I've seen some pretty petty nitpicking on what the NRA does by some who obviously don't have a membership. Fine. Don't join. Soon we'll be as bad off as Canada, Australia and the UK. In Australia and the UK they passed total bans on handguns and many long guns. Crime went up 400 % after the bans took effect. Criminals, by their very nature, don't obey the laws.

You can sit on the sidelines if you want and gripe about the only organization that has the power and ability to do something to hold off the erosion of our rights. Complain about the petty things that they do that annoy you. I'll be paying them my dues and helping them to protect my rights.
I'm a member of the NRA, Second Amendment Foundations, Citizens Committie for the Right to Keep and Bare Arms, Gun Owners of America and a few local groups. All of them are good, but the only one that has the might to take the fight to the federal government and protect our rights is the NRA.

Rick, you say "I have to agree with Camille here if the NRA was more dilegent alot of this crap would never gottin on someones desk." How do you suppose they would be able to keep laws from getting passed when we have gun owners like those here who won't join and help in the fight to be dilligent and keep that crap from getting to anyone's desk?

The saying goes, either lead, follow or get the hell out of the way. I'm helping them to help me and you all can pound sand it you want to just sit and gripe about those who are doing something. Reminds me of the hippies at the occutard camps wanting something for nothing.