Derringer as a backup for concealed carry?

[RickB]

Sorry. I guess I read the intent as wanting a gun for concealed carry and was asking about the derringer in that role. If we are talking about pre 1900 guns in that role I would have to put forth my gun of choice in that area. I have a S&W 1 1/2 in .32 S&W that I love. It is a 5 shot and would do the deed up close and personal like most backup guns are made for. Or I would recommend a S&W .38 break top or Lemon Squeezer style or H&R would do well.

Why settle for 2 shots when you can have 5?

I've never been too keen on the derringer as anything but a last ditch attempt gun. But that is just my .02 worth.

[ZVP]

 OK I'll give in, naturally a modern semi-auto or 5 shot revolver is better  than a Cobra Derringer.
 I took it as meaning "in the Spirit of the Game" as is most Cowboy Action shooting stuff on this Forum.
 Yet a 2 shot derringer is better than NO Derringer...
  Back in the :Old Days" even General Patton found the Remington double derringer worthy of a role as his nighttime defense choice. He is reported to have had a Ivory Handled .41 by his bedside even during the War.
 I often carry my .38 Cobra when out airgunning, 2 quick shots of .38 Special is plenty good medicine for big farm Dogs and other "Pests" and I would NOT feel too badly undergunned should I need the Cobra for serious Social work as it's a good caliber and easy to carry in a back pocket etc.
 I have the Long Barrel option and that gives 3 1/4" of good barrel to accelerate the 158 gr slugs!
 This is the forum of the old west and it's common to discuss the old guns and fantasize about how theyd apply today. A double barrel derringer has worked in the past and I'm sure it would today! Truthfully a chopped .45 commander is the best!
 It's just a forum discussion and nothing to get mad overthough OK?
 ZVP

[Ten Wolves Fiveshooter]

Howdy ZVP

    I think your question was an honest one, and I understand what you're saying, but when you ask for opinions, some times opinions come with attitudes, it's just the nature of things and man, just remember all these reply's were meant to help you not come down on you, although sometimes it can sound that way, owning a derringer is a matter of taste, I have a friend that is a western buff, and is also a judge, he carries a derringer in 45 long colt, and loves it, as to this day he hasn't ever had to use it, but he says it just feels good knowing it's in his pocket.

       Regards

     tEN wOLVES

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[ZVP]

Ten Wolves,
 Thanks for your honest and gentlemanly reply! I feel a lot better reading that.
 ZVP

[Marshal Deadwood]

Smith and Wesson model 637 ?

How 'much' advanage over the shorter barrel would the 2 1/2 inch give one ?

Since both are a very very close quarter deal,,,and the 1 7/8 barrel outta do as good,,and even more concealable.  Was considering one'a these to replace MY derringer.

Never ever,,EVER wanna use it. In todays world though, you don't have to be in bad places to find bad men.

MD

[RickB]

I don't see why ZVP is getting a little out of joint on the topic. The thread stared by Smoke Johnson was asking about using a Derringer as a backup gun. That is what some of us were answering. At least that is what I was answering. My posts had nothing to do with what ZVP posted.

[ZVP]

 Sorry if it sounded like I  am out of joint, I am not.
 I just read the post differently than others did.
 No problem, lets go on talking Cowboy Action Shooting anf Guns!
 ZVP

[Old Doc]

I'm still not clear on the premise of the question. We seem to be confusing real life with fantasy. When most people consider a gun for "back-up concealed carry" the issue is usually, what is the best compromise between concealibility and caliber, in a gun I might have to use to save my life or the lives of others, not what is the best small gun to carry while pretending to be Wyatt Earp .

[ZVP]

 No problem I'lll try to explain...
This is a CAS forum and in CAS we shoot real guns. Since I already have a Ruher Vaquero and a Remington Revolver I carry a Cobra .38 derringer for side matches.
 The string is simple real life vs CAS.
 The question is that since I already own the Cobra is it viable even today as a Self Defense Carry gun?
 The Scnerio; I am out in the woods on a fishing trip, is it viable to have the derringer along also, secreted away somewhere on my person. Many places in the woods I go armed with the Ruger Vaquero why not use my other CAS gun also?
 A  Mule Ear 12 ga makes a fine home defense gun.
 It's like if I carryed a Glock and a Ruger LCP backup in todays guns.
 Yes there are higher capacity, bigger bore or faster shooting guns today but they aren't the topic of a CAS forum, the old ones are and they're pretty good today as they were in  the 1800's!
 Just a question and I think it got turned into a S&W vs a 2 shot derringer question. Cas and the guns for it are a blast to shoot! I have had more fun with my Single Actions than I did with my .45ACP!
 Hope this question is all straightened out now.
 ZVP

[RickB]

I guess the question of what was intended should be asked of the originator of the thread. And it is interesting that he hasn't posted again since bringing up the topic. LOL

Hope we didn't scare him away with all of our assumptions. 

[ZVP]

 Well we did get some lively discussions out of it and that's the point of the Forum!
 ZVP

[RickB]

True that. 

To point out my comments, I would use my 1911 .45 commander model as backup for my 1911 .45 standard size military model. 

But if we are talking about being period correct i would use my 1880 S&W 1/2 in .32. It's a keeper.

[dogngun]

I have owned several, different makes and calibers, from .22 LR to .45 Colt/.410. If you MUST have one, I'd recommend finding one of the old Davis small frame models in .22 Magnum. They are TINY, and can be easily carried in a shirt pocke, which , IMO, is the only reason to carry one.
The larger calibers are in larger and heavier guns, and for the weight and size you can do much better...a Charter Aems Undercover Lite is around 12 ounces empty, and no longer and not much wider than a larger caliber derringer. Gives you 5 shots of .38 Spl +P and a decent grip. Spend another few bucks and get a pocket holster or an ISP...

In the big calibers, I'd recommend the .38 Spl only. The .45 Colt is really large and heavy, and the round does not perform well at all from the short barrel...and the .410 from that same barrel is a joke. The quality large caliber derringers are very expensive, too...I had several American Derringer models, and could have bought a nice used snubbie revolver for what I paid for each of them...and I got very little back when I sold them.

They are neat to play with, but I would be uncomfortable carrying one, even as a BUG, and I have been shooting them off and on for fun for many years.


mark

[PJ Hardtack]

I may be repeating myself, but .... I've got a 'Great Western' Derringer O/U in 'as new' condition chamberd in .38 S&W; arguably one of the better rounds for the type.
For a period hideout gun, it's hard to beat. I've loaded up some BP rds for it, but haven't fired any as yet.

[Shotgun Franklin]

If we're talking about a CAS character carrying a Derringer as part of the costume then sure why not?
If we're talking about needing a backup to your regular concealed gun then don't bother. In 34 years of Law Enforcement I've never even heard of a civilian needing a backup in an actual gunfight. I'd think you have a better chance of being struck by lightening.

[ZVP]

 What a COOL Derringer!
 The first one I have ever heard of in .38 S&W, most are .38 Special caliber. My Cobra is .38 Special and with full power loads it can be abit of a handfull. A friend lloaded some low-velocity 90 gr loads for me and with those it's a fun plinker!
  By Back-Up you are referring to use for self defense, the caliber is a little anemic but at very close range it would likely stop agression. The .38 Special at the same range definately would have more power and be a better fight stopper. Either way, the gun is difficult to shoot and the limited capacity makes good shot placement necessary. Pratice is a necessity.
 As a CAS Pocket Gun, this Derringer is perfect!
 ZVP

[PJ Hardtack]

The original Remington O/U Derringer in .41 RF was a feared weapon; same for the Colt single shots and Sharps four barrel pistols.

Why? Their outside lubricated bullets packed all manner of foreign matter (lint, tobacco, etc.) that would be embedded in an assailant's body along with fibres from his clothing. In the era, that amounted to a slow, lingering death.
Producing ANY gun that your attacker does not know you have gives you an edge. No one likes the idea of being shot, even with a .22 short.

[RickB]

True PJ. I wouldn't want to be shot with a pellet gun even.

I carry a North American Arms mini revolver that holds 5 22 long rifle bullets. I put it in my watch pocket of my jeans when I am out and about. It is tiny but it is fierce. It's a good backup to my 1911 or my USP compact.

I hear that North American Arms is thinking of making these .22s with a break top like the S&W 1 1/2s. I hope they do. I want one.

[PJ Hardtack]

One of the coolest "CCW" guns I own is an ERMA-made knock off of the Walther PPK in .22 LR. Only gun I ever bought because I thought it was 'cute' and because of the first three digits of the serial # - 005XXX   ;>)

I wanted 007XXX, but the dealer had snapped it up for himself. Only problem is that after shooting it, you have a craving for a drive in an Aston Martin DB5 with a long cool blond and pitcher of Vodka Martinis - shaken and not stirred .....

[RickB]

I bought a little .22 Walther clone a long time back. It is a great shooter and fun to have. But it never scratched my Walther itch. I went out and found a Walther PPK/S that was made in Germany. It was before S&W started making them here for Walther. I love how it shoots and it does make me want to say "Bond, James Bond" when I pull it out of my holster. Problem is, it was an original German Walther so I retired it to my gun safe and replaced it with a Stainless PPK/S a few years back. Not quite the blue one like 007 carried but it suits my itch. It's odd though, that it is just a little bit different dimensionally than my original PPK/S. Still takes the same mags and that, but it won't fit some of the holsters that the old one fits. So the new S&W PPK/S's are just a little bigger than the originals are.